what do you think of Scandinavian Democratic socialism? (minimum wage, cost, dollar)
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what do you think of Scandinavian Democratic socialism?
If you prefer call them "Social Democratic"
because technically they don't have nationalized industries and are not truly socialist
Basically they have high taxes which enables them to provide comprehensive free healthcare and higher education. They are also democratic and have free market capitalism and private companies.
This has gone on for years and millionaires and billionaires haven't run away due to the higher taxes.
These countries are generally safer and are generally more livable than many parts of the U.S.
So what do you think of these countries system as compared to ours?
There's a good reason for that. Scandinavian countries don't have a FATCA law like the US, so they can hide income and assets in offshore tax havens to avoid taxes, at will, without violating any tax laws.
Prime example: Swedish citizen Ingvar Kamprad (founder of IKEA). He amassed his personal fortune of billions of $$$ while not paying one thin dime in taxes to Sweden. He merely lived abroad and structured the registration of IKEA in a foreign country. As doing so is perfectly legal in Sweden to avoid taxes, it's easy to understand why Sweden has a higher per capita number of billionaires than the US.
The US and Eritrea are the only countries in the world that tax their citizens regardless of where their citizens live, worldwide, and regardless of in which country their income was earned.
Last edited by InformedConsent; 10-31-2020 at 07:41 AM..
"Oh, sure — the idea of taking in thousands of unassimilated and hostile Muslims into Sweden's cities may have sounded great to the country's central planners. Its own population after all, is in a death spiral as a result of its past socialist policies, which created a high-cost, low-marriage, low-child, graying country with a potential pension crisis. But Sweden also wanted to virtue-signal to other countries as it opened its gates to all comers and drew all that U.N. praise.
What this report signals is that Sweden ended up exchanging its well educated, law-abiding, and high-social-capital population for an unemployable, uneducated, lawless, and low-social-capital one. The central planning here — and as this excellent New York Post article notes, it is a country with a lot of central planning — didn't quite work out the way they thought it would. Sweden isn't gaining the population its social engineers thought it would gain from this top-down maneuver; it's actually losing its most productive citizens as an unintended consequence, because for every unassimilated refugee coming in, a Swede is moving out.
Now it's the Swedes who are voting with their feet. "
As someone who lived in Sweden, I will take the US any day of the week.
The Swedish model works for Swedes, they are generally a work ethic type culture, not really the type to game the system, hell, look at their birth rates despite the generous child care benefits they receive.
Such a system will never work with a significant part of the population gaming it for all they can.
As for healthcare, I take the US of Sweden, despite all the glory, when it comes to a serious issue, cancer for example, I rather be in the US. If it is some run of the mill issue, then Sweden. Same with college, yea, free, but that free comes with the fact there is limited access.
And as another poster mentioned, Sweden essentially is riding the coattails of the US and its innovation.
All in all, if the most I ever want to strive for is to flip burgers for a living, then Sweden, if I strive to do a bit more in life than that, then the US.
Everyone should read your post, it’s excellent. Great comparison of pros and cons in a short format.
These countries can only provide the healthcare they provide because the US innovates. I hate big pharma but the fact is that we innovate, they piggyback off of us, and fools think they make everything happen on their own
Our efforts, taxes, and systems allow them to operate as they do. They don't deserve any credit for their health care, American tax payers do.
You are wrong. The two biggest pharmaceutical companies are Swiss - Roche and Novartis. Other companies in the top ten include Sanofi (French), GSK (British) and Takeda (Japanese).
You are wrong. The two biggest pharmaceutical companies are Swiss - Roche and Novartis. Other companies in the top ten include Sanofi (French), GSK (British) and Takeda (Japanese).
Swedish companies include Volvo, Ericsson, Saab AB, and IKEA. For its size, I’d say Sweden holds its own.
I think most people don't have a clue how the taxes in Scandanavian nations work, and if those tax laws were proposed in the US, the Democrats and liberal media would complain that it was right wing corporatism.
Massive regressive taxes on the poor and middle class? Check.
Super low corporate taxes? Check.
Super low investment and financial transaction taxes? Check.
The effective personal tax rates ACROSS THE BOARD in Scandanavian nations are like 65-75%, and the corporate taxes are like 10-20%.
Sweden, paraphrasing an ex-finance minister type, figured out after their disastrous foray into boilerplate socialism in the 70s and 80s, that you can have big government or you can soak just the rich/corporations, but you cannot have both at the same time. The uncaring, immutable mathematics say nope.
Also, people struggle just as much if not more with debt in Scandanavia as they do in the US. Everything isn't "free" in their version of socialism, and most people only keep 25-30 cents of each dollar they earn...at best. Poor and rich alike, you pretty much keep one quarter of every dollar, and the government gets the rest. Yeah, college TUITION is free, but rent, food, clothing, etc aren't. That quarter of every dollar pays for all that. Student loan debt in Scandanavia is HUGE, they just took on the debt to pay rent and buy food in places where cost of living is essentially like SanFran or Manhattan.
It isn't the kittens and rainbows paradise everyone envisions because our socialist politicians lie about how it actually functions.
Swedish companies include Volvo, Ericsson, Saab AB, and IKEA. For its size, I’d say Sweden holds its own.
Interesting, that. As I've already posted... Prime example: Swedish citizen Ingvar Kamprad (founder of IKEA). He amassed his personal fortune of billions of $$$ while not paying one thin dime in taxes to Sweden. He merely lived abroad and structured the registration of IKEA in a foreign country. As doing so is perfectly legal in Sweden to avoid taxes, it's easy to understand why Sweden has a higher per capita number of billionaires than the US.
The US and Eritrea are the only countries in the world that tax their citizens regardless of where their citizens live, worldwide, and regardless of in which country their income was earned.
I think most people don't have a clue how the taxes in Scandanavian nations work, and if those tax laws were proposed in the US, the Democrats and liberal media would complain that it was right wing corporatism.
Massive regressive taxes on the poor and middle class? Check.
Super low corporate taxes? Check.
Super low investment and financial transaction taxes? Check.
The effective personal tax rates ACROSS THE BOARD in Scandanavian nations are like 65-75%, and the corporate taxes are like 10-20%.
Sweden, paraphrasing an ex-finance minister type, figured out after their disastrous foray into boilerplate socialism in the 70s and 80s, that you can have big government or you can soak just the rich/corporations, but you cannot have both at the same time. The uncaring, immutable mathematics say nope.
Also, people struggle just as much if not more with debt in Scandanavia as they do in the US. Everything isn't "free" in their version of socialism, and most people only keep 30-35 cents of each dollar they earn...at best. Poor and alike, you pretty much keep one quarter of every dollar, and the government gets the rest. Yeah, college TUITION is free, but rent, food, clothing, etc aren't. That quarter of every dollar pays for all that. Student loan debt in Scandanavia is HUGE, they just took on the debt to pay rent and buy food in places where cost of living is essentially like SanFran or Manhattan.
It isn't the kittens and rainbows paradise everyone envisions because our socialist politicians lie about how it actually functions.
And don't forget they can hide their income and assets in offshore accounts because it's legal in Scandinavian countries to do so, no FATCA law as we have in the US. I've already posted on that. Go back and read my posts.
And don't forget they can hide their income and assets in offshore accounts because it's legal in Scandinavian countries to do so, no FATCA law as we have in the US. I've already posted on that. Go back and read my posts.
I know that. I was saying that even if the corporation stays within Sweden's borders and does everything all patriotic and all, they average about 15% in corporate tax, since Sweden knows that consumers pay those taxes anyway. That's why their laws about off shoring profits are so generous. They know who actually pays corporate taxes, that those people are already taxed damn near to death, and punitive taxes even in theory drives business away instead of encouraging it domestically.
Basically, most Scandanavian tax law is grounded in the reality and mathematics of how much big government costs and how revenue is actually generated.
I know that. I was saying that even if the corporation stays within Sweden's borders and does everything all patriotic and all, they average about 15% in corporate tax, since Sweden knows that consumers pay those taxes anyway. That's why their laws about off shoring profits are so generous. They know who actually pays corporate taxes, that those people are already taxed damn near to death, and punitive taxes even in theory drives business away instead of encouraging it domestically.
Basically, most Scandanavian tax law is grounded in the reality and mathematics of how much big government costs and how revenue is actually generated.
100% correct.
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