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2. Your picture of all of this is a little off because you are in law.
Obviously, my perspective is relative to my field and educational background. That said, I did previously mention for the majority of students, the college itself matters minimally in securing employment re: teaching, health care, computer science and so on (as long as the appropriate degree is obtained).
In other words, again, it depends on one’s chosen field and career goals (as well as talent/proficiency), particularly relative to highly-competitive fields. That said, I’m amazed at how many threads there are in this forum relative to such. If you don’t think it matters, clearly, you’re not in a position where it does.
Disagree. Recruiting out of undergrad at Wharton is different than it is at Humboldt state.
Sure. That's its own point. The issue here is do excellent students enjoy better life outcomes after graduating "prestige" schools over equally excellent students who attend "lesser" schools. The only hard studies we have - and these are large sample size studies authored by legit pros - indicate no.
And Wharton is a graduate business school as stipulated above the laundry really matters in law and graduate business.
Obviously, my perspective is relative to my field and educational background. That said, I did previously mention for the majority of students, the college itself matters minimally in securing employment re: teaching, health care, computer science and so on (as long as the appropriate degree is obtained).
In other words, again, it depends on one’s chosen field and career goals (as well as talent/proficiency), particularly relative to highly-competitive fields. That said, I’m amazed at how many threads there are in this forum relative to such. If you don’t think it matters, clearly, you’re not in a position where it does.
So you are saying Kreuger and Dale and their large, peer reviewed studies were/are wrong?
Within the confines of my point (very high achievers with the bonafides to prove it)....I don't think where they attend undergrad matters because the best info we have says it does not matter.
So you are saying Kreuger and Dale and their large, peer reviewed studies were/are wrong?
I’m saying there are times a highly-selective college does matter, not necessarily to one’s success overall (as that is defined differently from person-to-person) but relative to specific goals re: competitive fields, (acceptance into) academically-prestigious graduate programs and the companies who only hire relative to such.
I’m saying there are times a highly-selective college does matter, not necessarily to one’s success overall (as that is defined differently from person-to-person) but relative to specific goals re: competitive fields, (acceptance into) academically-prestigious graduate programs and the companies who only hire relative to such.
The cadre studied by Krueger and Dale was made up of top performers exclusively. You know, exactly the people who later go to grad. and professional school and then into competitive fields.
The thesis of this conversation is, well was anyway, about undergraduate work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CorporateCowboy
In that case, it can make a difference (for some) relative to one’s acceptance into an academically-prestigious graduate program.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDS_
The cadre studied by Krueger and Dale was made up of top performers exclusively. You know, exactly the people who later go to grad. and professional school and then into competitive fields.
How would they know/determine who ‘later went on’ to graduate school or where, yet alone where they were first employed (or how much their salary out-of-the-gate relative to such).
In other words, as you stated previously, you’re speaking to overall success relative to an undergraduate degree. Point being, however, those who benefit from academically-elite schools are high-performing graduates who already plan to enter a competitive field/graduate program and seek high-earning opportunity relative to such. Naturally, they are going to benefit from better educational inputs.
How would they know/determine who ‘later went on’ to graduate school or where, yet alone where they were first employed (or how much their salary out-of-the-gate relative to such).
In other words, as you stated previously, you’re speaking to overall success relative to an undergraduate degree. Point being, however, those who benefit from academically-elite schools are high-performing graduates who already plan to enter a competitive field/graduate program and seek high-earning opportunity relative to such. Naturally, they are going to benefit from better educational inputs.
Per the bolded...........you can't be serious? We have all kinds of longitudinal studies across various fields and populations going back decades, some 100 years. Framingham - 1948, Terman's IQ studies kicked off in 1921. Studying who went to school/grad school and how much they earn etc. is academic chicken feed relative to medical studies.
I'll see if I can post some of the data set questions and answers with some time stamping for context.
The thesis of this conversation is ,well was anyway, about undergraduate work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDS_
The cadre studied by Krueger and Dale was made up of top performers exclusively. You know, exactly the people who later go to grad. and professional school and then into competitive fields.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDS_
Per the bolded...........you can't be serious?
You’re seriously arguing that which you initially steered re: ‘people who later go to grad and professional school’, which clearly implies at the time of said study, graduate school was (a possibility) at some ‘later date’. You also specifically stated in a previous post the conversation is about undergraduate work.
Point being, relative to an academically-elite school, there’s a huge distinction between an undergraduate degree (particularly depending on the major) vs. a graduate degree in terms of benefit re: specific employers, first-year earnings and so on; needless to say, it is in addition (and relative) to a better education overall. That said, it’s absurd to throw all majors and degrees together with the expectation of a meaningful/universal conclusion, particularly since success is personally defined and not everyone will have the same (career) goals; hence my previous posts, below.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CorporateCowboy
Obviously, my perspective is relative to my field and educational background. That said, I did previously mention for the majority of students, the college itself matters minimally in securing employment re: teaching, health care, computer science and so on (as long as the appropriate degree is obtained).
In other words, again, it depends on one’s chosen field and career goals (as well as talent/proficiency), particularly relative to highly-competitive fields. That said, I’m amazed at how many threads there are in this forum relative to such. If you don’t think it matters, clearly, you’re not in a position where it does.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CorporateCowboy
For most, it’s true; in fact, for many, they are doing well (and are content) to get through college and earn a solid income. That said, relative to highly-competitive fields and/or a desire to succeed beyond ‘average’ i.e. law, business and medicine - it can (and will) affect opportunity/wages. Relative to law, for example, one may find they are unemployable in the field if they attend an unaccredited law school; at the very least, they are more likely to earn significantly less, as a whole (and are in a different ballpark entirely by comparison to those who graduate from the top-twenty law schools).
Last edited by CorporateCowboy; 12-13-2023 at 11:26 PM..
Reason: added quote
is it really true where you go to college does not affect your employment ?
I thought going to good colleges increases your changes of connections networking etc
ofcourse exceptionally intelligent wealthy or lucky people will be successful regardless
But is it really true for the vast majority of us ?
Just realize the author is an expert on parenting - not colleges.
The author is discussing how soft skills affect the college experience - ie how to raise children.
She saying that "who you are as a person, your work ethic, and your support system is more important than the college you choose" - all focused on parenting.
She isn't taking about colleges as much as she is selling her own services.
A good college is better than a bad college because you'll work harder and have better professors. A pricy private college isn't necessarily better than a good public school. An Ivy League education does not promise success. It's all common sense.
Colleges can increase your connections for your internships and your first job. After that, you success depends on your work ethic.
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