[Sparrow_temp]

Global warming -- lol. If only the predictions were true, Canada and the northern USA would be in great shape. I say bring it on -- it would be a good thing. If the sea level rises -- move to higher ground -- it's a heck of a lot cheaper to move people and rebuild then trying to somehow prevent something which we most likely have no role in. Even if it were 100% mankind's fault -- we couldn't stop it so committing economic suicide is not the answer. Of all the reasons not to move south -- global warming is really not on my list.

Water may be a problem in arid zones such as the SW. This is not a global warming thing though. It's just that you can't expect to put millions of people in a place where the water source cannot renew itself without running into a problem in the long run.

The more immediate problems will be due to people. I expect more and more problems due to illegal immigration and a massive influx of basically poor people who do not want to assimilate into the US culture but want all of the economic benefits from it. Places just can't absorb the economic consequences of this -- especially if the country as a whole goes into recession.

[darstar]

Originally Posted by Sparrow_temp

Global warming -- lol. If only the predictions were true, Canada and the northern USA would be in great shape. I say bring it on -- it would be a good thing. If the sea level rises -- move to higher ground -- it's a heck of a lot cheaper to move people and rebuild then trying to somehow prevent something which we most likely have no role in. Even if it were 100% mankind's fault -- we couldn't stop it so committing economic suicide is not the answer. Of all the reasons not to move south -- global warming is really not on my list.

Water may be a problem in arid zones such as the SW. This is not a global warming thing though. It's just that you can't expect to put millions of people in a place where the water source cannot renew itself without running into a problem in the long run.

The more immediate problems will be due to people. I expect more and more problems due to illegal immigration and a massive influx of basically poor people who do not want to assimilate into the US culture but want all of the economic benefits from it. Places just can't absorb the economic consequences of this -- especially if the country as a whole goes into recession.

People go where the jobs are , legal and illegal. When the jobs are in the service sector , its more likely because of retired masses moving to these places. IE; FL. When the jobs are in the agriculture related sector , the illegals will be there to fill them........ If , all the retired folks move out , because of floods, hurricanes, extreme heat , lack of affordable drinkable water, and taxes , then whats left is the AG, sector. If the climate becomes to difficult to grow crops , then the area becomes a lose lose.......this is whats happening now....... and , it will get worse as the planet warms up.

[Coldjensens]

I grew up in Michigan (near South Lyon/Northville), moved to Orange County CA for 18 years and then moved back here two years ago (Grosse Ile).

There are pluses and minuses to each place. To put things simply, California is more fun, Michigan is more pleasant. If you are young, you wil probably like California better, as you get older and have kids, you may want to return. there are many exceptions. My wife disliked the California weather she found it boring. I found it generally magnificent.

In Michigan, the air, water and ground are cleaner (most places). There are real trees. You rarely wait in line, in traffic, or spend an hour driving around looking for parking. You can walk outside your house and swim, ski, hike, see deer or foxes or Eagles, wave at a neighbor without worrying that your wave could be interpreted as a gang sign resulting in gunfire (most places). Lots of wonderful nature opportunities are a short drive away and there will actually be few or no people at these natural places.

However in Michigan there are few restaurant's, theaters or other businesses. A bad economy. Your home value goes down instead of up. You income goes down instead of up.

In Southern California you can drive to beaches, deserts, or mountains (not practical to live at either place), but they will be insanely crowded for an "empty" place, and you will sit in traffic all the way. You can dine at a restaurant from any country in the world within a mile or two of your house (again traffic and parking are problems). You make a fortune on real estate as long as you time things right and eventually move away. Best of all NO BUGS. Not counting the termites that eat your house and the roaches as big as mice. No mosquitoes to speak of, no biting flies. Fleas are a year round problem for dogs and cats though.


Most of the things people think are big deal are not real critical factors in either place.

Earthquakes/Floods/Fires (CA) vs. tornadoes or freezing to death (MI):

Rarely happen. Not much direct impact. If you use common sense it is unlikely that these things will hurt you. There is an off chance that you could lose your house and even your life, from natural events in either place. However that is really pretty rare, look at the statistics. I would guess that freezing in Michigan is the top cause of death, but that is usually caused by being unprepared or being stupid. I would bet that after freezing, there have been more people killed by mountain lions in California than have died in the past 10-15 years of all of these other events in either place put together. Overall I think that it is substantially more likely that you, or someone you know will suffer injury or property loss from a natural disaster in CA than in MI. However deaths are not that common in either place.

In CA, the fires are awful even if they are not close to you because the sky is filled with smoke and your cars, house, face hair and everything else gets covered in ashes. The floods take out some houses, but if you want to avoid that problem, do not buy a house on a hill.

Michigan winters are not bad, they are fun. They are just too long. There is no reason to ever be cold if you take some simple precautions. Wear a hat, gloves, socks and if necessary hand and foot warmers used by skiers. Warm up your car for ten minutes before you leave. Best of all snuggle by a fire.

Winter is beautiful. Snowfall makes everything clean and peaceful. Driving is rarely a problem because they are so good at getting the roads cleared right away. Shoveling the drive is good for you. Why pay for a health club? If you do it with your kids it can be fun. Nothing is better than taking a hike in the woods during a heavy snowfall.


The weather issue varies. We have seven people in our family. About half prefer Michigan weather, half prefer California weather. The lack of sunshine can be tough at times. They key is to get outside every minute that you can whenever there is any sunshine. I cannot remember a single week in the past two years that we did not have at least some sunshine although for a short time. Fall in Michigan is fabulous. Nothing is better anywhere I have been.

California weather is usually pleasant, but it has been getting intolerably hot in the summers lately. Forget that "Dry heat" B.S. Hot is Hot. Humidity tends to drain you more, but in a dry climate, it is almost impossible to escape the heat. By the way our winter heating bills in MI and our summer cooling bills in CA were about the same. CA was slightly higher. However during the summer you have rolling blackouts or unplanned black outs and then you are really hot and can forget about sleeping. Michigan Summers have been very pleasant since we came here. Not much need for AC except for a couple of weeks in July/August. Living on an island probably helps moderate the heat a bit.

Michigan is far far prettier than Orange County. OC is basically a desert. The trees and grass are all artificially maintained and nothing is ever truly green there. It is a grey green at best. Mostly brown. Of course in OC and LA most of what you see is concrete, asphalt and steel. On the other hand Central and Northern California offer some of the prettiest places in the world. However it is a long drive to get to them from population centers and you may have to wait in line to see them - particularly in the Yosemite valley.

Both places are about equal in outdoor activities. CA has the edge with beaches and mountains and desert, but you have to drive there and that means sitting in traffic, so you go to those places less often. MI has beaches, forests and tons of lakes and rivers right near your house. Not as spectacular as some parts of CA, but more available. However you can only use them part of the year. There is always cross country skiing.

Both places are about equal in messed up screwball governments. Actually I think MI is slightly worse.

Both places have great people. It is dumb to generalize, but if you want to generalize you could say that in CA people are more open, easier to get to know but difficult to get to really open up. Many friendships tend to be short term, often because people move around all the time. In MI it is difficult to get people to talk to you, but easy to get them to help you. Once you get to know someone in Michigan, friendships seem to be deeper and more long term. There are millions of exceptions in both places though.

Top ten minuses:

Michigan:

1. reduced sunshine especially during November.
2.Mud. especially March, April, and June.
3. Poor economy.
4. Limited dining, shopping,or man made entertainment options.
5. Sometimes backwards attitudes.
6. Smoking in restaurants and other public places.
7. Home maintenance takes up a lot more of your time.
8. You always have to be prepared for adversity, especially sudden changes in the weather. A broken car could destroy your whole day, or even kill you in some cases.
9. You need three completely different wardrobes.
10. Bugs will try to eat you and or sting you.

California:
1. Crowds (traffic parking, waiting in line for everything)
2. Dryness. (really tough on your skin, lips, etc.)
3. Crime (Michigan has a problem in Detroit, but other areas are far better than typical nice areas of California)
4. No trees/woods (Palm trees do not count, they look like telephone poles).
5. Generally crowded living conditions everywhere. (try to buy an acre of land).
6. generally poor schools.
7. generally poor morals and social values (what you drive and what you wear is more important that who you are, not everyone is this way, but that is the prevalent attitude).
8. Harried lifestyle. You are always rushing around. Always late for something. Always stressed to some degree.
9. Tiny houses on postage stamp lots.
10. Natural disasters are more frequent and more likely to impact someone that you know.



Personally I would prefer to live in So Cal. or better yet central coastal CA (if I did not need to work). However for raising a family, MI seems better. It is quieter and slower paced here. That is also good as you get older. I have no more patience for waiting in lines.