Wolves and Cougars

[PS90]

Again, I can see both sides of this issue, but I certainly notice that the posters from Western WA, who haven't actually experienced the wolf re-introduction first-hand, are pro-wolf. While the posters who have lived where they have been re-introduced are not.

Funny that Idaho and Montana have changed their stances on wolf re-introduction, but Washington (where the government is a world away - or a mountain range away, at least - from what is actually going on) hasn't.

[Sabinerose]

Excellent point PS90. I would probably be pro-wolf also if I only saw beautiful pictures of them howling in the moonlight or against backgrounds of majestic snowfall. Photos of pups are adorable with the fuzzy fur and bright eyes. It wouldn't be possible to imagine killing something like that. It also wouldn't be possible to imagine that same pup doing the damage those of us living with the wolves have seen.

I am going to have to bite my lip a lot, now that I live in West WA if the subject of wolves comes up .

[509]

Originally Posted by TrueTimbers

Ranchers in Spain know have wolves again. The old breeds of dogs are coming back.

A neighbor had one of these that somebody dumped at the meadow.

He was a great dog.

Anatolian Shepherd - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[windrunner4484]

I have been reading the posts here. TrueTimbers has is right. We have really created a huge imbalance and the prey is now suffering because there are too many of them. We have them here. I love the deer but to keep numbers healthy and not starving we need the big predators. I think there are far too many people. (Maybe we should have hunting season on these. I think we do a disservice when we don't allow the predators along with their prey. And killing that alpha female was a stupid thing to do. I am not a fan of ranchers running cattle all over the place on public lands. The land in some places won't support the number they want. And the Anatolian Shepherd is a great animal to guard. It's so sad we have forgotten how to live within OUR boundries and push the animals out of their areas.

[509]

Originally Posted by windrunner4484

I have been reading the posts here. TrueTimbers has is right. We have really created a huge imbalance and the prey is now suffering because there are too many of them. We have them here. I love the deer but to keep numbers healthy and not starving we need the big predators. I think there are far too many people. (Maybe we should have hunting season on these. I think we do a disservice when we don't allow the predators along with their prey. And killing that alpha female was a stupid thing to do. I am not a fan of ranchers running cattle all over the place on public lands. The land in some places won't support the number they want. And the Anatolian Shepherd is a great animal to guard. It's so sad we have forgotten how to live within OUR boundries and push the animals out of their areas.

The prey...deer and elk have rather enjoyed the "huge imbalance". BTW...there is no such thing as balance in nature. In the scientific community, that concept was thrown out in the 1970's.

Yes, there are far too many people. Maybe we need limits on immigration. We hit Zero Population Growth in 1980 in the USA. The border was opened shortly thereafter and population just took off!!

I am not a fan of running cattle on public lands. However, they are run in "sustainable" fashion on most public lands particularly Forest Service and BLM lands. The simple way in the West to determine if you are on public or private land is just check its ecological condition!!

The Anatolian Shepherd I knew was a wonderful dog The people that dumped him did a great favor. It was his meadow until they left!!

Humans don't have boundaries. Never have. They have been changing ecosystems since they showed up. Read the book 1491. In North America, it appears that ecosystems were totally shaped by American Indians for their needs. The only reason North American was "uninhabited" when the English showed up is that 90% of the Indian population died due to introduced diseases just prior to European settlement.

Hope this helps your understanding of the natural world.

[TrueTimbers]

Could have an interesting conversation on the concept of of balance in nature. Indeed it is a cyclical thing, booms and busts. I suppose technically we are just another species impacting others, just as all species do.

However, we humans tend to have the notion, we should try and have less impact.. Hence undo what we did to the wolves.

Which I support in many ways.. Look at chronic wasting disease. We did that, with wolves it would have likely not manifested..

Will say I think us humans will go down in the history book in the category with lemming or locust..