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It is also insulting to religious people themselves because it suggests that they are moral not because the have empathy, compassion, kindness, selflessness or general good character, but only because they fear god's wrath and punishment.
Yes, there is that.
And I am a true crime junkie. I assure you, lots of religious people commit crimes, too.
As a general rule, 'any organized religion' also benefits the secular society, in many ways.
Its good for a secular society if people do not kill, steal, covet, lust, etc.
In fact, i think this was probably the main reason organized religion got its start, it was an attempt to better control the people, so a prosperous society could thrive.
Yes, religion organizes a society with laws so it doesn’t destroy itself, preserves the environment so it can continue sustain itself. It also inspires a personal relationship with the Divinity, which expresses itself in joy of worship, art, song and dance. It inspires mythologies through with what cannot be completely expressed with words, get expressed through imagination and metaphors. Religion is multi dimensional.
It is also insulting to religious people themselves because it suggests that they are moral not because they have empathy, compassion, kindness, selflessness or general good character, but only because they fear god's wrath and punishment.
We should be asking why it has taken over two millennia for that obvious logic to be recognized, especially with the clear and unambiguous example of Jesus Christ!!!
It is also insulting to religious people themselves because it suggests that they are moral not because the have empathy, compassion, kindness, selflessness or general good character, but only because they fear god's wrath and punishment.
Who exactly is suggesting this? A passive aggressive voice?
Nobody, believer or not, would say this. They will only see the goodness in the act. And even if the fear of god keeps one on the straight and narrow what is wrong with that. He will reap the rewards, in this world and the next. It is a win win.
It is also insulting to religious people themselves because it suggests that they are moral not because the have empathy, compassion, kindness, selflessness or general good character, but only because they fear god's wrath and punishment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
We should be asking why it has taken over two millennia for that obvious logic to be recognized, especially with the clear and unambiguous example of Jesus Christ!!!
The problem with that "logic" to begin with...is that the determination of what is "moral" is very subjective.
In fact...there are things I know that many think is not only moral, but should be a "right" to do...that I consider to be the most reprehensible, evil thing in the history of humankind.
So...the idea fails on its face.
Also...many people do obey and/or comply with laws/edicts/regulations/ordinances, etc, simply because they want to avoid the potential ramifications.
Watch vehicles that were all traveling on the highway 15 mph over the limit...and have a Highway Patrol car become visible. Watch them all slow down...even though they were all obviously cool with what they were doing wrong. Guess why they slowed down?
I don't have the energy or will to say that religion does any good, but I know from experience that spirituality sure does good, at least for me. But there is nothing to compel me to say why spirituality is so good. It's personal and unique, and not up for debate or interpretation, which contrasts to the idiocy of arguing over religion.
I don't have the energy or will to say that religion does any good, but I know from experience that spirituality sure does good, at least for me. But there is nothing to compel me to say why spirituality is so good. It's personal and unique, and not up for debate or interpretation, which contrasts to the idiocy of arguing over religion.
Spirituality is indeed personal, not up for debate, or interpretation. Well said and I agree.
Argument over religion is idiocy, yes.
Does your spirituality have a source, a structure?
Does your spirituality have a source, a structure?
Hard to say. I try not to put it too far under the microscope. By spending less time on trying to describe it, there's more time spent on picking up what's there. Even if it's beyond words and description, it's well within grasp of recognizing and acknowledging. Some matters aren't conducive to words, and it's great to recognize that. Many will never find that because they're too busy trying to force nature into fitting human ways and concepts.
religion is like lenses. It can help you see better. It can also burn the crap out of us with its "truth" too. It can be "dirty" or made improperly, thus distorting our reality.
The "lens" is not bad or good per say. How people use it, teach to it, or how we self reflect on our lens can be un reliable.
If our lens is focusing on "things we can't put into words", we need to start calibration procedures. If we use our lense to "only look here and no where else", that is deceitful more often than not.
Who exactly is suggesting this? A passive aggressive voice?
Nobody, believer or not, would say this.
It is the logical conclusion of the argument. Because religion does not create morality, it adopts the current morality of that time. That is why the US does not follow the OT laws.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008
They will only see the goodness in the act. And even if the fear of god keeps one on the straight and narrow what is wrong with that. He will reap the rewards, in this world and the next. It is a win win.
Because sometimes the fear of god does not keep one on the straight and narrow.
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