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Old 12-14-2007, 11:17 AM
 
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Okay, so I guess it really isn't good and bad news, it's more like good and "meh" news.



The good news:
Due to the casino fund predicted to reach roughly 700 million dollars by April (well over the 570 million needed to begin tax relief), Harrisburg announced today that they also predict property tax relief will begin taking effect in 2008.

That's good news and also shows that this is INDEED real. Many people were skeptical, but Ed Rendell has been true to his word (and contracts, duh) and Pennsylvania home owners across the board will see property tax relief.

The "meh" news:
At least initially, it will be a very modest amount. Ed Rendell has said in the past that a probable conservative estimate will be roughly $250 per home-owner.

In Westmoreland County, where my parents live, my dad did the calculations and found out it would roughly be, for him, like a drop in property tax/school tax of about 9%. That's...... not bad, and like he said, "I'LL TAKE IT!"

Anyway.

By 2009, when several more casino facilities are opened, Harrisburg announced that they anticipate an increase of at least $300 or more per home-owner.

As long as the casino's keep making revenue, the amount will go up.

So, every little bit helps. Do I think this news is particularly thrilling? No. But it's a start, it's a kept promise, and it is relief with more coming in the future.

The end

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07348/841667-336.stm

Last edited by guylocke; 12-14-2007 at 11:38 AM..
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Old 12-14-2007, 11:41 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guylocke View Post
Okay, so I guess it really isn't good and bad news, it's more like good and "meh" news.

The "meh" news:
At least initially, it will be a very modest amount. Ed Rendell has said in the past that a probable conservative estimate will be roughly $250 per home-owner.

So, every little bit helps. Do I think this news is particularly thrilling? No. But it's a start, it's a kept promise, and it is relief with more coming in the future.
I agree that it is not particularly thrilling. I would be happier with that modest amount if it was due to reducing the size of or increasing the efficiency of PA state government.

Instead the "relief" is due to imposing a new tax on a new industry (gambling) and kicking a fraction of it back to property owners, after Harrisburg takes a cut to increase its budget/spending.
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Old 12-14-2007, 01:21 PM
 
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Instead the "relief" is due to imposing a new tax on a new industry (gambling) and kicking a fraction of it back to property owners, after Harrisburg takes a cut to increase its budget/spending.
I dunno, that could be partially true, but I think this casino initiative is fine so far. First off, I'm not inherently against gambling, we are are a free people and should reasonably be able to do what we want with our money as long as it doesn't hurt anybody. Second of all, a lot of that money will go to some good things including the local counties, the tourism trade of Pennsylvania, property tax relief, and of course, state funding. I'm not sure exactly what the state funding is. Is it just plugging in holes to make up for bad budgeting or is it specifically more money to fund certain projects?

I guess what I'm trying to say is, is all this casino state funding due to the fact that PA was desperate for more revenue and had to come up with something or will a lot of this money simply be "extra" money to fund special interests that the state normally doesn't have an exorbitant amount of money to fund.

Maybe a little of both, if you ask me.
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Old 12-14-2007, 01:34 PM
 
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The sad thing is, if the state wasn't so corrupt, our property taxes (excluding school) should be $Zero. We basically spend all our property taxes on funding absurd pensions, salaries, and benefits of an elite group of people.
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Old 12-17-2007, 10:17 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guylocke View Post
First off, I'm not inherently against gambling, we are are a free people and should reasonably be able to do what we want with our money as long as it doesn't hurt anybody.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, is all this casino state funding due to the fact that PA was desperate for more revenue and had to come up with something or will a lot of this money simply be "extra" money to fund special interests that the state normally doesn't have an exorbitant amount of money to fund.
Sure, in an ideal world people would game responsibly and no one would get hurt (and expect the government to bail them out). Sadly, we don't live in an ideal world.

Only 61.8% of the casino tax is being used for property tax relief. The rest the state has targeted towards police/fire/services and pork barrel projects like hockey arenas, convention center expansions, and race horse development. See:

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07292/826723-336.stm
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Old 12-17-2007, 11:20 AM
 
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Originally Posted by scrapp View Post
Sure, in an ideal world people would game responsibly and no one would get hurt (and expect the government to bail them out). Sadly, we don't live in an ideal world.

Only 61.8% of the casino tax is being used for property tax relief. The rest the state has targeted towards police/fire/services and pork barrel projects like hockey arenas, convention center expansions, and race horse development. See:

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07292/826723-336.stm
Very sad. We could have had a free arena had they chose the other Company. Very sad that 100% couldn't have gone to property tax relief. That could have helped Pennsylvania a lot when attracting new people.
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Old 12-17-2007, 12:59 PM
 
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Quote:
Only 61.8% of the casino tax is being used for property tax relief. The rest the state has targeted towards police/fire/services and pork barrel projects like hockey arenas, convention center expansions, and race horse development. See:
Yes but I'm not really against this. It was never claimed that all the revenue would go to property relief nor should it. We have other problems other than property tax relief. It will also fuel millions in the tourism trade, too.

As far as I'm concerned, I'm happy. The Casino's have brought in thousands of jobs, and are giving me 9% back in taxes, fueling some great things including our men in arms, and will also fuel other revenue making projects and tourism.

Who is losing in this situation again? Btw, there is also a special fund set aside from the state out of the revenue to specifically meet the needs of addict counseling and gambling addition programs, etc.

I mean, I realize Casino's CAN open a whole can of worms and that certain cities have gone to hell because of gambling industry (I seriously doubt ONE casino would do it).

A lot of problems could arise, but so far, I'm perfectly content with Ed Rendell's proposals.
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Old 12-18-2007, 07:41 AM
 
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Originally Posted by guylocke View Post
As far as I'm concerned, I'm happy. The Casino's have brought in thousands of jobs, and are giving me 9% back in taxes, fueling some great things including our men in arms, and will also fuel other revenue making projects and tourism.

Who is losing in this situation again?
Losers (in my opinion): taxpayers, people in favor of smaller more efficient government, people susceptible to gambling addiction, people who don't like large boxy parking garages on the riverfront, and likely northsiders who don't want a bunch of pawn shops, payday loan stores, etc. in their area.
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Old 12-18-2007, 08:47 AM
 
2,218 posts, read 1,946,667 times
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Originally Posted by right-here-i-say View Post
Very sad. We could have had a free arena had they chose the other Company. Very sad that 100% couldn't have gone to property tax relief. That could have helped Pennsylvania a lot when attracting new people.
The whole issue of property tax relief is becoming a ludicrous cliche. I have a hard time respecting people who can't see how good they have it. You never see these people complain about the extraordinarily low costs of property in the region. Can't you see that the two are inextricably related?
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Old 12-18-2007, 09:22 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Merge View Post
The whole issue of property tax relief is becoming a ludicrous cliche. I have a hard time respecting people who can't see how good they have it. You never see these people complain about the extraordinarily low costs of property in the region. Can't you see that the two are inextricably related?
I guess we can't try to improve the state.
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