The decline of the suburban shopping mall. (Pittsburgh, Liberty: for sale, salon)

[lifepgh2op]

Still hoping that Great Wolf Lodge will open at Pittsburgh Mills and make the area a destination to the Tri-State.

[gg]

Originally Posted by Herodotus

Well, you know how it usually plays out. What was once a horrible bottleneck, will soon be a quick, smooth ride into town (for the time being). I bet the developers are drawing up plans, and working on corny names now.
Evergreen Heights
Maple Lane Village
Fairview Acres

Ugh!

Those names are too funny. I always thought once 28 got developed that the entire region up through there would go crazy, but I am not sure that will happen. The housing market in general is sort of flat or maybe a little better than flat. The schools up through there aren't exactly stellar and not really all the welcoming to outsiders, or should I say they don't care for too much change. Taxes aren't very conducive. West Deer would be about $3,200 per $100K of value. What can you build these days for $200,000? Not much, so you are talking about some pretty high taxes. Are people going to deal with $9k in tax living up that way?

I am not sure what will happen in this market. I do think there will be some sprawl, but I don't think we are going to see a Cranberry or anything near such a thing.

[gg]

Originally Posted by lifepgh2op

Still hoping that Great Wolf Lodge will open at Pittsburgh Mills and make the area a destination to the Tri-State.

I think that would be a huge help.

[SlurmsMcKenzie]

I'm sure an area like Sarver or Freeport will see a decent bump when 28 is done. I'm not sure if there will ever be enough growth in that corridor to justify the Mills. There aren't any top 5 school districts up there and the terrain (lots of steep hills and valleys) doesn't lend itself to easy subdivision building. It was heartbreaking to witness such a huge swath of untouched forested hillside fall to development. I hope all involved lost money in that fiasco.

I think the Mall at Robinson does well because they built it quite a while after other shopping attractions were up and running (the 3 or 4 strip malls between Kohls and Best Buy). They knew they had a solid market since everything thing else was doing well, as opposed to the scenario where box stores leech business from a mall. I personally like the mall there because while often busy, parking is much easier to find than at Ross. Also, I can usually get to the mall quickly while avoiding the general traffic mess on the road between Ikea and Target. The mall also has a nice niche: certainly a little classier than most malls but definitely not in the high end tier of Ross.

[SorryIMovedBack]

LOL @ at mall that has "multiple Asian massage parlors" -- Too funny!

As for people not shopping:
-- Less disposable income nowadays makes people more conservative than they used to be.
-- Competition from online vendors, although you still can't try on clothes via the Internet (haha)
-- All stores have the same cheap Chinese-made junk, in the same colors, so you get the same thing everywhere. Total lack of originality. Shopping = very BORING, now. Even we women say so. Guys have always thought it boring.
Women's clothing continues to wallow in the '60s/'70s. I hated that stuff when I was a kid. I won't buy any of it now. I can sew better clothing and it looks like quality.
-- Shoes: I am a woman who likes shoes, like the leather ones that we used to get from USA, Brazil, Italy, Spain. Chinese shoes = cheap chit. 'Nuff said.
-- Housewares: My bone china is Castleton Jubilee made in the late '40s into the '50s, in New Castle, PA. My everyday is Pfaltzgraff from when Pfaltzgraff was made in the USA and there was a big Pfaltzgraff store at the Grove City outlets. My cookware is a mix of '90s Farberware and also vintage Farberware and Revereware that I bought in thrift stores in Canonsburg and Washington. Somebody used that vintage cookware daily for 30-50 years before I bought it, most likely. And I will never wear it out in my lifetime. No need to shop for housewares.
-- Vacuum cleaners: I own a vintage Hoover that I can't get parts for, a '90s self-propelled Hoover that I can't get parts for, and a Riccar commercial vac that I have a stockpile of parts for. Looks like I am set for life now, lol.
-- Sheets and other linens: No icy woven percale sheets in the stores = I am not going to buy. Shove yer microfiber, sateens, flimsy muslins, etc. Ditto for polyester comforter sets and the like. Really, I am sick of your Chinese chit imports, Stores.

Really, can the buyers for stores not see that customers are tired of all the JUNK! that comes from China. Not to mention that the people who lost their manufacturing jobs here probably don't shop as much as they used to. ;-)

[sparrowmint]

Whatever happens to the Mills, I hope the theatre stays open. Their IMAX, while still a fake one, is way better than the embarrassment at the Waterfront (plus there's a Sonic out there. A++).

[jay5835]

Have you seen the Dead Malls website?

DeadMalls.com

[Tallysmom]

My mom, like most of her generation, was a stay at home mom. She could take the time to go to a mall and shop. It was whole day for her to go to North Hills Village and Horne's, then to Kaufmanns, then down the road to Gimbels. There was always a stop for me at Woolworths to look at the birds and pick up a little craft project and mom some sewing needles or other sewing supplies. (I loved little embroidery dresser scarves, little crewel pictures -- and Woolworths was THE place for that) (By the way -- mom LOVED Kaufmann's fabric department -- she bought TONS of material there for our clothing -- she sewed a lot -- wonder where I got it from?)

Now -- who has time to wander a mall? Indoor malls are passé. I work outside the home, I work inside the home and I do not have time to wander around a mall all day. I know what store I want to go into, and I would rather drive up, park in front of it, get what I need and LEAVE. As for online shopping -- yeah -- I do that, too. Some things you just can't online shop for -- in sewing and quilting colors are problematic online. There are a few places I trust, though and that helps.

Out here, we've been moving away from indoor shopping malls to outdoor shopping centers. You have a complex of many buildings, six to twelve shops in each building each with their own parking areas. The whole complex is the same footprint area wise as a mall, but it can fit in an odd lot -- instead a huge square, this takes up a long stretch. It's usually cheaper for the stores to be located in a place like this -- no massive overhead of helping to pay for maintenance, lighting and decorating on a whole structure. You only have to pony up a smaller fee to help pay for a truck to come in and vacuum up the parking lots and change out garbage can liners and clean a few restrooms.

There is flexibility here, too -- some of these stores are TINY -- and there are businesses out there who need tiny... these things fit.

And while our indoor malls have the large empty spots -- the outdoor malls DON'T, as a general rule. When something goes out, within weeks signage goes up that something else will be opening in a month or two.

We've just had a shift on our lifestyles, I think. I mean -- hubby and I go on outings -- I go fabric shop hopping and he'll hit the thrift stores in the areas..... but we don't do that more than twice a year.

[ferraris]

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

We actually like Pittsburgh Mills exactly for the reason that it is so desolate. When we want to go to Olive Garden we rarely, if ever, have to wait at the one here while we typically can't even get a parking spot at the one in Green Tree. It's the same story with just about every other restaurant and retailer up there.

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

Ugh. More urban sprawl? Really? I sure hope not.

I find these two posts in succession of each other kind of ironic. Why wouldn't they keep building out there, where it is cheaper, if people from as far away as Polish Hill are coming? I do my fair share of suburban dining, mostly because of where my girlfriend's family lives, but we try to stick with the Northside, or at least Bellevue, for dining when they aren't involved.

There's a Spaghetti Warehouse right in the strip for all your chain-Italian dining needs, not to mention Bloomfield! Like I said I'm completely guilty of driving as far as Monroeville, Bridgeville, and Robinson for food, so don't take it as a stab at you, just a gentle nudge.

[gg]

Originally Posted by ferrarisnowday

There's a Spaghetti Warehouse right in the strip for all your chain-Italian dining needs, not to mention Bloomfield.

Olive Garden is better than the Spaghetti Warehouse.

I am curious. What Italian restaurant is good in the so-called little Italy (Bloomfield)? I am not trying to be a jerk about it, so keep in mind I am asking a question here, not really trying to prove any point regarding Bloomfield's Italian restaurant scene.