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Anyone who ingests a glass of wine at dinner or a couple of beer on a daily basis is an alcoholic.Whether it be a bottle of wine-- or half a bottle of whiskey...on a daily basis is also an alcoholic_ Any one who uses alcohol is an alcoholic...
The previous poster states that I can not handle my alcohol. They are incorrect..When I drink- I never lose control- nor does it effect my speech...or judgement- just like everyone else--I get slightly stupid- that stupidity is a stress release.
The point I was making- is the fact that drinking on a daily basis and never having a clean system is not good for you- You must have sober days.. Alcohol is a poison- a TOXIN...hence the term intoxicated.
This thread to me was not about a kids birthday party but about those that think daily use in small amounts is fine- I just don't believe that...those that are daily users have more of a problem than those that binge every 9 days..I don't drink every day because it depletes my energy and the body needs time away from the toxin...
The "one glass of wine" crowd don't drink it for the taste- all alcoholic beverages taste horrible...everyone drinks for the effect- daily drinkers of small amounts- will slowly increase the amount consumed in one sitting..and it will be a bottle of wine at a time in time.
Again those that nurse a beer and are proud of the fact that they don't pound six back at a time are hypocrites - why bother with one or two beer- better to have none...............................or drink properly and have 7....
What do you call people who drink coffee everyday? It's not exactly a pleasant taste. I do enjoy a glass of wine with dinner, but if I don't have one for whatever reason, I'm fine. What I'm NOT fine with is if I don't drink my double espresso in the morning. If I don't have it, I have a horrible headache, get cranky....it's much worse than missing my wine. Judge me!!
the poster to whom I was speaking said a person can not drink w/o becoming stupid. I took "stupid" to mean "drunken idiot." I have seen all kinds of people in all kinds of situations drink all different amounts, and they don't all become drunken idiots, especially not adult parents having a single drink. How do I know, you ask? Because I'm not blind. I never said it makes you "smarter" I never said it doesn't impair judgement. I said it is possible to have a drink without getting stupid drunk.
I only brought up waiting tables because the other poster said she had, and that was her proof. Apparently EVERYONE at EVERY TABLE that she ever served a drink to got stupid drunk. I just don't believe that.
See your point. It's not like we all have to be under constant pressure to be in the mental shape to write a complex math exam. I think what we are talking about are people who bring on mild and extreme horror shows and total lack of control..when drinking- These types usually have some sort of problem even when they are sober- I don't believe that alcohol creates problems or creates something in you that is negative- I never blame alcohol for weird or offensive behavior..It's the person.
For instance a person with a high energy level and who is mentally more hyper than the norm- can drink more..buy the time they are drunk they are down to the average level of function.
My dad used to have a saying in Russian..when someone including my mother would get critical of him "A drunkard can go to bed and sleep it off and wake up sober and sharp. A stupid person goes to bed sober and will never wake sober and sharp"..
To be honest with you- I don't have a problem with the idea of adults drinking around kids- why not....I have old videos of my brother in law and myself jammed into a kids old wooden wagon..both of us wearing these huge ski-do helmets...he is steering - I am in the back...all the kids are pushing us down the long slightly steep drive way---It is so funny--- the kids are full of joy because we were acting like kids...Yes...my brother in law and I were sipping from the flask...and was it great- IT WAS GLORIOUS...
That's the other aspect...and while I am in story mode.
Years back I lived on some acreage..drove this huge old Buick...If on a Saturday afternoon I was enhancing my day with a bit of gin---The kids knew dad was jolly and dad would let them drive the old car around the property...The two daughter with their long blonde hair and bright eyes would come flying over and take the drivers seat...I would navigate and off we would go...Their feet could barely reach the peddles..
Stopped the practice when Melody..banged into the side of the deck....and I won't mention the zip lines I would make-----------FOR THE KIDS------WHILE DRINKING....the only regret I have are the hang overs and hiding out from the family- there was a price for all that fun- but I was an uptight person who had trouble relaxing- so what.
Pretty reasoned response - some more of my thoughts as follows.........
This is switching timelines though - in my experience (and mine alone) i find people to be more dependent on caffiene than alcohol ..... i know people who need that cup or two a day and if they don't have it get headaches and what not ..... again though, this is probably a small sample of the overall population so I wouldn't want to label the group as being like that
We have family/friends stay with us and we aren't coffee drinkers ..... we do have a coffee pot in our house and we will run and get some coffee for it if people want ...... some do, some don't
My grandmother likes orange juice with pulp, which I find nasty ...... we'll buy her some though when she visits ..... because she is my grandmother and she's awesome (while never having a sip of alcohol in her 85 years....)
A few different items with the above
I wouldn't say it's healthy ...... i just would also say that in moderation it isn't that harmful ..... unfortunately, the vast majority of our environment is unhealthy
However, as adults we have a choice in which activities we want to partake in and as long as it doesn't prevent you from your other responsibilities I don't see a big deal.
For most, having a couple drinks every so often will not keep them from being functional or cause the type of long term health damage that will take you out of the picture entirely.
It's up to the adults to let kids know that as an adult you can make an informed decision on what you want to do - however, as children there are certain choices that just aren't permissible
You also really can't compare every substance to one another .... comparing alcohol to cigarettes would be like comparing cigarettes to pain killers and pain killers to heroine ...... sure they are all drugs, all are harmful to a degree ...... but there is a lot of nuance between them
The addictive properties of each varies greatly
It's much easier to stick to being someone who has a couple drinks than someone who has a couple cigarettes ....... nicotine is insanely addictive and has a completely different chemical reaction within your body
I also would have zero problems if my kids grew up to be responsible drinkers
I own movies that I wouldn't let my kids watch ... however, once they are adults it wouldn't be an issue
I can also see the point that if you have a couple drinks it can show how to handle vice responsibly ....... as opposed to the binge drinking and over indulgence that is the experience of many kids as they transition into adulthood
Not sure I would agree with that point in sum - but I can see some validity there ...... kind of a practice what you preach scenario .... if you talk to your kids about alcohol and inform them that when they are old enough to make the decision to buy a drink and they choose to do so that you don't need to feel compelled to drink a lot .... that you can mix in water, food, or just drink nothing for long stretches so you don't put yourself in a bad position
If that is your message and you get fall down drunk the message loses strength .... however, if that is your message and your kids never see you drunk despite seeing you drink it gets reinforced
On another branch completely, if your message is to simply not drink as a kid or an adult - then having a couple under any circumstance will be viewed as suspect and against the message
Personally, I'm a bit of a control freak when it comes to myself so I hate drinking too much ...... i don't like the feeling of impairment or diminished faculty
I wouldn't argue that drinking alcohol is beneficial ....... just that it doesn't have to be overly harmful
Soda, fruit juice, coffee and many other liquids are also harmful and don't carry any benefit - yet aren't hit with the same stigma
That is your right as a parent and no one would deny you of that. It's best to know the situation of the party, what is going on, who will be there, etc.
However, as pointed out there should be consistency - if you have a problem with your kids being around people drinking then it's best to not have them in that situation regardless of the type of party, birthday or otherwise
Furthermore, you would also have to keep tabs about them going over to a friends house for dinner, a sleep over, etc.
If the kids are playing outside, or playing video games or doing whatever it is that they do and dad is watching the ballgame and having a beer after dinner your kids are going to be exposed to that ...... if the problem is having adults drinking around your kids when you are not there, then this situation is really no different
Also, you can't project the "people you know" to people at large ..... as it's shown on this thread there is a wide variety of expectations and not a single norm - which is probably the reason a simple question has gone on this long
That's your own personal bias and honestly a debate killer ...... you don't have to believe me, doesn't make it any less true
Also, "an unhealthy amount" is a pretty ambiguous term ..... there is a large spectrum of unhealthy behaviours & actions .... the level of harm done is massive
Drinking a single soda is an unhealthy amount - having a single caffienated beverage can be an unhealthy amount ...... however, it may not make a person unhealthy on the whole ..... alcohol is no different
So much in life is not necessary - doesn't mean that there is anything wrong with it though ..... watching TV or partaking in internet discussion forums isn't necessary and there are plenty of studies that show they are potentially harmful .... however, here we are
Also "that often" is ambiguous ...... 2-3 drinks over a few hours doesn't "stone" me at all and I have that amount maybe every 2 weeks
My uncles wife has wine almost weekly and it goes straight to her head every time ..... everyone knows it, including herself, so she plans accordingly (as does my uncle)
Everyone has a different biology
You can't drink an apple - you can eat an apple and drink a beer if you want to
You can juice an apple and drink it - however, that sugar isn't exactly healthy
Also, with the state of commercial farming and apples being a top of the "dirty dozen" of pesticide tinged fruits & veggies maybe downing those isn't the healthiest of options either
Very well .... i'm not on the "it's good for you train" ...... i'm with the "it's a drink choice and if enjoyed responsibly who cares train"
Good info though
I think certain viewpoints are pretty pathetic and narrow ... however, that is just my viewpoint and others can do with it as they please
I don't think drinking has to be defended around kids because there is nothing wrong with drinking around kids.
I find it off that people would think that it's horrible or should be prohibited to drink around kids
I find the explainations provided in this thread about why it is horrible to drink around kids to be narrow, uninformed and not based in reality
Again - it's others labelling an action "unjustifiable" that is arbitrary and stiring up the responses
If someone has the opinion that having a drink makes you an alcoholic that opinion is wrong - scientifically, biologically and empirically wrong
There is just no basis to that opinion and it should be corrected
Which is fine ....... not everything is acceptable to everyone and most everyone here is OK with that
It's when misinformation, mistating opinions or making judgements about others because they do something that you personally don't find acceptable when emotions flare up
I believe that is the position of many of the respondents who say they would have a drink at a party
Again, the problem happens when others take that statement and accuse the person of being neglectful, a bad parent, a fall down drunk, etc
Nice response. I think we both understand each other. I agree with some of it, enough to leave it at that. I do appreciate the civility of your post.
And if the kids see maw and paw drinking and acting like kids---so be it....just don't invite crazy people to the party who when they touch alcohol all their chained demons are released...you know the type...I would honestly say that you can have a kids birthday party and you can choose to drink or NOT drink- makes no difference...if the people are good people..The devil does not hide in a bottle..he hides in you...Those who are demon free- are fine....I just don't like mean spirited drunks...and to tell you the turth..There seems to be less of them from what I noticed...but when they appear...It's the guy or woman in the corner...who after a few get snake eyed and scan the room for a victim...
Ok, a really quick search didn't yield any stats across generations, like I was hoping to find. I'm sure it's out there somewhere, but don't have time to hunt it down right now. I'm certain we're not the first people to wonder about it. If I run across something in the future, I'll let you know.
The link below is from NIDA, a series of studies conducted since 1975 with a huge nationally representative sample - you'll have to search through and find the methodology questions you want answered. I can't speak to this sample, but generally research scientists address the issue of reporting bias (I.e., saying what is socially desirable rather than what is accurate) through study design, methodology, and/or statistical controls (for example, there are measures of socially desirable responding that are sometimes administered along with other questionnaires - if the results come back that the participant was responding in a socially desirable way, their data on all other measures is thrown out of the final analyses). The studies below report a decline in alcohol use by underage drinkers from 1980 to the present, I believe. Trends & Statistics | National Institute on Drug Abuse ETA: Not to say that there is no underage substance use - it can be accurately argued that any underage drinking is a problem, but that is different than saying it is a pervasive and increasing problem, you know what I mean? I wouldn't want you to think that I condone underage drinking, because I don't.
I can appreciate that your personal experience goes against what the stats and studies say, and I respect that you want to know what the studies actually measured, rather than relying on headlines and third-hand blurbs. Personally, I am not going to make
assumptions about what is normative across the country based on the behavior of a small self-selected sample of people I know.
I'm going to refrain from pursuing this further on this thread, though, as we're pretty far
afield from the OP.
Same here! And thank you! Everyone is different and regardless of the matter at hand,
there will always be different points of views and opinions...live & let live
Anyone who ingests a glass of wine at dinner or a couple of beer on a daily basis is an alcoholic.Whether it be a bottle of wine-- or half a bottle of whiskey...on a daily basis is also an alcoholic_ Any one who uses alcohol is an alcoholic...
really. Hmm, lets check the definition
alcoholic noun
: a person who frequently drinks too much alcohol and is unable to live a normal and healthy life : a person who is affected with alcoholism -Miriam Webster
so "too much" is tied to part 2 "unable to live a normal and healthy life". One drink with dinner will not shorten your life (some studies suggest it may extend), it will not impact your ability to do daily tasks, won't get you fired, and won't impact your social relationships with family, friends, and peers
So I'm not sure where you got your definition, but according to the english language - your wrong
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I do appreciate the civility of your post.
