Your Thoughts On the New Public Transportation Projects (Minneapolis, Anoka: loans, public school)

[Ghengis]

Originally Posted by ManBearPig1

Then you pay to build the roads to the middle of nowhere, don't make the rest of subsidize your lifestyle.

oh, you'll pay in order to get veggies to the market, I'm quite sure of that.

[StPaulEastSider]

Originally Posted by golfgal

I don't want to live in the city, I like having my car and being able to go where I want, when I want and not having to worry about catching a bus. I like that my kids can hop in the car and drive to their friends' house, haul all their band stuff to and from school, etc. Most of what our kids participate in they would never be able to living in the city and especially never if they had to depend on a bus to get them around. I like having a yard and not having to listen to my neighbor's tv because their house is 5" away from my house. Thanks anyway. You city dwellers are the ones complaining....

A lot of what my kids participate in they'd have a hard time doing in the suburbs, for example my 16yo daughter is a spoken word poetry artist and she goes to open mike events and poetry slams at the various colleges & universities, as well as coffee houses, throughout both Mpls & St. Paul. Her "car" is the MTC. I like not having to drive her to all these events... she also takes the bus to her internship job @the Walker and to a St. Paul Rec Center where she has another internship/job. Last night I was going to run get her from her dad's and she told me not to bother, she'd take the bus because she had a stop to make which was on the bus route and so she said it would just be easier for her to take the bus, which she did. And I spent the time I would have spent running her around conversing w/my two younger kids. Works for me!

[DarkWolf]

Just so we know all the different types of Rail....

Electric Light Rail
Top Speed : 60-70mph
Stops : Every , 1500ft to 2 Miles
Average line length : 20 miles



Hudson Bergen Light Rail in Paulus Hook - Jersey City - YouTube

Diesel Light Rail
Top Speed : 60-80mph
Stops : Every half Mile to Mile
Average line Length : 40 miles


NJT Riverline in Downtown Camden,NJ - YouTube


Southbound Riverline Train passing Through Burlington,NJ - YouTube

Streetcar / Trolley
Top Speed : 20-40mph
Stops : Every 1000ft to Half Mile
Average line Length : 15 miles


SEPTA Subway--Surface Trolley Lines - YouTube

Subway / Elevated Rail
Top Speed : 60-70mph
Stops : Every 1000ft to half Mile
Average Line Length : 20 Miles


NYC Subway @ 14th Street - Union SQ - 4 - 5 - 6 & L - YouTube

Commuter / Regional Rail
Top Speed : 70-125mph
Stops : Every half mile to 2 miles
Average Line Length : 50-90 miles


Mountain Station Video Part 2 - YouTube

Intercity / High Speed Rail
Speeds : 125-230mph
Stops : Every 20-40 miles
Average line length : 300-500 Miles


Princeton Junction Amtrak Acela Express - YouTube

[homiej]

Originally Posted by Ghengis

oh, you'll pay in order to get veggies to the market, I'm quite sure of that.

We'd prefer if they were delivered by more efficient train, then distributed by truck locally as they used to be before we invested in the asphalt money pit of a highway system we have now.

[homiej]

That Acela video is absolutely badass. I rode it once, there's no experience like it.

[Ghengis]

Originally Posted by homiej

We'd prefer if they were delivered by more efficient train, then distributed by truck locally as they used to be before we invested in the asphalt money pit of a highway system we have now.

using trains would be a great idea if you like to eat rotten vegetables.

[homiej]

Originally Posted by Ghengis

using trains would be a great idea if you like to eat rotten vegetables.

Why would that cause vegetables to rot? If we had a rail system on par with other countries, we could directly load containers onto high speed trains and have them across the country much faster.

Then again, I buy local whenever I can.

[uptown_urbanist]

It's not the transport of commercial goods that is our primary problem here. It's the excessive amount of driving done by people who live in areas where public policy decisions have stacked the deck to encourage a lifestyle revolving around cars. It's not the truck driving to the store with tomatoes that's doing us in; it's the reality that public policies have made it easy to develop car-dependent lifestyles where hundreds of individual people get into their cars and drive several miles to get to the grocery store to buy the tomatoes, in the process putting massive amounts of wear and tear on an unnecessarily extensive road system that then has to be maintained and replaced. It's not just the local residents or drivers who are paying for those costs. I think people should have the right to live in a sprawling subdivision if that's what they want, but I think that the government policies should not be designed to make that decision come essentially cost-free to the people who live that lifestyle. Look at all the people out there who truly believe that roads are fully covered by gas taxes! I think many people simply have no idea that their housing choices come with broader implications and costs, and seriously believe that their lifestyle decisions are unsubsidized. Now if someone could make an argument that shaping our metro area to resemble Eagan was the best thing for the public good, then maybe those expenses would be worth it. But if anyone can make that argument I'd like to hear it.

[homiej]

Originally Posted by uptown_urbanist

It's not the transport of commercial goods that is our primary problem here. It's the excessive amount of driving done by people who live in areas where public policy decisions have stacked the deck to encourage a lifestyle revolving around cars. It's not the truck driving to the store with tomatoes that's doing us in; it's the reality that public policies have made it easy to develop car-dependent lifestyles where hundreds of individual people get into their cars and drive several miles to get to the grocery store to buy the tomatoes, in the process putting massive amounts of wear and tear on an unnecessarily extensive road system that then has to be maintained and replaced. It's not just the local residents or drivers who are paying for those costs. I think people should have the right to live in a sprawling subdivision if that's what they want, but I think that the government policies should not be designed to make that decision come essentially cost-free to the people who live that lifestyle. Look at all the people out there who truly believe that roads are fully covered by gas taxes! I think many people simply have no idea that their housing choices come with broader implications and costs, and seriously believe that their lifestyle decisions are unsubsidized. Now if someone could make an argument that shaping our metro area to resemble Eagan was the best thing for the public good, then maybe those expenses would be worth it. But if anyone can make that argument I'd like to hear it.

Removing a lot of the trucks from the road would do wonders for air quality though. It would also reduce congestion and aid wear on the road making the roads less of a money pit.

I agree though. It's a fault of the way people live and the policies that allow them to live in that financially unsustainable way.

[wherespankakehouse?]

So much venom directed towards suburban vs. urban living. Who's right and who's wrong? Great cities / metropolitan areas have both great urban cores, great suburbs, and great communities that run the full spectrum in between.

To each their own. As far as I'm concerned, there needs to be more expenditure on developing LRT, BRT, commuter rail, and streetcar networks. Likewise, keeping the existing freeway network unsnarled (such as the 169-494 project) is also a worthy endeavor. It's a matter of moving goods and resources with efficiency. Trains, planes, automobiles, streetcars, buses, bicycles, and nikes are all part of the answer.