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Perhaps your life seems so busy because you have to do so much driving?
Where I live, there is no other way to get around. I don't even know if there is mass transit and with all the zig zags and different places I have to go it wouldn't make sense. It would probably take 3 times longer not to mention that my 50 mile commute to work has no mass transit.
I like having a car, but it adds up.
Gas ($2.40 a gallon)
Parking (having to find, then paying for parking, ie: $1 parking meter vs. $4-$8 an hour in a garage.)
Maintenance
Traffic (more gas)
Residential Permit or/fee ($25-$100+)
If I lived in a sprawled place it would be the same minus the parking, but everything would be much further in distance so the cost of driving more with longer distances and more traffic would probably offset the parking cost if it's not more. Plus, the maintenance would probably increase since the car is being used much more.
It all depends on where you live as well. Most here are equating not living in the city itself, to living in a suburb of a large city. For a lot of us it is an hour or more drive to a city of 10,000+ or larger. I live in a town of 1200 people, EVERYTHING I need or want is within a 10 mile radius. If I want to see a live play, performance, or concert I may have to stretch that out to 25 miles. No parking meters, no parking fees or parking garages, no traffic. Maintenance is minimal because I keep the vehicles in good shape to begin with and don't abuse them. As for vehicle costs, I drive a lot and so does my wife. We go through about $150 worth of gas a month, toss in another $50 on average for maintenance issues I take care of over the course of a year and it seems a small price to pay to have the kids in a GREAT school district, have a nice house on the best street in town with 1/2 an acre lot. Walking distance to stores, parks, & schools. Safe enough area to let the kids not only play outside, but ride their bikes anyplace they want in town to visit friends. Go to sleep at night to the sounds of silence and not hear: trucks, cars, sirens, horns, neighbors, and a multitude of other things that are going on in a big city 24/7.
Yep we are packed in here at a rate of 856 people /sq mile and it is as dense as I ever want to go anymore. Cost of living is 75% of the US average and our personal wages are above average... do the math, we don't care how much gas is, it is still cheaper than living in a densely populated city.
As a side note I need somebody to clarify something: "Residential Permit or/fee ($25-$100+)" Just what IS this? Never heard of it, anyplace I have lived. Not being sarcastic at all, I really don't know what this fee would be -- best I can come up with is a fee to park your own vehicle at your own house -- but that doesn't make a bit of sense.
That's about my situation, but I'm actually a little more remote than I'd like. I think I might like to live within a micropolitan area so long as it's not one that's located in a larger metropolitan area.
As a side note I need somebody to clarify something: "Residential Permit or/fee ($25-$100+)" Just what IS this? Never heard of it, anyplace I have lived. Not being sarcastic at all, I really don't know what this fee would be -- best I can come up with is a fee to park your own vehicle at your own house -- but that doesn't make a bit of sense.
Street parking in your area. The permits keep people that don't live in your area from parking there. Also a good source of revenue for the city with permits AND tickets.
I think that is how it's used on sites like this. When I first heard the term "walkable" I assumed it referred to being a place where you can walk everywhere. So like pedestrian safety, good lighting, accessibility, and so forth. Instead it does seem to refer more to everything being in "walking distance", particularly short walks. It apparently doesn't have much, or anything, to do with whether a place is a pleasant and safe environment to walk. It's more about walking being more convenient than other things in said environment. So in theory a "walkable city" could be a place where people don't necessarily want to walk they just do it because it's more convenient.
I guess I can relate to that in some respects. I do like areas where the shops are all close together like plazas and even some malls. However everyone living bunched up and clogging the sidewalks or streets is something I'd be too old to adjust to. I like being able to just stroll along peacefully.
But is there anything really wrong with walking? I'm not addressing you specifically, but other car drivers in this thread think walking somewhere to get something or do something is the craziest idea ever. I know they think it's crazy where I used to live.
I think it's funny that people assume density=crowded and clogged sidewalks everywhere, similar to the cars that travel on the streets, right?
Wrong. I live in one of the densest neighborhoods in Chicago and never feel like the sidewalk is crowded. In fact, I may only see 10 or so people within two blocks on the way to the train.
The crowded sidewalk idea is partly from the visits I've had in big cities, although I might be exaggerating it a tad.
And no there's nothing wrong with walking places to get stuff. I like "walking" places and I understand the idea of driving being just for "taking a trip." There are just some things about that I found initially confusing. I live in a place where people do haul things. Not everything they buy or move can be carried by one person with ease. If you buy say a TV or computer you're really going to walk with it to-and-from the store? I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's a bit hard for me to picture. Wouldn't you worry someone would grab it while you're walking along?
Granted the mention of delivery services made that make some sense, but I think people where I've lived tend to just think of hauling their own stuff in a car rather than paying others to haul stuff in a car. This is probably because we almost certainly will have our own car as we will want to visit other towns. I know city people don't need cars as any town they'd want to visit will have an airport.
It's just different ways of living I guess. If I'd always lived in a city I'd probably have no interest in visiting towns to small to have an airport and would find delivery of large items cheaper than just having a car.
The crowded sidewalk idea is partly from the visits I've had in big cities, although I might be exaggerating it a tad.
And no there's nothing wrong with walking places to get stuff. I like "walking" places and I understand the idea of driving being just for "taking a trip." There are just some things about that I found initially confusing. I live in a place where people do haul things. Not everything they buy or move can be carried by one person with ease. If you buy say a TV or computer you're really going to walk with it to-and-from the store? I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's a bit hard for me to picture. Wouldn't you worry someone would grab it while you're walking along?
Granted the mention of delivery services made that make some sense, but I think people where I've lived tend to just think of hauling their own stuff in a car rather than paying others to haul stuff in a car. This is probably because we almost certainly will have our own car as we will want to visit other towns. I know city people don't need cars as any town they'd want to visit will have an airport.
It's just different ways of living I guess. If I'd always lived in a city I'd probably have no interest in visiting towns to small to have an airport and would find delivery of large items cheaper than just having a car.
You've probably only been in "visiting" or more business-like areas when you go to other cities, so it's probably more crowded. I live in a far flung neighborhood that the business people and tourists feel no need to visit when they're here just visiting, so it's never crowded.
I'd have a TV or a computer delivered! A one time fee is still cheaper than owning a car! If you own a car and can fit it into your car, then yeah, it's a waste of money that you're paying on your car to have someone deliver it to you (because, really, a car should be only to get you places and/or haul things - not as something to joy ride in just for fun).
I don't know, if it was something small enough though, and I could get it close enough to my apartment, I might haul my own electronics back. I have no problem taking my "granny cart" to Target and buying small appliances, bedding, clothes, etc. I'm not worrying about someone just up and stealing it from me because, well, that's just a "city" stereotype that everyone is out to rob you.
have a nice house on the best street in town with 1/2 an acre lot. Walking distance to stores, parks, & schools. Safe enough area to let the kids not only play outside, but ride their bikes anyplace they want in town to visit friends.
Sounds pretty nice, actually. Interestingly enough, there are many inner suburban and urban neighborhoods that meet this very description. I don't object to not living in the city; I just would never want to live in most of the suburbs and exurbs developed in the last 50-60 years that tend to be completely dominated by cars. It is just crazy to me how many areas there are where people have to drive three miles through mazes of cul-de-sacs and wide boulevards just to get a loaf of bread.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bydand
As a side note I need somebody to clarify something: "Residential Permit or/fee ($25-$100+)" Just what IS this? Never heard of it, anyplace I have lived. Not being sarcastic at all, I really don't know what this fee would be -- best I can come up with is a fee to park your own vehicle at your own house -- but that doesn't make a bit of sense.
In many dense neighborhoods, both residents and others (visitors, people doing business in the area, people going out to restaurants/bars in the area, etc.) wish to park on the street. To assure that much of the street parking is available to area residents, some blocks will have signs saying that you must have a residential permit to park there. This is common in neighborhoods where there is limited garage parking underneath a small building (for example, in Los Angeles), only a couple of parking spaces behind a building (for example, in Boston), or where the place is mostly made up of single-family houses with a driveway that will only fit one car (for example, in Key West, FL or Berkeley, CA). No one pays the municipality to pay in their driveway or in their building's lot or garage; they pay the municipality for the right to park in an area where street parking is reserved for residents only.
Good point.
But wouldn't getting something more than a basic need require a road trip?
If you like small town life than that will work out perfectly. No lines, no traffic, no congestion.
true, people who live in small towns usually make regular trips to the nearest big town depending on how close that next town is, so yeah it can add up to alot of miles,
but if you are content in a small town and dont need much you can easily get by on going to the nearest city maybe twice a year to get whatever you cant get in the small town.
like another poster said, they would hate to drive through cul-de-sacs to get some bread and I would hate that too, I live off one of the main streets here so I have almost everything I need within a 3 mile radius, but I too would hate to live in a suburb in a big city and have to drive into the city everyday for work. I really hate traffic and I hate driving too far to get somewhere, every once in a while is ok. If I moved to Atlanta metro, I would probably live in a smaller suburb a good distance from the city and work in that suburb, then go to the city when I feel the need.
I do like walking places too especially when its a nice day but nothing is that close around here to walk to.
I need a car though cause I love to take road trips.
Last edited by desert sun; 11-30-2009 at 10:06 AM..
I think that is how it's used on sites like this. When I first heard the term "walkable" I assumed it referred to being a place where you can walk everywhere. So like pedestrian safety, good lighting, accessibility, and so forth. Instead it does seem to refer more to everything being in "walking distance", particularly short walks. It apparently doesn't have much, or anything, to do with whether a place is a pleasant and safe environment to walk. It's more about walking being more convenient than other things in said environment. So in theory a "walkable city" could be a place where people don't necessarily want to walk they just do it because it's more convenient.
I guess I can relate to that in some respects. I do like areas where the shops are all close together like plazas and even some malls. However everyone living bunched up and clogging the sidewalks or streets is something I'd be too old to adjust to. I like being able to just stroll along peacefully.
But it is not an either/or proposition. It's not a choice between midtown Manhattan and Sprawlville. There are neighborhoods (like mine) that have high walkability scores but the sidewalks aren't crowded. Admittedly, these neighborhoods are pretty much nonexistent in some aeras of the country (especially the Sunbelt), but no reason new development and re-development can't be steered that way.
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