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I don't think you have to get into sexual detail, especially with a 4 year old. When my daughter asked I just told her that sometimes boys love boys, girls love girls etc... My husband has an Uncle who is gay, so I knew the questions would come and that was the best way I could explain it to her at that age.
I never told my kids anything about homosexuals. Certainly not a 4 year olds.
However my kids were squabbling one time and I yelled at them and told them I wanted to see a little more brotherly love in this house and the 4 year old looked at me and said "Do you think we're gay or something?"
So if homosexuality is a choice, then asexuality must be a choice too. And heterosexuality. I can only speak to what I know, and I know I never made a choice about being asexual. And I couldn't now make a choice to be heterosexual OR homosexual. I could have sex with a man or a woman, but that would be a physical act- I can't make myself feel the desire that others do. I think very few heterosexuals feel they could make a choice tomorrow to feel desire toward the same gender.
But that too is a different thread, I suppose.
To answer the OP....I think you're being very honest about how you feel and the reasons why. My mother wants to be accepting of gay people, but you can tell it makes her uncomfortable to see two men kiss (I'm talking peck on the cheek, not tongue action). Yet she was always very clear to me growing up that it didn't matter who I loved, she would still be my mom and would still accept me. I think she had more of an issue with my asexuality really than if I'd come home with another girl.
Think of it as if your daughter asked you why some people have darker skin. You wouldn't make a big deal out of answering, right? And you wouldn't try and hold that conversation off for later, yes? You'd probably just say something like "different people have different skin colors" and that would be it. And if she asked why again, well...because. Because the world is full of all kinds of different people, and isn't that grand? You wouldn't worry about explaining how skin pigmentation is caused by certain compounds and so on. Or think about if your daughter asked you about a mixed race couple, or a white couple with an adopted black child. You'd probably just say that all families are different, but they love each other and their children just the same.
It doesn't have to be a threatening thing- just another way to tell your child that there's an awful lot of love in the world.
im not sure that all gay people dont want their kids to be gay. that would mean that the parent thought there was something wrong with being gay. Thats another thread though.
Parents don't want their kids to have a hard time in life. With the stigma still attached, and the obvious ignorance still out there, no, I don't think gay parents would "want" their kids to be gay.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwm1964
My point is I believe we do have a right to believe that gay behavior is a choice and not a wise choice.
I do believe we have a right to teach this to our children without being attacked by others with different beliefs and slandered as bigots and subject to irrational phobias.
Simple as that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwm1964
Part of the message that I impart to my children is that homosexuality is a poor choice and they should be cautious in their interactions with young people who are confused on this issue.
On another thread I went into detail about a relationship between my 13 year old daughter and her 13 year old friend who identified herself as lesbian. I believe at 13, this is not an appropriate situation and felt the school let me down in addressing aggressive sexual advances because the participant identified herself as "gay".
choice? When did you choose to fall in love with your significant other? Did you make a conscious decision, or did it just kind of happen? bigot with an irrational phobia, maybe not. I'd go with "uneducated and ignorant."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Workin_Hard
Some would, given half an opportunity...
And so I keep away such well-wishers when possible.
I said I'd tell her "if she asked me". If your child is going around asking all kinds of people questions like this, something you're telling her at home is not working. Are you the same poster who said you want your daughter to think for herself? But you keep her sheltered from people who are not like you. How is she going to learn to think for herself if you shelter her from the real world?
Muslims - I met and spoke with a Muslim neighbor when we moved in. She is Palestinian and a radical Hamas supporter who apparently agrees with the "Jews are pigs and apes" theory. (No, I'm not Jewish.) Further evidenced by her wearing of a hajib in public at all times - a clear sign of the subjugation and devluation of women within that culture. I also lost several friends,brutally mudered on 9/11 and do not subscribe to the 'religion-of-peace' story. If you still can't understand, do a Google search on CAIR. But that's a different thread altogether.
Democrats - Can't seem to walk without stepping in their BS. But, they're everywhere and must be tolerated. My best friend in a lib from the land of Fruits-n-Nuts. It makes for interesting conversation and yet his family is the only one in the neighborhood with whom I entrust my child with no hesitation. More interesting stuff on the Politics forum
Christians - Generally ok unless they're of the fundamentalist variety, spouting about Jesus in every conversation. One neighbor family, Irish-Catholic, with 6 kids, are always either at my house of my kid at theirs. We've had conversation and they know to rein it in when my child is around, and I'm a bit more tolerant on religious subjects with their kids. Another similar family, (5 kids, I-C, homeschoolers, tithing) are more standoffish to my "heathen" family, but we get along quite civilly. Be sure to read the Religion forum.
Where in this thread have I said anything racist? Did I cite black, white, purple or green lesbians? Are any of the above groups members of a particular race or ethnicity? Muslim is not a race. Gay is not a race nor an ethnicity. Is that different in your neighborhood? How is vehement disgreement with a belief system or a given set of chosen behaviors racist? And belief systems and lifestyle choices are very controllable, so that shoots down your accusation on that note. I'm teaching my daughter to be civilly polite when necessary without condoning or embracing the choice under discussion here, and to avoid further unnecessary interaction when possible.
big·ot
–noun
a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion.
I think those who have been so quick to attack here need to take a look in the mirror after reading the definition. I'll freely admit I have preferences and little tolerance for those beliefs I find outrageous, moreso when I think they present a danger to the physical, psychological, or moral well being of my child, or on a larger scale, to my society. Can you say you're tolerating a different opinion, mine included, with more grace?
For someone who "couldn't care less", you make a pretty impassioned speech.
you are generalizing about entire groups of people because you have issues with the EXTREMISTS in those groups. Are you really not able to see that not all people in these groups are like that? Most will live their lives without bothering you at all, including gays. I think the definition you posted describes you pretty well.
When I was as young as 11 and through my teenage years I had offers both ways. Some obviously inapproprite because of my age and others bullying and abusive. I certainly don't think my experiences are unique, I think I'm only more willing to share them than most people. I'm little surprised by the inhumanity of humans and believe there is a very dark side to homosexuality just as there is to heterosexuality.
I think my relationship with my parents and open communication is what prevented me from being taken advantage of. I wouldn't be shamed or intimidated into "not telling". This is part of why my belief system is as it is and why I speak up for parents to not be intimidated by insults and labels and let them know there are others still willing to say what they themselves think but are hesitant to speak because of intolerance and prejudice concerning their beliefs and values. (and because mine may be different than yours it does not necessarily follow that I don't respect you or your right to raise your children as you feel appropriate)
The irony!
.
I'm not sure how this relates to the topic. This was potential sexual abuse, not homosexuality. Are you saying that because you did not accept these advances, you chose not to be gay?
Muslims - I met and spoke with a Muslim neighbor when we moved in. She is Palestinian and a radical Hamas supporter who apparently agrees with the "Jews are pigs and apes" theory. (No, I'm not Jewish.) Further evidenced by her wearing of a hajib in public at all times - a clear sign of the subjugation and devluation of women within that culture. I also lost several friends,brutally mudered on 9/11 and do not subscribe to the 'religion-of-peace' story. If you still can't understand, do a Google search on CAIR. But that's a different thread altogether.
Democrats - Can't seem to walk without stepping in their BS. But, they're everywhere and must be tolerated. My best friend in a lib from the land of Fruits-n-Nuts. It makes for interesting conversation and yet his family is the only one in the neighborhood with whom I entrust my child with no hesitation. More interesting stuff on the Politics forum
Christians - Generally ok unless they're of the fundamentalist variety, spouting about Jesus in every conversation. One neighbor family, Irish-Catholic, with 6 kids, are always either at my house of my kid at theirs. We've had conversation and they know to rein it in when my child is around, and I'm a bit more tolerant on religious subjects with their kids. Another similar family, (5 kids, I-C, homeschoolers, tithing) are more standoffish to my "heathen" family, but we get along quite civilly. Be sure to read the Religion forum.
Where in this thread have I said anything racist? Did I cite black, white, purple or green lesbians? Are any of the above groups members of a particular race or ethnicity? Muslim is not a race. Gay is not a race nor an ethnicity. Is that different in your neighborhood? How is vehement disgreement with a belief system or a given set of chosen behaviors racist? And belief systems and lifestyle choices are very controllable, so that shoots down your accusation on that note. I'm teaching my daughter to be civilly polite when necessary without condoning or embracing the choice under discussion here, and to avoid further unnecessary interaction when possible.
big·ot
–noun
a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion.
I think those who have been so quick to attack here need to take a look in the mirror after reading the definition. I'll freely admit I have preferences and little tolerance for those beliefs I find outrageous, moreso when I think they present a danger to the physical, psychological, or moral well being of my child, or on a larger scale, to my society. Can you say you're tolerating a different opinion, mine included, with more grace?
For someone who "couldn't care less", you make a pretty impassioned speech.
1. From my post: "....what you’re doing is like(key word) making prejudiced remarks against a certain race/ethnicity..." I was giving an example. I'll make it simple: having bigoted beliefs and claiming you are not a bigot is like having racist beliefs and claiming you are not a racist. Get it?
2. You can say it's not a choice all you want, but that doesn't make it true. Homosexuality is not a choice the same way skin color isn't. This is a fact. Did you choose to be straight?
3. "For someone who "couldn't care less", you make a pretty impassioned speech" -Oh please. If you consider that impassioned, then maybe you need to look up the definition of that word too. Believe me, you haven't seen me at my worst.
No, I couldn't care less about what you teach your daughter and defend anyone's right to teach their children what they want. I simply called you out on your BS and told you to own who you are. When you are an obvious bigot you sound silly saying you aren't. You aren't teaching your daughter to hate? Okay.
Last edited by luckynumber4; 07-17-2011 at 08:13 PM..
you are generalizing about entire groups of people because you have issues with the EXTREMISTS in those groups. Are you really not able to see that not all people in these groups are like that? Most will live their lives without bothering you at all, including gays. I think the definition you posted describes you pretty well.
The definition indicates a lack of "tolerance". I'm being tolerant with the cases cited earlier in the thread. Nowhere did I advocate violence towards them or acts to drive them away. As I said, I teach my child to be polite and civil when necessary and avoid unnecessary interaction otherwise.
"Toleration implies the sufferance of conduct with which one is not in accord."
Others in the thread seem to think that I should invite the child for play dates at our home, or send my child to their home, and fully interact with them as a family unit, setting the example that my child will see that the relationship choice and family is just as valid as ours, which I do not feel it is. How would that teach or promoteour family values?
The problem is that the pro-gay contingent is not satisfied with "tolerance" but wants the lifestyle choice to be embraced and that all parts of society should consider them on an absolute equal footing relationship- and family-wise. Anything less will not be tolerated!! So who fits the definition now?
You can say it's not a choice all you want, but that doesn't make it true. Homosexuality is not a choice the same way skin color isn't. This is a fact. Did you choose to be straight?.
On what do you base your assertion that this is a "fact".
I contend that it is a choice and that this is a fact. Homosexuality is based on (alleged) internal feelings and external manifestions (actions). Actions are by choice. Skin color is far less debateable. (To ask what is being discussed in another thread, why do homosexuals always try to compare themselves with those with non-white skin? It's an apples-&-oranges comparison.)
There, my assertion is just as valid as yours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by luckynumber4
3. "For someone who "couldn't care less", you make a pretty impassioned speech" -Oh please. If you consider that impassioned, then maybe you need to look up the definition of that word too. Believe me, you haven't seen me at my worst. .
Be careful as that last statement is a two-edged sword.
Quote:
Originally Posted by luckynumber4
No, I couldn't care less about what you teach your daughter and defend anyone's right to teach their children what they want. I simply called you out on your BS and told you to own who you are. When you are an obvious bigot you sound silly saying you aren't. You aren't teaching your daughter to hate? Okay.
Then defend my right to teach my child according to our family values as being just as valid as anyone else's. Bigotry includes tolerance. I am being tolerant, just not embracing bad lifestyle choices. (You can check my other reply on this.)
The definition indicates a lack of "tolerance". I'm being tolerant with the cases cited earlier in the thread. Nowhere did I advocate violence towards them or acts to drive them away. As I said, I teach my child to be polite and civil when necessary and avoid unnecessary interaction otherwise.
"Toleration implies the sufferance of conduct with which one is not in accord."
Others in the thread seem to think that I should invite the child for play dates at our home, or send my child to their home, and fully interact with them as a family unit, setting the example that my child will see that the relationship choice and family is just as valid as ours, which I do not feel it is. How would that teach or promoteour family values?
The problem is that the pro-gay contingent is not satisfied with "tolerance" but wants the lifestyle choice to be embraced and that all parts of society should consider them on an absolute equal footing relationship- and family-wise. Anything less will not be tolerated!! So who fits the definition now?
right. You "tolerate" them while teaching your kids that they are inferior. nice.
This thread has wandered pretty far off-topic again. Please take religious debate to the Religion forum. Thanks.
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bigot with an irrational phobia, maybe not. I'd go with "uneducated and ignorant." 
I said I'd tell her "if she asked me". If your child is going around asking all kinds of people questions like this, something you're telling her at home is not working. Are you the same poster who said you want your daughter to think for herself? But you keep her sheltered from people who are not like you. How is she going to learn to think for herself if you shelter her from the real world?
