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A big part of this issue is there are people in this state and other states, who idolize Ammon Bundy who is an member of the LDS Church and is anti government and led a very vocal anti mask campaign last year. I know from talking with people and research that this idiot is very popular in the Idaho Falls area and that the LDS members who follow this man don't realize the LDS Church in SLC doesn't support his cause and has even come out with statements against him.
I could make this thread sweet by posting pics I took last year of his followers who would occasionally descend upon downtown Boise without masks and harass store and restaurant owners who required masks to enter their establishments.
I believe the vaccination rate is high in Boise and the surrounding area. This comes as no surprise.
I opted for the double dose Pfizer vaccine.
Rural areas have problems accessing the vaccine so clinics and hospitals in Boise are driving to rural areas and giving out vaccines.
Maybe, just maybe, because genuine Idahoans believe in freedom of choice? My husband and both chose not to get the vaccine, not that we have issues with anyone who chooses to get it, no more than someone choosing a Prius over a Subaru. So outside of the possibility that we contract Covid, as far I can see there are no other consequences. Concerts? We've already been to the ones we've wanted to attend. Planes? If we can't drive, we don't go.
The "no other consequences" part is the part that gets me here. You can have it (Covid) and spread it easily to others when you are not vaccinated. It is NOT like choosing a Prius over a Subaru. This is where education comes in. Genuine Idahoans might like Trump ( even HE got vaccinated as did his family) and hate government and being told what to do, but this goes even beyond that. Ignorance and selfishness IMO sorry. Millions have gotten vaccinated with no consequence whatsoever.
Last edited by Justabystander; 05-17-2021 at 01:42 PM..
Vaccinations are the only way out of this. “Science Rules” used to be a geeky slogan, but in this case the geeks are right. Those who refuse are just delaying us getting back to normal.
The "no other consequences" part is the part that gets me here. You can have it (Covid) and spread it easily to others when you are not vaccinated. It is NOT like choosing a Prius over a Subaru. This is where education comes in. Genuine Idahoans might like Trump ( even HE got vaccinated as did his family) and hate government and being told what to do, but this goes even beyond that. Ignorance and selfishness IMO sorry. Millions have gotten vaccinated with no consequence whatsoever.
If I were to follow what you're saying, then I would never leave my house! Politics have ZERO to do with my choice. I've followed medicine for years and several people I know still affiliated are only being vaccinated by force, they need their income.
I refuse to battle this with you, a question was asked, I answered. Simple as that. If you want to wear masks, please do you're not offending me. If you want the vaccine then get it, again I'm not offended.
The vax does not stop you from getting, carrying and spreading the C-19. (with an exception to the J&J) It only stops you from suffering from C-19's symptoms. It's not a true vax, it's the equivalent of a pain killer.
The vax hides the symptoms but does not cure the sickness.
I am an advocate of vaccines, and cannot see any good reason to not take this one. But the Spanish flu, bubonic plague outbreaks, Black Death outbreaks, and many other variants of influenza and similar diseases, were all suppressed and/or completely disappeared without any vaccines. And since none of the vaccines are 100% effective, this virus would not be stamped out in short order even if everyone took the vaccine. It only helps speed up the time when we get to where the large outbreaks of the virus are prevented, and lowers the total number of short term deaths.
Something around 45-50% of the population has already had the virus; here is how you know:
- Take the numbers of confirmed cases, currently at 33.7M in the US.
- Multiply that by the factor of total actual cases to confirmed cases, which is between 4.5 and 5.
- You get to 45-50% of the population already infected, without the vaccine. (The last I read of that factor was at 4.6 + or - in the US; that data is about 3 months old.)
Add in some large % of the population who never had the virus but who get vaccinated, and you well past the 70% range of protected individuals, well past the 'herd immunity' level.
Herd immunity, from infection or vaccination, by itself does not kill off a virus. The only thing that herd immunity does is make it impossible for a disease to continue to spread and grow in an exponential fashion over broad segments of the population; i.e., it prevents large outbreaks. Such viruses mutate, and may get worse, but at some random points in time will also mutate to more benign forms. That is what will eventually kill off a vaccine; it basically disappears in its present form. (And we have had several forms of the corona viruses circulating about the world in the recent decades.)
My bottom line is that, while I would prefer that everyone get this vaccine, IMHO it does not make any difference in the final outcome if some don't..... and the resistance to vaccination is expected anyway. And if anyone wants someone to change their mind on a matter that is officially and legally a voluntary choice, how does anyone think condemnation will lead them to do so? That's just not how you do it.
Just a factoid as another point of reference on all of this: In the central rural states of the US (like MO, AR, TN and KY), it is estimated that only 55-60% of the population ever caught the Spanish flu before it died off, with no vaccine.
I'd agree. However, this reluctance to get vaccinated did allow me to get the Pfizer vaccine way back in January even though I'm not in that 1st priority group. Apparently this rural area in North Idaho got more vaccine than it had people eager to utilize it. Believe me, I was quite relieved to have my immune system specifically prepped against this deadly virus. True, the virus is not that common up here, and maybe you'll not run into it, but given that the vaccine is free, safe, and effective, why take the chance?
I think the key term is "RELATIVELY safe". All vaccines carry some risk, and this one is more suspect because it was "rushed" IMHO. That being said, I routinely get the annual flu vaccine, and recently got the J&J, making the decision based on my own personal cost/benefit analysis. Whether that was a prudent decision remains to be seen. Being in a high-risk group, I've been careful enough via isolating to not contract Covid for the past sixteen months. For me, getting the vaccine was simply a calculated risk, same as taking a long car trip.
Personally, International Air Travel is the medium that has put us at so much risk from modern viruses. I've never been out of the continental U.S., and don't feel all that deprived - if we would have closed down the borders sooner than we did, we would have had a much better chance of limiting the effects. The problem was, we trusted China to give the rest of the world an early heads-up. Big Mistake.
As was said above, it mostly political, and/or the lack of trust in govt/medicine... aka... fear/ignorance/paranoia, largely brought on by a certain political party.
As a 49 yr old near McCall, I was able to get it in Feb without any problems as there was not a high demand after the initial surge for frontliners, medical, etc.
While I don't really care if someone personally gets the shot or not, I DO care about society getting back to normal. I want to travel on a plane, and not have to wear a mask. I want to go to a concert and/or sporting event with other people around, and again, not have to wear a mask.
Returning to normal life as we knew it only being prolonged by all the people that refuse to get the vaccine.
It's political - end of story. Many of the same people that refuse to get the covid vaccine, will get a variety of other vaccines (shingles, flu, etc). Idaho is almost dead last on other things. Check out education. There is a lot of great things about Idaho but no one moves here to be around geniuses.
Yes, but other measures were taken to avoid spreading the Spanish flu:
"The end of the 1918 pandemic wasn’t, however, just the result of so many people catching it that immunity became widespread. Social distancing was also key. Public health advice on curbing the spread of the virus was eerily similar to that of today: citizens were encouraged to stay healthy through campaigns promoting mask-wearing, frequent hand-washing, quarantining and isolating of patients, and the closure of schools, public spaces and non-essential businesses—all steps designed to cut off routes for the virus’ spread. - source:https://time.com/5894403/how-the-191...andemic-ended/
Not sure I am following you?? Sounds like the measures were similar to today.... no surprise as the use of masks and keeping away from sick people is centuries' old knowledge.... long before germ theory was proven!
The point on the 50-60% of rural infection was that is similar to what we have already on average in the US today, and it contrasted to the significantly higher spreads in more urbanized areas with more advanced transportation. Illinois' estimated infections was much higher, in the 80% or higher range, than the more rural neighboring states like MO, AR, KY and TN. This is all in a study by the St Louis Federal Reserve from about 12 years ago, which was as study of the economic impacts of the Spanish Flu. (I don't put any real faith in journalist's articles on such things....) So overall in the US, the Spanish flu % infection was at or less than what we have today with those directly infected plus those vaccinated. So yes, herd immunity was reached, and/or the virus mutated enough. We're at that same point now with COVID.
The ultimate point I wanted to make on that was there was never a vaccine for the Spanish Flu. So it is complete nonsense to think that some folks not taking the corona vaccine will change the end outcome. More vaccinations only speeds things along to some level of herd immunity. This is all understood by health officials; they ALWAYS factor in some % of the population not taking a vaccine.
Last edited by nm9stheham; 05-20-2021 at 04:40 PM..
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