Same-Sex Marriage (appointed, house, to move)

[kooks35]

Originally Posted by dravogadro

Maybe you can offer some insight into why conservatives love deregulating everything except what happens in the privacy of one's bedroom?

How does this affect what anyone does in the privacy of their home? Now allowing two gay people to marry doesn't prohibit them from being gay. It doesn't stop them from living together either. All it does is keep them from being granted some privledges by gov't. I would argue that those privledges could have been had without all this fuss if the pro-gay marriage crowd hadn't been so dogmatic.

[srsmn]

Originally Posted by kooks35

How does this affect what anyone does in the privacy of their home? Now allowing two gay people to marry doesn't prohibit them from being gay. It doesn't stop them from living together either. All it does is keep them from being granted some privledges by gov't. I would argue that those privledges could have been had without all this fuss if the pro-gay marriage crowd hadn't been so dogmatic.

You're almost certainly correct, but it's not that one-sided. If the word "marriage" is really the sticking point, then fine: every legally recognized union between two straight people should be called a "civil union" or "domestic partnership" or what have you. When you start calling it marriage, you need to be equal opportunity about it for everybody. I tend to agree with you-- let the religious institutions deal with 'marriage' and marry whoever they want; let the state dish out "civil union certificates" to everybody, regardless of sexual orientation. Didn't work out that way, though, so now we're here....

[pzrOrange]

Originally Posted by kooks35

How does this affect what anyone does in the privacy of their home? Now allowing two gay people to marry doesn't prohibit them from being gay. It doesn't stop them from living together either. All it does is keep them from being granted some privledges by gov't. I would argue that those privledges could have been had without all this fuss if the pro-gay marriage crowd hadn't been so dogmatic.

people do absolutely absurd things in the privacy of their home, both legal and illegal things, including but not limited to having swingers orgies, having all sorts of incest relations, living in a polyamoric setting with multiple partners under the same roof, and so on and so forth. its not even society's business.

the fact remains that as a society we recognize "marriage" and "family" as something way above and beyond the privacy of two people.

that said, since gays are so progressive, may be they should start think that the concept of marriage is so 20th century and we don't need to formalize our relations to be happy. hell, I've seen a lot of good arguments against marriage in general and its hard to argue against them. in addition, one can argue that traditional concept of "no sex before marriage, marriage in church, love and have sex only with one partner until you die, no divorce, etc" is absolete anyway, nobody does it any more.

[Minntoaz]

Originally Posted by pzrOrange

people do absolutely absurd things in the privacy of their home, both legal and illegal things, including but not limited to having swingers orgies, having all sorts of incest relations, living in a polyamoric setting with multiple partners under the same roof, and so on and so forth. its not even society's business.

the fact remains that as a society we recognize "marriage" and "family" as something way above and beyond the privacy of two people.

that said, since gays are so progressive, may be they should start think that the concept of marriage is so 20th century and we don't need to formalize our relations to be happy. hell, I've seen a lot of good arguments against marriage in general and its hard to argue against them. in addition, one can argue that traditional concept of "no sex before marriage, marriage in church, love and have sex only with one partner until you die, no divorce, etc" is absolete anyway, nobody does it any more.

Actually some people,more than you think DO wait until marriage to have sex.

[Green Onions]

Originally Posted by kooks35

How does this affect what anyone does in the privacy of their home? Now allowing two gay people to marry doesn't prohibit them from being gay. It doesn't stop them from living together either. All it does is keep them from being granted some privledges by gov't. I would argue that those privledges could have been had without all this fuss if the pro-gay marriage crowd hadn't been so dogmatic.

Uh huh. Because the National Organization for Marriage -- the primary national organization in opposing same-sex marriage -- supports civil unions, right? Wrong. They oppose civil unions, the only exceptions being where they are trying to roll-back same-sex marriages laws, as in the failed attempt in New Hampshire this past spring.

Before the first state had enacted a same-sex marriage law, there were civil unions in some states -- Vermont was the first. And at the time, civil unions were very controversial, and staunchly opposed. So this idea that there wouldn't have been any 'fuss' over civil unions is simply false.

And those who support same-sex marriage are being no more 'dogmatic' than those who oppose it.

[Green Onions]

Originally Posted by tijlover

I'm Gay, and don't give one hoot whether it's made legal or not, as I wouldn't make use of it anyway, just like the roughly 50% of straight people who don't make use of marriage either.

I've been in 4 Gay relationships and I've never understood that desire to make it official! If voted in, I fear that there'll be gold diggers out there to take advantage of it!

My first partner in Minnesota was extremely wealthy, and if we had married, divorced, I would have been sitting on top of the world today! And then some gold digger (perhaps not even Gay) might smell the money, worm his way into my life with his charm and good looks, and I wouldn't be sitting on top of the world for long!

This is sad.

If "How will it benefit me?" had governed attitudes towards homosexuality over the past few decades, it would still be illegal, still be classified as a mental disorder, and there would be no jurisdictions where discrimination based on sexual orientation was prohibited.

Happily, a lot of people don't focus solely on themselves.

[pzrOrange]

Originally Posted by Minntoaz

Actually some people,more than you think DO wait until marriage to have sex.

in the Western world? an overwhelming minority, and those couples come from incredibly fundamentalist religious upbringing. probably the same ones who won't ever divorse even if they hate each other, because "lord brought them together".

and even then they find a way to "fool around" without actual penetration, which is still sex in my books.
you cant kill a vital human instinct to be all over each other by having "a belief".

Originally Posted by Green Onions

Before the first state had enacted a same-sex marriage law, there were civil unions in some states -- Vermont was the first. And at the time, civil unions were very controversial, and staunchly opposed. So this idea that there wouldn't have been any 'fuss' over civil unions is simply false.

OK but then it is absolute bigotry and cannot be rationalized in an honest intellectual debate.

[Glenfield]

Originally Posted by pzrOrange

OK but then it is absolute bigotry and cannot be rationalized in an honest intellectual debate.

LOL! This from a guy who can't think of more creative adjectives to describe the State Fair and winter than "stupid" and "f-n"!!

[Missourian11]

It is possible to see Minnesota legalizing same-sex marriage in the future. First, we have to defeat MN Same-Sex Marriage Amendment this November. If not, the chance is slim.

Although I am a strong Catholic, I am still open-minded so I am for gay marriage not only in MN but nationwide. I am a proud sister of a gay brother and he should have equal rights as I do!

[Green Onions]

Originally Posted by Missourian11

It is possible to see Minnesota legalizing same-sex marriage in the future. First, we have to defeat MN Same-Sex Marriage Amendment this November. If not, the chance is slim.

Although I am a strong Catholic, I am still open-minded so I am for gay marriage not only in MN but nationwide. I am a proud sister of a gay brother and he should have equal rights as I do!

I would guess at this point that the amendment stands about a 50% chance of passing...