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hnsq:"And by Southwest, do you mean the airline company who has experienced a 40% decline in value over the last 10 years? "
That's stupid, hnsq. First SW outperforms the industry hands-down. Second, they wound down the last few years a oils future contract that was adding megabucks to operating profit. So that would reduce stock price as it went away. Third, most important, many corps work for the WS analysts and make bone-headed long term decisions for short-term gains. Did it ever occur to you some corps, like SW, don't, and therefore, analysts may pooh-pooh them, but long-term investors might be wise to favor them?
Sure it outperforms the industry, but it is a younger company and is performing compatibly to other airlines when compared on a basis of age existing. Long-term, southwest has been a poor investment! That was my point!
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelsup
If by value you are referring to stock price, well, I would hope it's obvious that a companies value is not always relative to their stock price. SWA has been the most profitable airline of our time.
If you don't want to work for them, that's no skin off my back. Pilots there make more than any other company in the US and have the most amount of time off.
No idea how your companies listed have anything to do with the topic at hand, ie SWA being a great employer and employees going above and beyond to help the company out. In return, customers like flying SWA because the employees are actually happy to be there.
Public company's value is ONLY measured by stock price. That is why a company goes public. When a company goes public, their only responsibility is to their stockholders. If you want to help out single mothers, do charity work in your free time. Don't pull stockholders down because of your personal ideals.
SW has been a great company, but so was american airlines when it was a young company. There is a natural lifecycle in corporations, and southwest is still in early stages. A publicly traded company only has a responsibility to stockholders. If a company doesn't want to operate in that fashion, then it will not go public! This isn't an emotional issue, please leave your personal agendas at the door. This is a monetary issue, and one in which stockholder wealth is the only deciding factor.
Again - I am all for helping those in need (like Lisa), and I do that in my free time often. But helping the needy is NOT the point of a corporation. Take the money you earn from your job and help Lisa on your own. That is what I would do.
Airline stocks by nature are not great, but being fair, hnsq, comparing SW to American undervalues SW, as it has shown more corporate ability to respond to changes in the industry than American, or any of the stone age dinosaurs within the industry.
hnsq: "Take the money you earn from your job and help Lisa on your own. "
In this case, eliminating a poison and "helping Lisa" go hand in hand. 6 months salary and benefits plus headhunters fees for every employee lost via the actions of the alternative. That hits the bottom line. I sense you are young, hnsq (not said as a knock, just a statement), when you have more decades behind you, you'll catch on to the fact corps EARN their voluntary attrition rates-of the employees they'd truly prefer to keep for bottom line purposes. My bachelors' degree was in Accounting, but I realize its short-comings, and capturing "soft costs" are one of them. A quarterly report is a history of what happened, its not a prediction of what will happen.
Furthermore, he knows if he lets Lisa go, she'll lose her health coverage, leaving her sick child without insurance, which would almost certainly leave her with a mountain of unpayable debt. He knows that it would be quite difficult for her to get another job, with everything that she's having to endure lately - in short, her being laid off would be just about the worse possible thing that could happen to her at this time. Whereas if he lays off Mr Hotshot, a single man bunking up in a cheap apartment with his college buddy that has a good job as well, Bill knows that Eddie would land on all four feet and get another job pronto - who wouldn't want to hire an ambitious young man that's established solid work credentials in just two years?
Irrelevant. You're retaining the person who is best for the company. Period. You don't care whether somebody 'lands on their feet' or not or whether 'Mr Hotshot' will be all right because he is so much more mobile and marketable.
Lisa might be a good employee, I don't know. However, I have enough experience with the Lisas in this world who are quick to let coworkers, including managers, in on any personal difficulties (real, exaggerated, or outright invented) in order to appeal to the 'compassion' of those coworkers, thereby hoping to secure their place even more.
I hate to say this, but I think in most cases the Lisa person is fired. The reason is you have one person that needs to do the job that was previously done by two persons. As a manager, your concern is who has the better capability to do twice the amount of work. Based on that hypo, it is probably the Eddie person who appears more productive.
If Lisa can't handle the extra work, that means the manager generally has to do it and pick up the slack. I think most managers would deal with an abrasive employee (and attempt to correct this behavior) than put in more hours at work for themselves.
Eddie would have to get the hell on for the simple fact that he's a jackass. He may be a go-getter top performer but he sucks at being respectful to employees. It doesn't matter how good you are, if you aren't respectful to colleagues, you probably won't get far.
hnsq: "Take the money you earn from your job and help Lisa on your own. "
In this case, eliminating a poison and "helping Lisa" go hand in hand. 6 months salary and benefits plus headhunters fees for every employee lost via the actions of the alternative. That hits the bottom line. I sense you are young, hnsq (not said as a knock, just a statement), when you have more decades behind you, you'll catch on to the fact corps EARN their voluntary attrition rates-of the employees they'd truly prefer to keep for bottom line purposes. My bachelors' degree was in Accounting, but I realize its short-comings, and capturing "soft costs" are one of them. A quarterly report is a history of what happened, its not a prediction of what will happen.
And as I said many times, it absolutely depends on the type of company. Many publicly traded companies have a very cutthroat culture where Eddie's attitude would not be seen as a bad thing in any way.
The fact that Lisa has a complicated personal life cannot enter into the equation when making this decision. You don't hire someone to a public company as a favor to them, you hire them to help your shareholders. I wouldn't want to attract more people who have to leave after exactly 40 hours to work for me, I would want to attract more people like Eddie. A group of all Eddie's is what makes up the top firms today. It would be ideal if he was less of an a**, but you can't have it all.
Here is the thing (that you, as someone who is older should know) - Lisa's shortcomings (personal situation not allowing her to work late) cannot be changed, but Eddie's personality can be. A good manager should be able to manage a personality like Eddie's. A personality is malleable, and molding that to what a firm wants is part of being a good manager. Lisa's situation will not go away any time soon.
Here is the thing (that you, as someone who is older should know) - Lisa's shortcomings (personal situation not allowing her to work late) cannot be changed, but Eddie's personality can be. A good manager should be able to manage a personality like Eddie's. A personality is malleable, and molding that to what a firm wants is part of being a good manager. Lisa's situation will not go away any time soon.
The funny thing about this is that I see it the completely opposite way from you. As someone who has been working for a number of years now, I have seen that Eddies don't change their personalities. Lisa's situation usually changes. The fact that Lisa can't stay late this month may change next month. Her personal problems are a temporary thing. Eddie being an ***** is a personality flaw that will not change.
I agree,num1 baby, the Eddies personalities were formed , as were all of ours, before we hit 1st grade. They are locked in stone, and while a good manager may persuade Eddie to fake not being a destructive jerk for a week or two, it won't stick. No matter what business one is in, the smart ones, even on Wall St, consider soft costs. The smart ones look at voluntary attrition patterns and study them for common characteristics.
Eddie is a cancer..no matter the industry..unless one is looking only at this quarters bottom line, but management is supposed to look long-term.
I agree,num1 baby, the Eddies personalities were formed , as were all of ours, before we hit 1st grade. They are locked in stone, and while a good manager may persuade Eddie to fake not being a destructive jerk for a week or two, it won't stick. No matter what business one is in, the smart ones, even on Wall St, consider soft costs. The smart ones look at voluntary attrition patterns and study them for common characteristics.
Eddie is a cancer..no matter the industry..unless one is looking only at this quarters bottom line, but management is supposed to look long-term.
Agreed as it pertains to the example in the OP.
Eddie needs to get a job at this kind of place.
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