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Old 03-30-2023, 09:32 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,770 posts, read 24,277,952 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mink57 View Post
Saying something that isn't the truth doesn't necessarily mean it's a lie.
Never mind.
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Old 03-30-2023, 10:14 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,770 posts, read 24,277,952 times
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Originally Posted by ElijahAstin View Post
Your insistence on clinging tightly to your ego and cbsplaining topics you know nothing about never ceases to amaze me.
You are not alone
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Old 04-02-2023, 06:35 AM
 
15,952 posts, read 7,015,660 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tzaphkiel View Post
and what for you is the difference between "clarification" and "interpretation" of a religious text?
isn't "clarifying" what a text or passage says the same as "interpreting" what it says?
The rich Islamic tradition of interpretation and clarification of the Quran.

Quote:
The Islamic tradition has produced a rich and sophisticated exegetical literature. There is, first, Qurʾānic exegesis in the narrow sense, consisting of dedicated commentaries that treat the text of scripture in its canonical order, either verse by verse or section by section. Such a work is referred to as a tafsīr, which is also the word for the activity of scriptural interpretation as such. Second, Qurʾānic verses and their interpretation also feature in other literary genres, such as legal and theological treatises, whose authors will often justify their claims by recourse to proof texts from scripture. This section will limit itself to Qurʾānic exegesis in the first and narrow sense.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Quran/Basic-ideas
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Old 04-02-2023, 08:09 AM
 
Location: NMB, SC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tzaphkiel View Post
and what for you is the difference between "clarification" and "interpretation" of a religious text?
isn't "clarifying" what a text or passage says the same as "interpreting" what it says?
Not quite. Clarifying is making the story more clear. Interpretation is saying what the meaning behind the story is.

Say there is a table of books. I tell you to go get me the book. You ask.."Can you clarify ?" and I say go get me the red book on the top of the pile. I clarified that sentence for you.

Then take parables from the Bible. When you give your opinion of what the parable means that's interpretation.
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Old 04-02-2023, 08:42 AM
 
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Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
Not quite. Clarifying is making the story more clear. Interpretation is saying what the meaning behind the story is.

Say there is a table of books. I tell you to go get me the book. You ask.."Can you clarify ?" and I say go get me the red book on the top of the pile. I clarified that sentence for you.

Then take parables from the Bible. When you give your opinion of what the parable means that's interpretation.
Good way of looking at tge two.
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Old 04-02-2023, 08:59 AM
 
19,014 posts, read 27,574,271 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
Not quite. Clarifying is making the story more clear. Interpretation is saying what the meaning behind the story is.

Say there is a table of books. I tell you to go get me the book. You ask.."Can you clarify ?" and I say go get me the red book on the top of the pile. I clarified that sentence for you.

Then take parables from the Bible. When you give your opinion of what the parable means that's interpretation.



Bingo! Exactly what I am saying.

There is The Word of God. As such, it is final, perfect, and infallible. Correct? Or, it is not the word of god.
Now there is a human. With all of its humane faults. Human has an "opinion" on God's word. Now even an ant has opinion on what Sun does. To add to that, human ate something bad yesterday and has, today, indigestion. Or, some other physical imbalance or just a bad morning, definitely skewing his "opinion" for the moment. So what is the value of his interpretation?

And then, you have another human, of the same of equal rank, having HIS opinion on the god's word.

And so on.

And then, you have us, the grey mass, bombarded from each and every direction with those opinions, each one claiming to be THE HOLY TRUTH. And we jump from opinion to opinion to opinion, incapable of developing the direct relationship with god itself, distracted by "interpretations".

God gave us its Word
Devil gave us that Word interpretations.
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Old 04-02-2023, 09:03 AM
 
22,152 posts, read 19,206,964 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
Not quite. Clarifying is making the story more clear. Interpretation is saying what the meaning behind the story is. Say there is a table of books. I tell you to go get me the book. You ask.."Can you clarify ?" and I say go get me the red book on the top of the pile. I clarified that sentence for you. Then take parables from the Bible. When you give your opinion of what the parable means that's interpretation.
with regards to a religious text or passage, there is no difference between "making the story more clear" and "saying what the meaning behind the story is." what the words say and what the words mean are both interpretations.

which are amplified, colored, multiplied, and subject to distortion and agenda,even moreso due to multiple and varying translations.
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Old 04-02-2023, 09:07 AM
 
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I'll add something.
There is a great masterpiece, book Master and Margarita by Bulgakov. Two story lines developing in parallel. One of them being the last days of Yeshua GaNotsri, known as Jesus. His judgement by Pilat and crucifixion.

There is a moment the Yeshua story.. he was followed by a man, called Levi (later known as Apostle Mathew) who writes down, whatever Yeshua says, on some old parchment.

During his encounter with Pilat, Yeshua says - There is a man, that follows me everywhere and writes down what I say. I, once, glanced at what he writes - AND IT IS ALL WRONG, I NEVER SAID THAT.

And that is the truth about interpretations.

So, either you stick to the Word of God or, you stick to the word of men, aka interpretations.
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Old 04-02-2023, 09:09 AM
 
19,014 posts, read 27,574,271 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tzaphkiel View Post
with regards to a religious text or passage, there is no difference between "making the story more clear" and "saying what the meaning behind the story is." what the words say and what the words mean are both interpretations.

which are amplified, colored, multiplied, and subject to distortion and agenda,even moreso due to multiple and varying translations.



Correct.



Everyone saw how the ray of light goes through a prism and fans into many colored tones. They are all that ray of light. yet, they are all different.
So is The Word of god, as single ray of light, and all the colorful opinions of HUMANS as interpretations.
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Old 04-10-2023, 03:32 PM
 
15,952 posts, read 7,015,660 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
I read this somewhere and it fits in nicely with what you stated (bolded above).

"God's message is buried under man's words"
I missed this the first time. Yes. Those within the religion and culture approach the text with reverence and preserve it carefully, lest it gets lost in translation.
Most traditions such Hinduism, Islam, and I think Judaism preserve the original language and learn to recite the text in the original language, and by repetition the meaning gets absorbed by the properly cultivated mind.
There are research scholars who also study the texts and have the mature mind and reverence for texts to interpret it in English, German etc.
And then there are “evil-doers” who read those same texts, choose them carefully, and interpret them in such a way as to inflame hate and plant discord.
Texts remain texts. Who interprets and with what purpose should always be considered carefully.
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