Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Closed Thread Start New Thread
 
Old 06-29-2023, 08:40 AM
 
Location: The Sunshine State of Mind
2,465 posts, read 1,592,249 times
Reputation: 6410

Advertisements

Here's the best argument I've heard for not allowing lower academic performing students into elite university programs. This is a real life example from someone who taught at Cornell University.

Quote:
Despite much media spin, the issue is not whether blacks in general should be admitted to higher ranked or lower ranked institutions. The issue is whether a given black student, with given academic qualifications, should be admitted to a college or university where he would not be admitted if he were white.

Much empirical research over the years has confirmed Justice Scalia's concern that admitting black students to institutions for which their academic preparation is not sufficient can be making them worse off instead of better off.

I became painfully aware of this problem more than 40 years ago, when I was teaching at Cornell University, and discovered that half the black students there were on some form of academic probation.


These students were not stupid or uneducable. On the contrary, the average black student at Cornell at that time scored at the 75th percentile on scholastic tests. Their academic qualifications were better than those of three-quarters of all American students who took those tests.

Why were they in trouble at Cornell, then? Because the average Cornell student in the liberal arts college at that time scored at the 99th percentile. The classes taught there — including mine — moved at a speed geared to the verbal and mathematical level of the top one percent of American students.

The average white student would have been wiped out at Cornell. But the average white student was unlikely to be admitted to Cornell, in the first place. Nor was a white student who scored at the 75th percentile.


That was a "favor" reserved for black students. This "favor" turned black students who would have been successful at most American colleges and universities into failures at Cornell.
link

Government programs turning future successes into failures. But they meant well and their hearts were in the right place. Too many government help programs look good on paper but fail to deliver the promised results.

 
Old 06-29-2023, 08:40 AM
 
9,706 posts, read 4,484,342 times
Reputation: 10852
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRM20 View Post
Merit is not measurable. Humans aren't widgets and can't be measured with any great amount of accuracy.
Sure it is. Saying it isn't is just a way of not holding people accountable.
 
Old 06-29-2023, 08:42 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,811 posts, read 45,467,143 times
Reputation: 13946
I know Babylon Bee is satire, but THIS is the actual TRUTH. ...

Quote:
"Democrats in mourning today after the Supreme Court ruled that racial discrimination in college admissions is unconstitutional."
Democrats Devastated As Supreme Court Bans Racism
 
Old 06-29-2023, 08:42 AM
 
8,949 posts, read 3,012,893 times
Reputation: 5189
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRM20 View Post
Merit is not measurable. Humans aren't widgets and can't be measured with any great amount of accuracy.
You're saying academic accomplishments can't be measured?

You're saying charitable and volunteer activities can't be measured?

You're saying performance in sports can't be measured?

You're saying the perception of others in your sphere about you can't be measured?

Why not?
 
Old 06-29-2023, 08:42 AM
 
32,346 posts, read 27,576,325 times
Reputation: 25331
Quote:
Originally Posted by prospectheightsresident View Post
I'm reading the opinion, but still curious how the Supreme Court justified ruling against Harvard on 14th Amendment (vice Title VI) grounds as the 14th Amendment prohibits certain government action. Harvard, as a private organization, is not the government.
Harvard like nearly every other college/university in USA takes federal funding (student financial aid). When you take the king's coin you must sing the king's tune.

https://www.hhs.gov/civil-rights/for...cs/needy-famil

This applies up and down from housing to healthcare and so forth. Hospitals were integrated once Medicare and later Medicaid were created. There isn't a hospital/medical center in USA that can survive without one or both so there you are. Obama used same laws to stamp out discrimination against LGBT in healthcare/hospitals. He also did it (and Biden is expanding upon) in education as again nearly every primary and secondary pubic school in this country receives federal funding.


If you will recall the Boy Scouts of USA were given a green light by SCOTUS to discriminate against LGBT because they truly are a private entity, no federal money involved.
 
Old 06-29-2023, 08:45 AM
 
Location: Hoosierville
17,961 posts, read 15,006,717 times
Reputation: 11942
Quote:
Originally Posted by prospectheightsresident View Post
Not considering race doesn't mean that schools have to consider academic merit, alone. I suspect that things like extracurricular activities, etc., will still play an important role in admissions.
Essays will now play the biggest part in allowing higher ed to continue race based discrimination.
 
Old 06-29-2023, 08:45 AM
 
6,110 posts, read 2,321,622 times
Reputation: 4787
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ponderosa View Post
The Ivy League will now become the Asian League schools as blacks, hispanics and yes, whites too, all come up short on meritorious admission. Whites will still be accepted though as legacy admissions.
Yep. Legacy admissions, "academic scholarships" for sports that most high schools do not have like Rowing, Skull, Lacross, water polo, and interpretative dance, and kids of donors.

I don't think it will change much outside of perhaps taking some places from African American students and sliding them to Asian students. The White students that have complained about Affirmative Action are likely not legacy, are not in the upper class so no Rowing or lacross at their school, cannot afford a big donation, and scholarships help for Affirmative Action would likely go to an Asian student or a donor kid.


When you have 61,221 Applicants and 1,984 Admitted, a lot of people with excellent marks are getting rejected.

https://college.harvard.edu/admissio...ons-statistics
 
Old 06-29-2023, 08:46 AM
 
Location: Sunny So. Cal.
4,531 posts, read 1,802,059 times
Reputation: 3413
Quote:
Originally Posted by FordBronco1967 View Post
Glad to hear the Supreme Court just ended systemic racism in America!
If only…
 
Old 06-29-2023, 08:55 AM
 
8,949 posts, read 3,012,893 times
Reputation: 5189
Quote:
Originally Posted by stone26 View Post
If only…
We know, we know. You'll always claim it's there. It's too profitable. It's just like "global warming." It's a problem that will never be "solved." By design!

You guys are clever.
 
Old 06-29-2023, 08:55 AM
 
6,088 posts, read 2,870,492 times
Reputation: 3582
This is a win for the 14th amendment.

Anyone else notice that the left is upset by this...LOL
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top