it's another "what neighborhood should I live in" thread! (Oakland: low income, apartments)

[rascal-c]

hi everyone,

thinking about relocating from LA to SF. I've visited, but only know a little bit about where to actually look for apartments in the city. any suggestions would be appreciated.

Boyfriend and I are in our late 20s and like to be around a variety of great WALKABLE restaurants and fun bars with people in a similar age group. We're renters for now, not buyers, and have no kids. I'd like to avoid the meathead scene and the hipster scene (I lived in Williamsburg Brooklyn in my early 20s, so no more of that, thanks). needs to be somewhat safe for a woman walking home at night. needs to be somewhat central to bart/ac transit to berkeley. currently living in culver city and looking for a similar vibe.

budget is around $2K give or take a little for a 2BR or a big 1BR. Would love to find something with a private outdoor/balcony/garden/roof space.

I think we want to live in SF proper, but not totally sure. I may be taking classes at Cal so we might consider Berkeley, but we're afraid it might be too quiet/hard to meet people there. What do you think? we will most likely be working in the city and will have one or 2 cars (I might get rid of mine depending on where we land.)

where do you think we should look? we have a good 5 years before "settling down" for real, so we'd like to live somewhere fun and alive for the time being. I've lived in NYC, Boston and LA so if you'd like to compare to places there that would be helpful.

thanks!

[UPT Oakland]

You're not going to be able to avoid the hipsters as they have taken over much of the urban bay area. Especially Berkeley. So other than that, I'm going to recommend area's that fit everything else you're looking for, Berkeley, North Oakland-Rock ridge area. Warning both are filled with Hipsters. SF the Marina/Cow Hollow, but again, polluted with yuppies and hipsters.

[rascal-c]

I know that everyone has their own definitions of 'hipsters' - so let me clarify.

when I think of hipsters I don't think of Berkeley. I think of the Mission. Berkeley seems pretty diverse and established while the mission seems to be the equivalent of the bushwick (in NY) / echo park (in LA) scene.

my problem with those neighborhoods (bushwick/echo park) is that there seems to be two main populations: the low income people who are being driven out, and the early 20s hipsters who are too cool and love living in a borderline shady/ghetto hood. I prefer a neighborhood that is a little more established and stable and not so in transition. my current neighborhood in LA certainly has 'hipsters', but it also has families, young people, old people, college kids, professors, black, white, asian, latino, and is pretty middle class and a lot of the residents have been there forever. I like that. I lived in williamsburg, in brooklyn, about 10 years ago because it was 'cool' - and it kind of sucked to be part of that gentrifying wave of a**holes.

anyway - any other suggestions?

[mini_cute]

Hi rascal,

2 places I know you'd want to avoid: Mission - hipsters central and Marina/Cow Hollow - meathead drunk douchebag scene

You might like SoMa (stay east of 4th street)- lots of younger people and near clubs and bars. Not as walkable as other parts of SF, but maybe more in your budget. Plus, it is easier to ride a bike in SoMa to get around since it is flat, and it is just a 30 minute walk to Union Square and downtown. Not sure about where the Bart station is. There is a Caltrain station here along with access to lightrail and the usual buses. Also, easy access to the 80 Bay Bridge and 280 freeways. (Easy access to freeways is kind of a big deal in SF.)

In addition to SoMa, try Dogpatch and Potrero Hill. Those are less industrial, older charming neighborhoods that you might like.

About living in Berkeley or outside of SF city, I've heard lots of people say it is too quiet and boring outside the city. Some people even think Berkeley is boring.

Here are my comparisons of NYC neighborhoods to SF neighborhoods:

Mission - East Village or Lower Eastside or Williamsburg
SoMa - SoHo
Financial District - Financial District or Midtown Manhattan
Pacific Heights - Brooklyn Heights
North Beach - Little Italy
Chinatown - Chinatown
South Park - West Village
Castro - Greenwich Village with a touch of Chelsea and possibly West Village
Mission Bay and South Beach - Dumbo
Richmond near Clement Street - Flushing
Sunset - Queens

Avoid Tenderloin, Western Addition, Bayview and Hunters Pt - dangerous neighborhoods

[gotigers123]

Mini Cute beat me to it, but I'll second most if what she said. Hipsters are in the Mission and Meatheads are in the Marina, so stay away from those areas.

I would disagree with Mini regarding the Western Addition being a dangerous neighborhood though. Parts of it are sketchy, sure, but as a whole the nieghborhood is quite nice.

I would actually recommend the Alamo Square area as a neighborhood that may fit what the OP is looking for. You'd have to take MUNI to BART, but it wouldn't add more than 10-15 minutes to the commute. It's quite diverse, very walkable, and has many beautiful homes. Noe Valley is another decent option, but it's pretty sterile and expensive. Rockridge in Oakland is very nice as someone mentioned, as is area north of Lake Merritt.

Potrero Hill was recommended, but it isn't a very walkable neighborhood outside of a small commercial patch on 18th St. Also, it's not close to BART if you're trying to get to Berkeley.

[Bayarea4]

You might want to check out Noe Valley. Rents tend to be higher, but it's very walkable, the weather is some of the best in the City, and 24th Street is packed with shopping, restaurants and bars.

[mayorhaggar]

Honestly other than in the Mission there aren't that many hipsters in SF. Most people in SF now are either middle class/lower class minorities or white yuppies. But certainly around Valencia and east of there there are a lot of hipsters.

Areas in SF that are walkable and nice areas:

- Noe Valley
- Glen Park
- Inner Richmond
- Inner Sunset
- Bernal Hill (not as walkable because it's up a hill but Coleman has some shops and restaurants on it)
- Hayes Valley

My favorite part of the city is the area between Noe Valley, the Castro, the Mission and Duboce Park. Basically bounded by Castro on the west, Valencia on the east, Market on the North, and maybe 19th on the south. It doesn't really have a name but it is like the Mission but much quieter and safer and is more older people (like late 20's and 30's-40's), some with kids but it's not stroller paradise like Noe Valley is. 18th street and Church have a lot of nice shops and restaurants and there is other stuff on Market. Also it's warmer than the rest of the city but not grubby like the Mission. There are some hipsters hanging out especially in Dolores Park but not as many as around Mission or Valencia. I honestly don't mind the hipsters and I don't see why you would, they can be annoying and condescending if you interact with them but you see them anywhere in the city and if you avoid places like Zeitgeist where they hang out you won't really have to interact with them.

Outside of SF, check out downtown Berkeley, maybe west Berkeley around 4th, also definitely Rockridge in Oakland which sounds like what you are looking for. It feels kind of more upscale than most nice parts of SF but it's still pretty funky and there are a lot of restaurants and bookstores and so on.

[rascal-c]

thanks for all the advice so far! I definitely don't hate hipsters. It's just that I'm not interested in living in a neighborhood where they're the main demographic.

I do like the area around Dolores Park, near Bi Rite. I guess that is technically close to the Mission or in the Mission, but it seemed to be 'city' enough without being too grubby and seemed to be home to a pretty diverse population.

[mayorhaggar]

I guess officially it is part of the Mission. But west of Valencia it feels totally different from anywhere east of Valencia and is a lot quieter and waaaay less grubby. 18th and Church and Market are a little busy because all the shops there but if you go off into the side streets like around Noe St. and 17th or Guerrero and 19th it's nice and quiet. Bi-Rite is definitely pretty nice but expensive, I like their store brand spaghetti sauce and some of the stuff they cook like Shephard's Pie, also they're the only place I've seen Acme bread at which makes the best French baguette I've had in the city.

[rah]

when it comes to the mission and hipsters:

Valencia and westward = hipster central. It's amazing how much Valencia street has gentrified since the hipster hordes began to invade 5-10 years ago.
East of Valencia = way more hipsters than there were a few years ago (especially along 24th), but still dominated by working class/immigrant latinos.