Remember, you people come/came here (fit in, live, military)

[MAINEr]

Originally Posted by JoeJoeMan

mthuntnow..................first off let me say I couldn't agree more with you.
But you know what they tell me around this forum, when I get down on all the growth and implants...........they say "you have to except change", "it's good for our economy"........I say, bunk bunk and more bunk......I think we were all alot more better off before all this 'change' came our way.

I can see you are very adamant about people moving . Let me say this. I think if the entire country went back to living off the land and working hard to earn what you have, instead of awaiting the monthly"paycheck" for nothing, we would all be better off.I don't like shinny SUV's or dirty ones for that matter. If you have chosen to move to a Big city to get ahead, I think you need to stay there because it has clouded your judgement. We have become a gready society that only cares about money and I agree change sucks especailly when it keeps changing for the worst. We are only hurrying along on our paths to self destruction.

[Reziac]

This wasn't a change in the HUNTING regs. It was a new anti-cruelty statute (a completely separate part of the law). Hunting itself is as legal as ever. But the definition of cruelty was expanded to "shooting of any animal", and hunting (which usually involves shooting animals) was NOT exempt. I hope you can see the inherent conflict!!

I know this new statute was being challenged but have not heard the outcome.

[lesliegrace]

Originally Posted by Reziac

This wasn't a change in the HUNTING regs. It was a new anti-cruelty statute (a completely separate part of the law). Hunting itself is as legal as ever. But the definition of cruelty was expanded to "shooting of any animal", and hunting (which usually involves shooting animals) was NOT exempt. I hope you can see the inherent conflict!!

I know this new statute was being challenged but have not heard the outcome.

Reziac,

I haven't heard or read anything about such a law; do you remember when you heard about it or what it was called?

Frankly, I'm amazed to hear that the Texas Legislature would spend any time discussing (much less passing) an animal anti-cruelty law. I thought Texas legislators were primarily interested in passing laws to benefit themselves and their big-business cronies, and secondarily interested in figuring out ways to screw up Texas public schools.

[MontanaGuy]

But you know what they tell me around this forum, when I get down on all the growth and implants...........they say "you have to except change", "it's good for our economy"........I say, bunk bunk and more bunk......I think we were all alot more better off before all this 'change' came our way.

JJM, we've exchanged some views about growth in Montana on a few different posts and I realize we don't agree on everything. I look at it this way. Life is always throwing surprises at us and the only thing we can be sure of is that tomorrow is going to be a little different than today. There's not a state in the union, including Montana, that's going to be the same way it was in our childhood as it is when we're senior citizens. I actually think that Montana has probably changed much less than other states but of course it's not the way it used to be. The Montana that existed in the 1800's is completely different from the state we know today. I would imagine that in another century it will be so different than it is now that we would hardly recognize it. That's just the nature of human progress. I don't necessarily think that the changes are all going to be destructive. In fact I'm somewhat optimistic that mankind might find some sort of balance with nature and we might actually start doing things right. In any case, I think we need to adapt to change and make the best of it.

[Reziac]

lesliegrace,

IIRC the heads-up was published as a legislative alert by Bird Dog and Retriever News a couple years ago. I couldn't find a reference on bdarn.com but what back issues are up there are pretty disorganized, and mostly not searchable.

A friend in Houston recently forwarded me a news item about someone in TX who was convicted of cruelty for shooting feral cats (which are NOT a protected species, nor should feral animals qualify as "previously released" under TX state law http://www.animallaw.info/articles/ovustxcruelty.htm -- this is somewhat out of date) because said feral cats were killing birds of a known-endangered species; this guy is some sort of wildlife biologist, I forget the details.

Speaking of birds, this morning I saw a heron in my front yard. In the middle of the desert. WTF??!

[lesliegrace]

Originally Posted by Reziac

lesliegrace,

IIRC the heads-up was published as a legislative alert by Bird Dog and Retriever News a couple years ago. I couldn't find a reference on bdarn.com but what back issues are up there are pretty disorganized, and mostly not searchable.

A friend in Houston recently forwarded me a news item about someone in TX who was convicted of cruelty for shooting feral cats (which are NOT a protected species, nor should feral animals qualify as "previously released" under TX state law http://www.animallaw.info/articles/ovustxcruelty.htm -- this is somewhat out of date) because said feral cats were killing birds of a known-endangered species; this guy is some sort of wildlife biologist, I forget the details.

Speaking of birds, this morning I saw a heron in my front yard. In the middle of the desert. WTF??!

Reziac,

Most of the animal cruelty cases that I hear about have to do with people who are trying to take care of too many dogs or cats and either live in unsanitary conditions or don't have enough money to properly feed and care for so many pets. I have also heard about people starving their livestock being cited for cruelty. In cases like these, I don't think the people intend to be cruel, but their lack of resources causes them to neglect the animals' needs. They obviously need to ask for help before things get out of control.

Just recently, there was a very upsetting animal cruelty case mentioned on our local news that had to do with a crazy man who decided to "exercise" his horse by tying the poor thing to his truck and then driving down the road either faster than it could run or longer than its stamina would allow it to keep up. (Some people have ABSOLUTELY NO SENSE!) Of course, he ended up dragging the horse to death. People who witnessed it said it was one of the most awful things they had ever seen.

If the url you included in your post is correct, feral cats wouldn't seem to fall into the category of protected animals according to the law since nobody owns them. Maybe there is a newer law that changes the definition of the types of animals that are protected?

Possibly your visiting heron was blown off-course, caught up in some of the windy weather that so many parts of the country have been experiencing lately! Herons, egrets, and whooping cranes are fairly common near my home, but I live within just a few miles of swamps and bayous. I can't imagine what possessed a heron to visit the desert! And I really can't imagine how he got there!

[citigirl]

Originally Posted by mthuntnow

Unfortunately, society has had some slight fascination with wilderness for the past few decades. The ugly effect that I have seen is shinny SUVs that make my house unaffordable, litter when they do leave pavement, and try to legaly attack my way of life. My family has been in this state for 6 generations and now people move here from other places and try to make it like the place they came from. My question is, when the houses aren't big enough and the SUVs not shinny enough, why not just go back from whence you came? Instead, inner-city people stay here and try to change my local political environment. So, to those imports who feel it is ok to lobby and harrass against hunting: you are tyrants, attacking my way of life. I haven't outlawed $4 coffee (because it's stupid and if you can waste that much then it should just be taken from you as tax) so leave my hunting alone. And, if you happen to walk your dog in an urban recreation area and are abhored that someone can actually archery hunt there just remember that hunting paid for the are in the first place. And, most importantly, hunting is considered a right of Montana citizens. If you do not like it, please leave. Otherwise, any attack on my right to hunt will be considered theft, and an attack upon my families welfare...how would you react if someone attacked your way of life and the welfare of your family.

I am "one of the people" that came here, hoping I was leaving the west coast "lifestyle" behind. Not so. I agree with you completely.

[Reziac]

That is exactly my problem with the yuppie-izing of rural areas too. Let's all move out to the country TOGETHER, and re-create the city we just left!! Oh, and run out all those country yokels while we're at it; they're degrading our property values.

This has LITERALLY happened in much of formerly-rural California.

I wouldn't have so much problem with it if people who moved to rural areas would just live and let live, the way us "country yokels" have done for generations.

And it sickens me to see perfectly good farmland and grazing land turned into subdivisions -- when it's all gone (and as of a few years ago, I saw a stat that about half the arable bottomland in the U.S., ie. the very BEST cropland, had already been turned into housing developments), what will we eat?

[Aurora616]

Originally Posted by mthuntnow

Unfortunately, society has had some slight fascination with wilderness for the past few decades. The ugly effect that I have seen is shinny SUVs that make my house unaffordable, litter when they do leave pavement, and try to legaly attack my way of life. My family has been in this state for 6 generations and now people move here from other places and try to make it like the place they came from. My question is, when the houses aren't big enough and the SUVs not shinny enough, why not just go back from whence you came? Instead, inner-city people stay here and try to change my local political environment. So, to those imports who feel it is ok to lobby and harrass against hunting: you are tyrants, attacking my way of life. I haven't outlawed $4 coffee (because it's stupid and if you can waste that much then it should just be taken from you as tax) so leave my hunting alone. And, if you happen to walk your dog in an urban recreation area and are abhored that someone can actually archery hunt there just remember that hunting paid for the are in the first place. And, most importantly, hunting is considered a right of Montana citizens. If you do not like it, please leave. Otherwise, any attack on my right to hunt will be considered theft, and an attack upon my families welfare...how would you react if someone attacked your way of life and the welfare of your family.

What I find so interesting about what you say is, now you know how Native Americans feel!!! You've(your Family has) been there for 6 generations!!! And you are annoyed with these interlopers crashing your hunting!! Jeeez , imagine how Native Americans felt after 14,000 or so yrs of generation after generation, and suddenly not only can't they hunt where they want , but we killed most of their bison!!! Squished them onto reservations , told them how to dress, oh yeah, and lose their language!! You think you've got it rough??? Try being Native American!!! Everyone in Montana might understand, if they can understand why you are unhappy,why the Native Americans are unhappy.. When you lose your freedom, it stinks!

[Aurora616]

Sorry, if you are Native American then you already know this well.