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How are unions abusive, Jess? And Abusive to whom?
Sounds like a little jealousy to me...;-)
Usu. unions vigourously represent their members or they do not! I have never heard of abuse. Unless, you mean like the employees in France who took the 4M CEO hostage. But as they say, if you kick someone out of their job, don't expect to escape unscathed. (and of course i don't mean killed or shot.) Also, remember, if you had been in a union, instead of a contractor, they might not have been able to get rid of you and instead given you the nec. training you might have been missing!
I don't care if you're union or associated with AFL-CIO. Like unions in America abuse their companies like those idiot Boeing Machinists and GM Workers. Unions are idiotically abusive too at times.
You can thank unions and their lobbying for the middle class and all that goes with it - vacation, sick time, FMLA medical leave, paternity leave, safety regulations, the list goes on. Had people not stood up for themselves in a united voice we'd all (well most) be making $100/month working 16 hour days giving half our "paycheck" back to our companies for room and board.
I also think that SPEEA should go away, people should not have to join a union, we should have the choice not to. I'd rather not pay $35 per month to a union that has better benefits than the engineers that they are supposed to represent.
SPEEA is like a teachers union, the more senior people are protected from most layoffs.
The managers decide the retention list, the management are fools, they really are clueless.
I also think that SPEEA should go away, people should not have to join a union, we should have the choice not to. I'd rather not pay $35 per month to a union that has better benefits than the engineers that they are supposed to represent.
SPEEA is like a teachers union, the more senior people are protected from most layoffs.
The managers decide the retention list, the management are fools, they really are clueless.
Well, someone's head has to roll, why not the more recent employees. In that situation, there are always going to unhappy people. Lay offs cause unhappiness.
I am sure that my manager has better benefits, than me, so, as long as you got benefits you should be happy and if you are not, then get your fellow employees to sit down and ask for more benefits.
keeping in mind, that people without unions don't get good benefits or benefits at all. (Unless, you happen to work for good company and they are dying like the dinosaurs) Good benefits to me, means both medical and dental with no or very cheap deductible. As long as i have that, i am happy and so, have no need to compare myself to the other guy or gal.
I also think that SPEEA should go away, people should not have to join a union, we should have the choice not to. I'd rather not pay $35 per month to a union that has better benefits than the engineers that they are supposed to represent.
SPEEA is like a teachers union, the more senior people are protected from most layoffs.
The managers decide the retention list, the management are fools, they really are clueless.
You don't have to join the union. You do however have to pay union dues, but not to the union directly, to the company. The reason being you are benefiting from the unions negotiating by your pay and work rules.
Sounds like that $35/month is a bargain, I paid around $1200 last year to my union.
The reason more senior people are protected from furlough/layoffs is because they have seniority. Imagine an environment where companies/governments lay off the top 20% (by pay) of their work force every year, then re hire more new folks at the beginning of the next year.
Automation scares away union members. I've seen it first hand. I work at an aerospace company and anytime we propose automating some test equipment they throw a fit and get uncooperative because that is one more seat they won't have to fill.
I work with some great techs but the problem is they have a mind of their own and deviate from the test plans. They think they know better and/or don't want to fail units. BS. I'd rather troubleshoot a million dollar test equipment rack than deal with a tech with an Ego.
As far as I'm concerned we should flush the unions before our companies go bankrupt and Obama takes them over.
The same complaint has been made at least since the early '90s when I worked at Boeing as a contractor. Guess what, Boeing has done just fine. Automation can do only so much - there are many tasks where two eyes and hands are essential. As was pointed out, AirBus has even tougher unions.
Want a weaker union? Move to S.C. and work for less.
Im in a union, and I wish I didn't have to be, but until there are some type of rules regarding corporate responsibility to worker and community, unions are all we have. Profit over everything else has hurt both 'sides' of the issue. Research the disparity in wages and benefits between Right to Work states, and non-RTW states. Unions wont look so bad after all . . .
Healthcare has the same problem... It will take me 18 months to fire a really lazy under-performing RN. She is the least productive person in the team, her colleagues complain about her performance because she does not do her job well which creates extra work for everyone and we receive complain letters from patients because of her poor patient engagement. I simply have to fight with union to fire this person. By the way, she will still receive a yearly raise with this horrible performance and Union will blame manager for her poor performance. It is definitely not fair to other hard working RNs. I think unions are great for hard working people because these people deserve a decent salary and benefits. They do their best and even if they do not perform well, they are willing to get more training to do well. On the other hand, the lazy employees simply take advantage of the unions and try to work as little as they can do!
LOL. Many suppliers in that area won't hire former Boeing machinists for the reasons stated. I know that a large number of those represented by the IAM aren't even machinists. Machine operators at best. Without the union, they would be wiping oil off the sides of machines for a hefty paycut.
Boeing's margins are thin. Very thin. They need to find a way to trim fat. The union wants to maintain ranks so they don't end up like the UAW, with too few young people supporting too many retired folks. Unfortunately, the union's effort will continue to encourage outsourcing, and further investment in RTW states. There are challenges to this, but there are also challenges to keeping a union happy. Ask the automakers who came begging to Obama for a bailout.
Last edited by andywire; 04-30-2015 at 10:11 PM..
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