Ron Paul Right, Thought Controllers Wrong, On Secession (middle east, generation, borders)

[crbcrbrgv]

Originally Posted by Hot_Handz

If you think influence gets you elected...and even more, that being an elected official is reflective of capacity....I have a bridge to sell you.

Is the bridge built by Ron Paul?

Or is it built by using some sort of Ron Paul calculus that Paul supporters tell themselves is correct to make themselves feel better?

[HistorianDude]

Originally Posted by RebelYell14

If you think he had no influence you are either a fool or blind.

Remove the scales from my eyes. Tell me one significant accomplishment he can boast of in his 23 years as a member of the most powerful legislative body on the planet. Almost nothing he supported ever actually happened. Not term limits. Not a return to the gold standard. Not the prevention of reimplementation of draft registration. Of the 620 bills that Paul had sponsored through December 2011, over a period of more than 22 years in Congress, only one had been signed into law – a lifetime success rate of less than 0.3%. The sole measure authored by Paul that was ultimately enacted allowed for a federal customhouse to be sold to a local historic preservation society (H.R. 2121 in 2009).

So tell me again about my blindness and foolishness. I love the smell of irony in the morning.

Originally Posted by RebelYell14

And he matters why? Because you say he does?

Because he is the most conservative voice on the US Supreme Court and even he thinks you secessionists are nut burgers.

[Bulldawg82]

Originally Posted by HistorianDude

Not according to the people whose opinion actually matters.

"If there was any constitutional issue resolved by the Civil War, it is that there is no right to secede."

~ Justice Antonin Scalia

I'm not for secession, but the wording in our Declaration of Independence clearly state the right to do so is inherent to all people's. if this document has no legal standing, then neither does our constitution or any other laws, and our nation is illegitimate.

[HistorianDude]

Originally Posted by Hot_Handz

I guess the end all, be all is the word of one of the most corrupt SC justices ever....

Nice red herring. I decline to chase it with you.

[Hot_Handz]

Originally Posted by crbcrbrgv

Is the bridge built by Ron Paul?

Or is it built by using some sort of Ron Paul calculus that Paul supporters tell themselves is correct to make themselves feel better?

What is this "Ron Paul calculus" that you speak of???

Are you talking about Austrian Theory???

Sorry that you have a problem with straightforward math where people across the whole spectrum can discern whether they are being worked over or not.

If anybody is deluded by convoluted language, it's Keynesians.

[Hot_Handz]

Originally Posted by HistorianDude

Nice red herring. I decline to chase it with you.

Red herrings are rather benign when opinions are being thrown around...

If it was something factual, then you'd be onto something. Until then.... have fun!

[HistorianDude]

Originally Posted by Bulldawg82

I'm not for secession, but the wording in our Declaration of Independence clearly state the right to do so is inherent to all people's. if this document has no legal standing, then neither does our constitution or any other laws, and our nation is illegitimate.

I have very bad news for you. The Declaration of Independence has no legal standing of the sort you are imagining here. It was a declaration of war, not a foundational legal framework. The authority of the Constitution cannot be compared in any way with the authority of the Declaration. That would be like comparing manatees and mangroves.

[HistorianDude]

Originally Posted by Hot_Handz

Red herrings are rather benign when opinions are being thrown around...

That does not magically make them worthy of pursuit.

[EinsteinsGhost]

Originally Posted by Hot_Handz

I guess the end all, be all is the word of one of the most corrupt SC justices ever....

Corrupt or conservative with power, I see no difference between the two.

Originally Posted by Bulldawg82

I'm not for secession, but the wording in our Declaration of Independence clearly state the right to do so is inherent to all people's. if this document has no legal standing, then neither does our constitution or any other laws, and our nation is illegitimate.

Stupid assumption, but the premise of the argument.

[Bulldawg82]

Originally Posted by HistorianDude

I have very bad news for you. The Declaration of Independence has no legal standing of the sort you are imagining here. It was a declaration of war, not a foundational legal framework. The authority of the Constitution cannot be compared in any way with the authority of the Declaration. That would be like comparing manatees and mangroves.

So you are saying that our Supreme Court ( or the law of the land - as it now stands) does not recognize the legality of our own Declaration of Independence? The wording to this document (by the same framers of our constitution) was penned with legality in mind. It declares the right of all people to sever the political tie when it has been deemed reasonable by the very laws of nature. If our legal system says that these laws of nature are subservient to man-made laws, then we are no better than the empire we seceded from. Even our founders acknowledged the superiority of this natural law.