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Old 09-12-2012, 04:50 AM
 
15,706 posts, read 11,821,104 times
Reputation: 7022

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Quote:
Originally Posted by afoigrokerkok View Post
Romney's plan calls for North American energy independence by 2020.

Does Obama have a goal for ever achieving energy independence?
And Romney is an idiot if he thinks that will actually happen.
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Old 09-12-2012, 05:12 AM
 
24,208 posts, read 15,276,309 times
Reputation: 13092
Every time we step into a store and buy imported stuff, we are raising the standard of living in that country.

Every time somebody buys a gas guzzling car, we are putting a demand on supply.

Every time we drive like we are on a racetrack, we are putting a demand on supply.

My 10 year old grandson can figure the consequences of supply and demand.
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Old 09-12-2012, 05:19 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,849,914 times
Reputation: 9728
I guess that is just the beginning. Several major economies are in bad shape, and the heating season has not even started yet. As far as oil and thus gas prices, the only way is up...

Some experts have been warning us of such a development for a long time, for decades actually. All those wind turbines in the countryside are just drops in the ocean of oil. We have just started to move away from oil and need to speed the process up quite a bit.
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Old 09-12-2012, 06:24 AM
 
Location: the dairyland
1,222 posts, read 2,287,106 times
Reputation: 1731
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
I guess that is just the beginning. Several major economies are in bad shape, and the heating season has not even started yet. As far as oil and thus gas prices, the only way is up...
Who knows, with the recession in Europe and the slowdown in China demand might actually decline, which is going to bring down prices, too. Happened in 08/09 as well.

Gas prices are one thing, but nowadays the automobile industry makes cars that are a lot more fuel efficient than in the past, so the overall cost for driving is hopefully going to stay affordable. If you consider how many people still drive like crazy, even just to pick up their mail, own huge cars with a low mpg... I sometimes think that gas prices are not high enough yet.
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Old 09-12-2012, 06:31 AM
 
1,652 posts, read 2,560,116 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Follower Of X View Post
For the first time were I live gas has hit the 4 dollar mark. We've been building hybrids for almost 10 years now and we have big ugly wind turbines popping up all over but yet gas prices are still rising.

I guess I could be over reacting, after all we have the Obama volt.

FORWARD
Complains about high gas prices.

Mocks a US company developing cutting edge electric/hybrid car technology with it's Gov't support. (much like the Japanese Gov't supported Toyota's Hybrid development)

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Old 09-12-2012, 07:11 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,849,914 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob702 View Post
Who knows, with the recession in Europe and the slowdown in China demand might actually decline, which is going to bring down prices, too. Happened in 08/09 as well.

Gas prices are one thing, but nowadays the automobile industry makes cars that are a lot more fuel efficient than in the past, so the overall cost for driving is hopefully going to stay affordable. If you consider how many people still drive like crazy, even just to pick up their mail, own huge cars with a low mpg... I sometimes think that gas prices are not high enough yet.
Yes, cars' mileage is improving, but then again, on a global scale there are more and more cars, probably eating up all the savings due to technical progress. Every additional car registered in India or China undoes the improved mileage of a car in the US or Europe.

Plus, the gas price depends on the oil price, and that is going to rise as oil is used in more and more stuff such as plastics.

Sure, prices might relax a bit from time to time, but the overall long-term tendency is up.

By the way, the gas price over here in Portugal is 1.9 Euro per liter, i.e. about 7.5 Euros/9 Dollars per gallon
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Old 09-12-2012, 07:19 AM
 
Location: Londonderry, NH
41,458 posts, read 59,983,407 times
Reputation: 24868
I wonder if the Oil Companies realize that high fuel prices are destroying our economy. Maybe they simply do not care as they have developing markets elsewhere in the world that will pay even more. I wonder what gasoline cost in India or Pakistan or Indonesia.

FWIW - Gasoline in Venezuela is priced on recovery and refining costs and they only charge about $0.25 a gallon. Diesel fuel is even less expensive.
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Old 09-12-2012, 07:32 AM
 
8,650 posts, read 17,287,658 times
Reputation: 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
I guess that is just the beginning. Several major economies are in bad shape, and the heating season has not even started yet. As far as oil and thus gas prices, the only way is up...

Some experts have been warning us of such a development for a long time, for decades actually. All those wind turbines in the countryside are just drops in the ocean of oil. We have just started to move away from oil and need to speed the process up quite a bit.
Oil is not used to make electricity.......
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Old 09-12-2012, 09:11 AM
 
79,909 posts, read 44,427,722 times
Reputation: 17214
Many good points here. Many misplaced ones. In the end, it is not oil that is the problem, it is as noted, the policy of a weak dollar. Supply and demand is not driving the price. Government monetary policy is.

The Volt nor Hybrids are the problem. There is nothing inherantly wrong with either. (politics aside).

Let's take a look at the two different ways we could have went.

We decided that pumping the markets full of money and keeping rates artificially at record lows was the way to go. That policy has caused prices for most things to rise. It was indeed inflated the markets but that has done very little for the economy. The markets do not equal the economy. Low rates have done little for housing.

Let's say that the government took the other avenue. What if gas was still $2.25 and the prices of everyday items like groceries were not going up monthly? People would have far more to spend today. If the government would come out and state that they were going to allow rates to rise, there would be an immediate boost in the housing market with people wanting to get in before rates go up. Same with cars and other large ticket items. Business hires.

Before long those who had retired but had to get back ino the market because their savings was no longer provided for them could retire again. More jobs open up.

People are reluctant to get into the markets because of all the corruption that has been ignored. In reality, has been rewarded.

The government has done pretty much the opposite of what should have been done in every aspect. This is far more a problem with government than Obama. It was this way under Bush and it will still be under Romney.
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Old 09-12-2012, 09:20 AM
 
Location: Murika
2,526 posts, read 3,013,649 times
Reputation: 1929
Perhaps we ought to place the oil industry under government control if you don't like the way the free market is working out for you?

Perhaps you should find fault in city planners who were too dumb to realize that creating communities where you cannot do ANYTHING unless you get into a car is not the brightest idea.

Perhaps you should find fault with those people who demanded and created an infrastructure that mainly moves goods via roadway without much possibility for alternative means.

But none of that is relevant. Even though it is more than evident that what we are doing is really asinine, all you can do is whine about what it costs you without EVER entertaining any ideas that it doesn't have to be that way. After all, renewing infrastructure and compromising the way you DESERVE to live is communist/socialist bullcrap. Never mind that the increasing price of gas is forcing you to compromise even more.
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