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While I understand the urge to keep politics out of the (stated its not L/R) its hard to not correlate tolerance for all of this nonsense and the presence of a uber-liberal city government. SF and Seattle got EXACTLY what they voted for. And Morgantown is too. And did Los Angeles.
But here's the thing. Once businesses and people what do you do? Well you pass a user fee (which I actually don't mind too much) and start annexing people who don't want to be annexed. Or if you're from California you move to Texas and then of course vote for politicians who will make Texas look like California, which defies all logic.
I think it was pretty clear from the video that it was all the local gov't's fault due to their liberal policies. I was just pointing out it wasn't put out by some uber right outlet and was in no way political. It was a very fair piece. If you saw it the residents were saying it's fixable too. Get these people off council and start enforcing the law. The problem began when even the minor infractions started being ignored. Just like here. At least Seattle has more police on the streets. We don't even get that.
Gary's Comics is in the paper today in the local section. The owner speaks about why he is leaving downtown after 17 years. He mentions the financial issues. Also why the building is not painted (this may interest CT )
FINALLY a business owner had the guts to talk about the transients and junkies. He is making the same points I made here. He also mentions some have homes and are troublemakers.
Loring said the environment became “really bad” downtown, and at his location he dealt with a lot of the “bums ”and “junkies” in and around The Friendship House —part of Milan Puskar Health Right. “It’s not a homeless problem downtown,”he said. “You don’t have the homeless hanging around. You have junkies, you have thieves, you have people who have income and homes —they’re just downtown to be a nuisance,”Loring said. Although Loring said city police tries to help, there just isn’t enough manpower.
I think it was pretty clear from the video that it was all the local gov't's fault due to their liberal policies. I was just pointing out it wasn't put out by some uber right outlet and was in no way political. It was a very fair piece. If you saw it the residents were saying it's fixable too. Get these people off council and start enforcing the law. The problem began when even the minor infractions started being ignored. Just like here. At least Seattle has more police on the streets. We don't even get that.
Gary's Comics is in the paper today in the local section. The owner speaks about why he is leaving downtown after 17 years. He mentions the financial issues. Also why the building is not painted (this may interest CT )
FINALLY a business owner had the guts to talk about the transients and junkies. He is making the same points I made here. He also mentions some have homes and are troublemakers.
Loring said the environment became “really bad” downtown, and at his location he dealt with a lot of the “bums ”and “junkies” in and around The Friendship House —part of Milan Puskar Health Right. “It’s not a homeless problem downtown,”he said. “You don’t have the homeless hanging around. You have junkies, you have thieves, you have people who have income and homes —they’re just downtown to be a nuisance,”Loring said. Although Loring said city police tries to help, there just isn’t enough manpower.
My point is more this..and is not directed to any of the reasonable people on this board. If you are an uber-liberal person who voted this people in, I don't you to complain about your property being damaged, or voicing concerns about the problems created by the policies that your chosen council put into place. Also don't export the problems though annexation or any other means.
My point is more this..and is not directed to any of the reasonable people on this board. If you are an uber-liberal person who voted this people in, I don't you to complain about your property being damaged, or voicing concerns about the problems created by the policies that your chosen council put into place. Also don't export the problems though annexation or any other means.
I am only going to address politics as it relates to and affects my life here. I am hoping people "get it" about our downtown on some level. I don't blame you if you don't see it every day. I felt like I could be any person interviewed in that video as there are so many eerie similarities to here.
If you share something from Fox News the left won't watch one minute it of it. If you post something from CNN or Huff Post the right will scream "Fake News" and tune out too. Meanwhile the junkies (who don't vote and couldn't care less about politics) are taking over and using the streets as their playground and it's somehow treated like a "silent problem". LOL. It's all so stupid as people are missing REAL news because of the tribalism. Heck, strangely enough the junkies and the 1% kind of run the show over all of us if you think about it deeply enough.
You are right, people get what they deserve in the city by how they vote. Do they see it? Most aren't capable or don't want to IMO. Look at the South Park post I mentioned. The very definition of clueless. Dangerously so. I can't vote in the city but I am greatly affected. Do I or others deserve the result?
At about the 13:20 mark in the video they show this guy named Travis, a musician. Boy, does his type seem familiar. He could easily fit in in Mgtn and I have seen many dudes like him around town. He is really happy and unapologetic; that's why I don't feel the least bit sorry for him. Trust me, there are plenty of educated hipsters in Morgantown who would let this guy couch surf, believe me. I have to wonder if that aspect of it all is part of why this madness is tolerated here.
This is an important thing to consider if anyone wants to move to a small college town like this. The college part isn't in one small corner; it encompasses the whole town and every single one of us in some way. If you are not part of WVU you WILL be in the minority. It's simple math. If you are part of WVU or have ultra liberal views you are golden and will probably love the atmosphere.
I went to WVU in the 80's (also when Gee was President) and I have never met a professor even then that wasn't very liberal. Maybe there are some, but I didn't come across them. Uber or Neo Libs or whatever anyone wants to call them now seem to be the norm in 2019 and even as someone who used to identify as liberal, I just can't relate to what I am seeing now. I am far from alone with these feelings but we are still the minority here.
Even if the professors move to housing developments outside the city into the county as WVU continues to grow, the same problem will arise; a moderate will be shouted down on these issues as WVU is the main employer in this town and their professors and staff will outnumber everyone else as a voting block.
I am only going to address politics as it relates to and affects my life here. I am hoping people "get it" about our downtown on some level. I don't blame you if you don't see it every day. I felt like I could be any person interviewed in that video as there are so many eerie similarities to here.
If you share something from Fox News the left won't watch one minute it of it. If you post something from CNN or Huff Post the right will scream "Fake News" and tune out too. Meanwhile the junkies (who don't vote and couldn't care less about politics) are taking over and using the streets as their playground and it's somehow treated like a "silent problem". LOL. It's all so stupid as people are missing REAL news because of the tribalism. Heck, strangely enough the junkies and the 1% kind of run the show over all of us if you think about it deeply enough.
You are right, people get what they deserve in the city by how they vote. Do they see it? Most aren't capable or don't want to IMO. Look at the South Park post I mentioned. The very definition of clueless. Dangerously so. I can't vote in the city but I am greatly affected. Do I or others deserve the result?
At about the 13:20 mark in the video they show this guy named Travis, a musician. Boy, does his type seem familiar. He could easily fit in in Mgtn and I have seen many dudes like him around town. He is really happy and unapologetic; that's why I don't feel the least bit sorry for him. Trust me, there are plenty of educated hipsters in Morgantown who would let this guy couch surf, believe me. I have to wonder if that aspect of it all is part of why this madness is tolerated here.
This is an important thing to consider if anyone wants to move to a small college town like this. The college part isn't in one small corner; it encompasses the whole town and every single one of us in some way. If you are not part of WVU you WILL be in the minority. It's simple math. If you are part of WVU or have ultra liberal views you are golden and will probably love the atmosphere.
I went to WVU in the 80's (also when Gee was President) and I have never met a professor even then that wasn't very liberal. Maybe there are some, but I didn't come across them. Uber or Neo Libs or whatever anyone wants to call them now seem to be the norm in 2019 and even as someone who used to identify as liberal, I just can't relate to what I am seeing now. I am far from alone with these feelings but we are still the minority here.
Even if the professors move to housing developments outside the city into the county as WVU continues to grow, the same problem will arise; a moderate will be shouted down on these issues as WVU is the main employer in this town and their professors and staff will outnumber everyone else as a voting block.
I agree with everything you've said.
To answer your question, no you don't deserve to the result of these policies.
I went to WVU. I work at WVU. We aren't all super-liberal. Get out of the humanities and liberal arts fields and you'll find professors who aren't uber liberal, but yeah they are outnumbered on the campus as a whole.
One of the issues at the heart of the ideology that allows these problems though is this absurd faith in cultural/moral relativism. It removes all objectivity from what is "OK". This then blurs the standards of what is ok and and what isn't normal behavior. For example doing drugs and crapping in the street. To relativist it "ok" (as much as you can use that term when when objectivity goes out the window), but just different, and coexistence with it isn't an issue. To the rest of us its nonsense.
The one question I'd love to ask of these types though is why they don't like "nice" places or at least why they are willing to live, and in some cases promote "craphole" cities/communities.
But I think public opinion is turning. My pretty liberal office mate is tired of all of this too.
You wouldn't even think the city is large enough (30k pop is nothing) to warrant all these inane policies. I don't see what the problem is with just having as a standard of success a downtown with 80% occupancy or the like and wanting to attract long-term tenants/businesses.
Heck, just brick off High Street and turn into into a pedestrian only area for a couple of blocks if it helps. I'd rather it be 100% student focused instead of half the buildings being empty and new restaurants/bars cycling through constantly, lasting only 1-2 years each time.
Why has the Warner theater sat there for so long? If downtown was actually in-demand, I bet whatever insane price the owners have in mind would make sense.
Did the city or the county buy that hotel towards the Wal-mart to the south? If it was the city and a few million were spent, couldn't they have spent that on buying some of the blight properties downtown (like Warner) and actually cleaning up the area to get more in property value taxes and other revenue down the line (you know, seeking some ROI)? Heck, just offer the vagrants $1000 cash each and a bus ticket to Seattle...
To answer your question, no you don't deserve to the result of these policies.
I went to WVU. I work at WVU. We aren't all super-liberal. Get out of the humanities and liberal arts fields and you'll find professors who aren't uber liberal, but yeah they are outnumbered on the campus as a whole.
One of the issues at the heart of the ideology that allows these problems though is this absurd faith in cultural/moral relativism. It removes all objectivity from what is "OK". This then blurs the standards of what is ok and and what isn't normal behavior. For example doing drugs and crapping in the street. To relativist it "ok" (as much as you can use that term when when objectivity goes out the window), but just different, and coexistence with it isn't an issue. To the rest of us its nonsense.
The one question I'd love to ask of these types though is why they don't like "nice" places or at least why they are willing to live, and in some cases promote "craphole" cities/communities.
But I think public opinion is turning. My pretty liberal office mate is tired of all of this too.
You have described the mentality very well. I would love to ask them to explain themselves too. Sometimes media helps people to think. That is why I am hoping some libs may watch the video and ask themselves the question that was asked in it; "How can this be what we allow? How did the word 'compassion' get twisted into this sickening reality?" They are making things so much worse but they will have to come to that conclusion on their own I guess.
I couldn't sleep last night when I wrote that last post. Due in large part to this: I went to the Dollar Store yesterday to get some chips during the day and this young woman out front was so out of it she almost staggered into me. When I left she was laying in front of the store passed out. Not an unusual sight to see actually. People lay and sleep anywhere downtown.
It wasn't until I got home I started thinking about her again. I remembered I saw her drooling. Not unusual when sleeping, but who knows...was she OD'ing? I had to ask myself if I processed it at the time and just blocked it out as I see so much of this crazy stuff. Coping mechanism, maybe? IDK. I then started remembering about a time a few years ago when someone stopped me as he thought a guy looked dead off High St. He didn't have a cell phone so I called 911. The police came first and couldn't find a pulse on the man. An ambulance came as the guy had OD'd. I hope she is OK but it wouldn't make the paper if she wasn't. I could have walked past someone dying and not even realized it.
This isn't civilized society anymore. I had to ask myself why the rest of us are forced to be a part of this. I couldn't come up with an answer and sleep never came. She was on High St in broad daylight where even traffic going past could see her. Hopefully it was nothing, but who knows anymore.
My coworker left work late last week and tripped over a woman sleeping on the steps outside our office. She nearly faceplanted on the sidewalk. She was mad because she was hurt and yelled at her, "Why are you sleeping here? Go to the Bartlett House!" The lady apologized and it was obvious she was too wasted and Bartlett wouldn't let her in. (these cumulative incidents might very well have factored in to why I walked past the lady in front of the Dollar Store. It's all mind numbing after a while)
Thanks for taking the time to add you see public opinion turning. That's encouraging. I have seen so much I could start a blog. I just scratched the surface with posts here. Many see much worse. If I don't see some progress in a few months that's an idea. At least to vent my frustrations and allow others to do the same. I had to laugh at the "Seattle Looks Like Sh&t" FB page mentioned on the video. That was started by a county employee. LOL I bet our city workers would have a field day with an anonymous blog. Thanks to any here taking the time to read this stuff. Try to put yourself in downtown worker's shoes; it's not a good place to be.
I did see MPD just hired three new officers. If they put them out we could even see improvement by the end of the week. At least they would see the people passed out and deal with it before myself or anyone else does. By next year word could get out among the transients, "The cops in Morgantown are cracking down" and they would go elsewhere. Maybe even get help. They will just find fellow junkies here. It doesn't have to be like this.
You wouldn't even think the city is large enough (30k pop is nothing) to warrant all these inane policies. I don't see what the problem is with just having as a standard of success a downtown with 80% occupancy or the like and wanting to attract long-term tenants/businesses.
Heck, just brick off High Street and turn into into a pedestrian only area for a couple of blocks if it helps. I'd rather it be 100% student focused instead of half the buildings being empty and new restaurants/bars cycling through constantly, lasting only 1-2 years each time.
Why has the Warner theater sat there for so long? If downtown was actually in-demand, I bet whatever insane price the owners have in mind would make sense.
Did the city or the county buy that hotel towards the Wal-mart to the south? If it was the city and a few million were spent, couldn't they have spent that on buying some of the blight properties downtown (like Warner) and actually cleaning up the area to get more in property value taxes and other revenue down the line (you know, seeking some ROI)? Heck, just offer the vagrants $1000 cash each and a bus ticket to Seattle...
You're right. The city is not large to warrant these inane policies. It's what the city council focuses on though. They rarely talk about the real issues effecting the town. Back on the very bottom of post #40 I posted a link from 2017 with the city manager's and COC's comments about panhandling and how it is effecting businesses. Look how many have left since then. If you don't have shoppers you can't pay the bills.
We could block off High St at this point, there are hardly any stores left. This town is too small though and it would cause a traffic nightmare like it does during parades. Right now it seems like half the business are gone and there aren't many students out during the day like in past years. Only evenings. There was hardly anyone around when I mentioned that disturbing incident I had in front of the Dollar General store this week. (BTW, I heard someone did OD the following night right near there. Don't know if they made it as they were taken away by ambulance).
On a positive note, something may be happening though. The MPD started a new TIPS Line on Friday. They also hired 3 new officers this week. It was mentioned during the city council meeting. They are still taking applications for more. Council of course didn't discuss the crime or meth heads. LOL I don't know if they will be patrolling downtown or in the outlying neighborhoods who need it.
Another positive update. (Hopefully) Things are really coming to a head with the downtown situation. A few weeks ago Morgantown AM spent part of 3 shows on the topic. After the guy was bludgeoned with a baseball bat in broad daylight last week on Walnut St a few business owners came to city council last night and it was the hot topic. It wasn't even on the agenda. I haven't had a chance to watch but it's been all over the news today. The topic will be on the next meeting agenda. They have no choice but to at least address it now. Now is the time to send emails or even show up to the meeting for anyone interested. You don't have to live in town to send an email to council about your observations of the problem. Some emails they read during meetings. City Council | Morgantown, WV
Here is an excerpt from the Dominion Post as I know many don't have a subscription. Below that is the WAJR article anyone can read.
MORGANTOWN — A handful of downtown business owners are asking the city for help in dealing with what they see as an epidemic of homelessness, loitering, substance abuse and criminal behavior in the city’s business district.
Much of it, they explained, is emanating from Walnut Street, the home of Health Right’s Friendship House.
During Tuesday’s Morgantown City Council meeting, Jillian Kelly, owner of Retrotique, at 218 Walnut Street, said she’s been in business downtown about seven years, but the things she’s witnessed in the last year or so “are like nothing I’ve seen before.”
“I’m often told by my customers that they don’t feel safe shopping downtown, and I can’t really blame them because I don’t really feel safe in my own shop,” Kelly said. “I’m never there alone.”
Kelly laid out a timeline of events going back a month or so that included instances of harassment, drug use, threats of violence and violence, including an incident earlier this month when a man was beaten with a baseball bat. Stephanie Swain, owner of Hoot and Howl, at 245 Walnut Street, said people would need to witness the daily activity to believe the level and consistency of what goes on.
MORGANTOWN, W.Va. – The Morgantown City Council meeting became a homeless forum Tuesday led by downtown business owners and service providers.
Gary Tannenbaum is the owner of the Blue Moose has operated the business for more than 20 years and loves to be in downtown but he says things are getting out of hand.
Tannenbaum said,”We see people sleeping in the doorways on benches right on the sidewalk, drug deals are going on before my eyes everyday on Walnut Street.”
Other residents complained about antisocial behavior being displayed at all hours of the day. Some said young women are sometimes the harshest targets.
Tannenbaum said,”Last week I witnessed someone being bludgeoned with a baseball bat right before my very eyes in front of Friendship House, that was icing on the cake for me.”
Another positive update. (Hopefully) Things are really coming to a head with the downtown situation. A few weeks ago Morgantown AM spent part of 3 shows on the topic. After the guy was bludgeoned with a baseball bat in broad daylight last week on Walnut St a few business owners came to city council last night and it was the hot topic. It wasn't even on the agenda. I haven't had a chance to watch but it's been all over the news today. The topic will be on the next meeting agenda. They have no choice but to at least address it now. Now is the time to send emails or even show up to the meeting for anyone interested. You don't have to live in town to send an email to council about your observations of the problem. Some emails they read during meetings. City Council | Morgantown, WV
Here is an excerpt from the Dominion Post as I know many don't have a subscription. Below that is the WAJR article anyone can read.
MORGANTOWN — A handful of downtown business owners are asking the city for help in dealing with what they see as an epidemic of homelessness, loitering, substance abuse and criminal behavior in the city’s business district.
Much of it, they explained, is emanating from Walnut Street, the home of Health Right’s Friendship House.
During Tuesday’s Morgantown City Council meeting, Jillian Kelly, owner of Retrotique, at 218 Walnut Street, said she’s been in business downtown about seven years, but the things she’s witnessed in the last year or so “are like nothing I’ve seen before.”
“I’m often told by my customers that they don’t feel safe shopping downtown, and I can’t really blame them because I don’t really feel safe in my own shop,” Kelly said. “I’m never there alone.”
Kelly laid out a timeline of events going back a month or so that included instances of harassment, drug use, threats of violence and violence, including an incident earlier this month when a man was beaten with a baseball bat. Stephanie Swain, owner of Hoot and Howl, at 245 Walnut Street, said people would need to witness the daily activity to believe the level and consistency of what goes on.
MORGANTOWN, W.Va. – The Morgantown City Council meeting became a homeless forum Tuesday led by downtown business owners and service providers.
Gary Tannenbaum is the owner of the Blue Moose has operated the business for more than 20 years and loves to be in downtown but he says things are getting out of hand.
Tannenbaum said,”We see people sleeping in the doorways on benches right on the sidewalk, drug deals are going on before my eyes everyday on Walnut Street.”
Other residents complained about antisocial behavior being displayed at all hours of the day. Some said young women are sometimes the harshest targets.
Tannenbaum said,”Last week I witnessed someone being bludgeoned with a baseball bat right before my very eyes in front of Friendship House, that was icing on the cake for me.”
Good hopefully the problem is resolved. But don't be surprised when the city council tells people to "stop being intolerant of the homeless" and chastises people for complaining about "being inconvenienced by them." Meanwhile they are looking for more territory to prop up their finances while worrying way too much about their latest social cause.
How many of these same or business owners voted this city council into place I wonder?
My last trip through downtown on Monday was very disappointing. So many empty stores and its starting to look like a slum.
You wouldn't even think the city is large enough (30k pop is nothing) to warrant all these inane policies. I don't see what the problem is with just having as a standard of success a downtown with 80% occupancy or the like and wanting to attract long-term tenants/businesses.
Heck, just brick off High Street and turn into into a pedestrian only area for a couple of blocks if it helps. I'd rather it be 100% student focused instead of half the buildings being empty and new restaurants/bars cycling through constantly, lasting only 1-2 years each time.
Why has the Warner theater sat there for so long? If downtown was actually in-demand, I bet whatever insane price the owners have in mind would make sense.
Did the city or the county buy that hotel towards the Wal-mart to the south? If it was the city and a few million were spent, couldn't they have spent that on buying some of the blight properties downtown (like Warner) and actually cleaning up the area to get more in property value taxes and other revenue down the line (you know, seeking some ROI)? Heck, just offer the vagrants $1000 cash each and a bus ticket to Seattle...
The city isn't just the officially stated permanent population of 32,000. It is actually 55,000 (condensed into just 10 square miles) most of the year with tens of thousands more clustered all around it, and growing. There are two closely related problems faced by the city proper. The first is the bunch of clueless academics running city government who rely on ideals for every decision with total disregard for facts. Those policies have pushed all development outside city limits and insured stagnation inside them. The second is the fact that almost all downtown property has been family legacy for generations, owned by people who traditionally milk every possible cent out of properties without reinvesting in them. If it weren't for the fact that our downtown is located in the city with the most promise and best economic engines in the state, insuring a certain level of success regardless of who is in charge, our downtown would have been dead long ago. It is so sad to see such great potential go to waste.
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