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Upstate NY is dead. Unfortunately, the state is controlled by those who only have NYC in their best interests.
Whatever elected officials are working in our favor are outnumbered by the folks in NYC.
Even though the Thruway authority is private - we are going to be paying higher tolls for use of the thruway so they can rebuild a bridge in NYC. That's not right.
Uhhhh, you need to understand the difference between Metro Area and municpal boundry. Rochester and Buffalo have increased population in their Metro Regions... Syracuse has not. Suburban flight.
Meh... Have you visited all four?
By far it goes like this:
Rochester, Buffalo, Albany, Syracuse.
Syracuse is a dump.
You live in Buffalo and you're calling Syracuse a dump? That's the pot calling the kettle black!
I've been to all 4, but Buffalo only once so to be fair, I probably shouldn't put it last. When I was there, it seemed more run down than the others. I've spent the most time in Albany, and Syracuse I've been to about 10 times as I've looked into relocation there.
Frankly, for me its the difference between Castrol, Quaker State, Pennzoil, and Mobil. They're all similar, but the slight differences might work better for some people than others.
-Albany feels the most Eastern, most New England and most NYC feel there. NY attitude to some degree. Best situated to other major places to visit. Heaviest traffic of the 4. Ugliest mix of architecture downtown with amazing State House and SUNY admin building and hideous govt buildings and the egg. People there just seem beaten down. North of Albany probably my favorite part of NY (SS, Glens Falls, Lake George). South, east, west, meh.
-Syracuse mixes eastern NY and the Midwest a bit, and also has a slight Canadian feel to me. For some reason, I like Syracuse. Its the hilliest of the bunch and has the most trees. My family came into Syracuse from Italy in the early 1900's and my family name is fairly common there, so that's always influential to me. It feels safer than Albany, which feels more dangerous to me (wider streets in Syracuse perhaps, not as hemmed in).
On the downside, some of the people I met there (and I met a lot of people) were depressed, hated their town, drunk, or just acting moronic. I listen to talk radio when I'm traveling to get local flavor, and the radio guys were talking about how horrible Syracuse was. Its sad but there seemed like there was little pride there. Then you go to Raleigh and its so pumped up and positive, it makes you feel good. People there are like "move here and live in the best place in the US". People in Cuse are like "why the hell would you move here?".
-Rochester is my favorite but located in a isolated area. Its flat. The downtown didn't seem that bad, and the suburbs remind me most of downstate suburbs. You see Mercedes Benz a lot in Rochester, not so much in other areas, so it looks like NJ in some ways without the crowds. People were very friendly there and had more pride. Something about the "edge of the lake feel" they have there that they don't have elsewhere. Perhaps this Google view can explain what I mean. http://goo.gl/maps/eSqCc
The windswept white pines and big sky feels like its on the edge of an island, I get this feel in Maine too.
Buffalo I can't really speak to. I've driven through once but it was about 8 years ago and it seemed very industrial and flat. I'm not going to judge it from that. The movies of Vincent Gallo might also be swimming around in my thoughts.
You live in Buffalo and you're calling Syracuse a dump? That's the pot calling the kettle black!
I've been to all 4, but Buffalo only once so to be fair, I probably shouldn't put it last. When I was there, it seemed more run down than the others. I've spent the most time in Albany, and Syracuse I've been to about 10 times as I've looked into relocation there.
Frankly, for me its the difference between Castrol, Quaker State, Pennzoil, and Mobil. They're all similar, but the slight differences might work better for some people than others.
-Albany feels the most Eastern, most New England and most NYC feel there. NY attitude to some degree. Best situated to other major places to visit. Heaviest traffic of the 4. Ugliest mix of architecture downtown with amazing State House and SUNY admin building and hideous govt buildings and the egg. People there just seem beaten down. North of Albany probably my favorite part of NY (SS, Glens Falls, Lake George). South, east, west, meh.
-Syracuse mixes eastern NY and the Midwest a bit, and also has a slight Canadian feel to me. For some reason, I like Syracuse. Its the hilliest of the bunch and has the most trees. My family came into Syracuse from Italy in the early 1900's and my family name is fairly common there, so that's always influential to me. It feels safer than Albany, which feels more dangerous to me (wider streets in Syracuse perhaps, not as hemmed in).
On the downside, some of the people I met there (and I met a lot of people) were depressed, hated their town, drunk, or just acting moronic. I listen to talk radio when I'm traveling to get local flavor, and the radio guys were talking about how horrible Syracuse was. Its sad but there seemed like there was little pride there. Then you go to Raleigh and its so pumped up and positive, it makes you feel good. People there are like "move here and live in the best place in the US". People in Cuse are like "why the hell would you move here?".
-Rochester is my favorite but located in a isolated area. Its flat. The downtown didn't seem that bad, and the suburbs remind me most of downstate suburbs. You see Mercedes Benz a lot in Rochester, not so much in other areas, so it looks like NJ in some ways without the crowds. People were very friendly there and had more pride. Something about the "edge of the lake feel" they have there that they don't have elsewhere. Perhaps this Google view can explain what I mean. http://goo.gl/maps/eSqCc
The windswept white pines and big sky feels like its on the edge of an island, I get this feel in Maine too.
Buffalo I can't really speak to. I've driven through once but it was about 8 years ago and it seemed very industrial and flat. I'm not going to judge it from that. The movies of Vincent Gallo might also be swimming around in my thoughts.
I see what you mean.
Just to touch on the Syracuse attitude you are referring to, I think that is true with some in the area, but I think it is a matter of things like a personal situation, perhaps not seeing other places or thinking that other places don't have similar issues and some of what some local media outlets portrays, along with only seeing a limited part of the area. Given that you would probably be more mobile than many, if not most of these people, it may be a matter of networking with the right people through things like Syracuse First, 40 Below, rethink syracuse or take a route similar to what Becca8377 did with meetups and the like. Those groups would be more likely to have people that fit what you are looking for or that would give more balance to the attitudes in the area, especially given that they don't necessarily get as much publicity or many in the area may not be as aware of these groups. Even radio shows like a Power Perspectives which comes on 620 AM, may talk about issues, groups and events that many wouldn't know about otherwise within the city/area. So, it may be a matter of networking and getting with the right people. I'd also say that south of Syracuse kind of has that Southern Tier/PA feel too due to the hills and valleys.
In terms of the "edge of the lake feel", in the Buffalo area, I'd think that some of the Southtowns or in the Syracuse area, Cicero or Skaneateles would give you that feel. Here are a couple of streetviews: https://maps.google.com/maps?q=lakes...345.4,,0,-0.53
Just to touch on the Syracuse attitude you are referring to, I think that is true with some in the area, but I think it is a matter of things like a personal situation, perhaps not seeing other places or thinking that other places don't have similar issues and some of what some local media outlets portrays, along with only seeing a limited part of the area. Given that you would probably be more mobile than many, if not most of these people, it may be a matter of networking with the right people through things like Syracuse First, 40 Below, rethink syracuse or take a route similar to what Becca8377 did with meetups and the like. Those groups would be more likely to have people that fit what you are looking for or that would give more balance to the attitudes in the area, especially given that they don't necessarily get as much publicity or many in the area may not be as aware of these groups. Even radio shows like a Power Perspectives which comes on 620 AM, may talk about issues, groups and events that many wouldn't know about otherwise within the city/area. So, it may be a matter of networking and getting with the right people. I'd also say that south of Syracuse kind of has that Southern Tier/PA feel too due to the hills and valleys.
In terms of the "edge of the lake feel", in the Buffalo area, I'd think that some of the Southtowns or in the Syracuse area, Cicero or Skaneateles would give you that feel. Here are a couple of streetviews: https://maps.google.com/maps?q=lakes...345.4,,0,-0.53
Here the thing- I realize there's stuff to do, and also that people Upstate tend to be insular and have lived in the same town / area most of their lives. I've made some friends Upstate and taking a trip to even NJ is like taking a trip to a faraway land.
That's why when you and I argue, I feel that you get the impression that I'm putting the area down, when its more a matter of my experiences there, as well as other places and comparing them. There's 2 or 3 positive NY posters to every 10 negative ones. So, its something to consider.
Like most people, I am influenced by others around me, and their temperament and attitude will affect my day. When I'm down South, and people are happy to be there and proud of their home, it shows in the people's friendly attitudes and even in pride in the landscape. You'd be hard pressed to find mounds of trash on the side of the road in Raleigh. In Albany, Syracuse, Binghamton etc, the roads have trash all over.
When I'm down South or out West, and its sunny out, and the cops are no where to be found, and I can live freely and not have some a**hole tailgating me, I feel good. When I'm in NY (and NJ too) and people are just crabby, cops are lurking around every turn waiting to give you a ticket, people are drunk and cursing, always talking about drinking or how much this sucks or that sucks, when so many things to do are illegal unless it is a socially-approved, sponsored by Bud-Light event, it wears people out and just is not appealing.
Swimming in a lake here (unless it is a lifeguard protected, roped off area) is illegal. Owning a handgun is illegal / impossible. Cops fear people out West. People fear cops here. Corruption is rampant in NY and NJ. NYS is a corrupt machine that is always discussed as getting better but it never does:
When I think about having maybe 20 working years left, and knowing that I won't retire in NY due to the weather and taxes, to buy a 1970's house with $5k in taxes, pay it off, then try and sell a 60 year house with likely 10k a year in taxes, while moving away from friends and neighbors that I've made in 20 years, is something to consider.
Most people retire in the South or in warmer Western states, it might be better to just make that move in the next few years rather than in 20, and just stay there.
Could you expand on what you mean by "isolated area"?
Rochester is not mountainous by any means, but I've never thought of it as flat, and it does get a lot hillier as you head southeast into the suburbs. Take a ride out I490 east, you'll see what I mean. Bristol Mountain is minutes away, as are the gorgeous Finger Lakes, especially in the fall. There are mountain and waterfalls everywhere.
Here the thing- I realize there's stuff to do, and also that people Upstate tend to be insular and have lived in the same town / area most of their lives. I've made some friends Upstate and taking a trip to even NJ is like taking a trip to a faraway land.
That's why when you and I argue, I feel that you get the impression that I'm putting the area down, when its more a matter of my experiences there, as well as other places and comparing them. There's 2 or 3 positive NY posters to every 10 negative ones. So, its something to consider.
Like most people, I am influenced by others around me, and their temperament and attitude will affect my day. When I'm down South, and people are happy to be there and proud of their home, it shows in the people's friendly attitudes and even in pride in the landscape. You'd be hard pressed to find mounds of trash on the side of the road in Raleigh. In Albany, Syracuse, Binghamton etc, the roads have trash all over.
When I'm down South or out West, and its sunny out, and the cops are no where to be found, and I can live freely and not have some a**hole tailgating me, I feel good. When I'm in NY (and NJ too) and people are just crabby, cops are lurking around every turn waiting to give you a ticket, people are drunk and cursing, always talking about drinking or how much this sucks or that sucks, when so many things to do are illegal unless it is a socially-approved, sponsored by Bud-Light event, it wears people out and just is not appealing.
Swimming in a lake here (unless it is a lifeguard protected, roped off area) is illegal. Owning a handgun is illegal / impossible. Cops fear people out West. People fear cops here. Corruption is rampant in NY and NJ. NYS is a corrupt machine that is always discussed as getting better but it never does:
When I think about having maybe 20 working years left, and knowing that I won't retire in NY due to the weather and taxes, to buy a 1970's house with $5k in taxes, pay it off, then try and sell a 60 year house with likely 10k a year in taxes, while moving away from friends and neighbors that I've made in 20 years, is something to consider.
Most people retire in the South or in warmer Western states, it might be better to just make that move in the next few years rather than in 20, and just stay there.
I don't know if most Upstate NY people haven't gone anywhere else and actually, most people don't move that far from where they grew up in general in this country. I'm talking specifically about the people you have interacted with and that people have to make up their own minds. So, if you want to move elsewhere in a few years, I rather people just go ahead and do that, instead of stewing over someplace that they know that they aren't going to move to.
A lot of that other stuff is a bit exaggerated and I could care less about what you think I'm thinking about. Meaning, I'm just posting information that may help those that may want it and am willing to give pros and cons that exist, like everywhere else. Maybe I just don't need other people to dictate what I'm going to do as an individual or what, but I think that people are just better off making the move they know they want to make, instead of playing around.
Could you expand on what you mean by "isolated area"?
Rochester is not mountainous by any means, but I've never thought of it as flat, and it does get a lot hillier as you head southeast into the suburbs. Take a ride out I490 east, you'll see what I mean. Bristol Mountain is minutes away, as are the gorgeous Finger Lakes, especially in the fall. There are mountain and waterfalls everywhere.
That's true and Syracuse is similar, but the city is located where're hills and flat/lowlands meet. Within minutes south of these cities/areas, you pretty much run into hills.
Could you expand on what you mean by "isolated area"?
Rochester is not mountainous by any means, but I've never thought of it as flat, and it does get a lot hillier as you head southeast into the suburbs. Take a ride out I490 east, you'll see what I mean. Bristol Mountain is minutes away, as are the gorgeous Finger Lakes, especially in the fall. There are mountain and waterfalls everywhere.
By isolated, I mean its not really near anywhere else. Most major cities outside of Buffalo (NYC, Phila, Pittsburgh, Toronto) are all quite a distance away. As a comparison, Albany is near many other places.
I didn't mean it in a derogatory way, I was only talking about proximity to other places.
And I agree that its in a beautiful part of NY. Most places near Lake Ontario are flat, of course.
I don't know if most Upstate NY people haven't gone anywhere else and actually, most people don't move that far from where they grew up in general in this country. I'm talking specifically about the people you have interacted with and that people have to make up their own minds. So, if you want to move elsewhere in a few years, I rather people just go ahead and do that, instead of stewing over someplace that they know that they aren't going to move to.
A lot of that other stuff is a bit exaggerated and I could care less about what you think I'm thinking about. Meaning, I'm just posting information that may help those that may want it and am willing to give pros and cons that exist, like everywhere else. Maybe I just don't need other people to dictate what I'm going to do as an individual or what, but I think that people are just better off making the move they know they want to make, instead of playing around.
Wow. Why so harsh? I don't understand what your problem is.
You're line about "I rather people just go ahead...." well, that decision isn't your decision to make. What you'd rather people do doesn't really matter.
So much for trying to be civil. Anyway, I also do not post for your benefit. I'm posting for the benefit of whoever may be reading and may be interested in my posts. If you don't like or agree with what I have to say, don't comment. I will continue to post about, enjoy, and visit, my home state of NY. I'll assess and comment. For someone who "couldn't care less" what I think, you quote me an awful lot.
I care about what others think here because I'm not a dick and lots of people here have things to offer. They're not always rose-colored or to your standards, but I like to hear them. Bottom line is, if you're not concerned about what I say and what I do, don't comment on me. Simple enough, right?
Wow. Why so harsh? I don't understand what your problem is.
You're line about "I rather people just go ahead...." well, that decision isn't your decision to make. What you'd rather people do doesn't really matter.
So much for trying to be civil. Anyway, I also do not post for your benefit. I'm posting for the benefit of whoever may be reading and may be interested in my posts. If you don't like or agree with what I have to say, don't comment. I will continue to post about, enjoy, and visit, my home state of NY. I'll assess and comment. For someone who "couldn't care less" what I think, you quote me an awful lot.
I care about what others think here because I'm not a dick and lots of people here have things to offer. They're not always rose-colored or to your standards, but I like to hear them. Bottom line is, if you're not concerned about what I say and what I do, don't comment on me. Simple enough, right?
Obviously it is tough to get an idea of what someone is trying to say or the emotional aspect. You can post all you want to. I'm just gave an opinion and I actually don't think that any area or state is perfect or even immune to dysfunction. You would think that would go without saying, but....I've also tried to make it about the OP. That's all(shrug).
OP, there are some other suggestions posted in another thread that you made on here. Those areas would/could fit. Rentals may vary in terms of apartments or homes. Rent may be quite a bit lower than the rental price you posted as well.
In terms of Wegmans, those areas will have one in or not too far from those neighborhoods.
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