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My girlfriend and I have had a if-everything-falls-into-place plan of moving down to Cabo San Lucas for a year or two for awhile. We realized on a recent Maui trip that coming to Maui is a much simpler process (a main concern of MX is finding her a job - I can work from anywhere but her options are close to zero in Cabo except service industry)
A primary appeal of Mexico to me is lack of rules - You can take a truck out of town a bit in any direction, drive out on a beach, pitch a tent, play with your dog, build a bonfire, drink, relax, and be merry - no permits, rangers, etc to worry about. This is great, as beach bonfires are in my top 5 favorite things in life.
I've been researching beach camping, dogs, and bonfires in Maui a bit and haven't found much conclusive on what actually happens versus the rules in the books. I've seen beach camp spots listed - near Hana, near 7 sacred pools, south of lahaina, in kahalui by airport, at ho'okipa. Is that about it? No freedom to pitch a tent at a random quiet beach spot? What about an air matress in the back of an SUV or truck bed? Are dogs allowed at any/all of these areas?
Are bonfires allowed on any maui beaches? I know they happen at Little Beach some, where laws seem to largely not be enforced. Never saw them anywhere else though, thinking back on our visit.
Sounds like you'd much prefer the camping at Cabo since most of what you want would be illegal in Hawaii. Driving on the beach is not allowed, dogs on beaches are frowned on and generally illegal, bonfires are not a happy option and drinking is usually illegal, too.
Sounds like you'd much prefer the camping at Cabo since most of what you want would be illegal in Hawaii. Driving on the beach is not allowed, dogs on beaches are frowned on and generally illegal, bonfires are not a happy option and drinking is usually illegal, too.
Drinking is not an issue and driving on the beach I mentioned only as a means of access. When you can park nearby it's irrelevant.
"dogs on beaches are frowned on and generally illegal" --- I read that leash laws are strictly enforced at some beaches, but didn't see anything saying they're illegal (and did note a south kihei beach listed as very dog friendly). I figured that the rules at one state beach would be the same everywhere - do you know for sure if it's illegal, on-leash?
Your main concern about Mexico being that your girlfriend would only be able to get a service job is the same issue on Maui. There is no industry, no manufacturing, no computer jobs.
Your main concern about Mexico being that your girlfriend would only be able to get a service job is the same issue on Maui. There is no industry, no manufacturing, no computer jobs.
She's in insurance, financial, medical; could even work at a doctor's office if necessary - industries that exist even in tourist economies. She's been looking and has seen options. Thanks though!
Nope, the rules change depending on the island and the park. Some say no dogs at all, others allow dogs on leashes and the dog friendly park might just be that they don't enforce the leash laws. I'm not on Maui, so I can't give you specific park information.
No bonfires allowed on Maui beaches. Yes, Little Beach has their drum circle and bonfire, which is not legal, but tolerated because everyone is well-behaved and they clean up their mess. No, you cannot collect wood and build a big bonfire on other beaches, someone will report you. There are many houses built close to the beaches, and people will see the bonfire. Residents don't want to accidentally walk on hot coals, or find chunks of wood and charcoal in the morning. We also don't want you tramping around cracking down branches from the trees nearby, nor the sparks flying around possibly igniting the dry grasses. We don't want turtles thwarted from laying eggs in the sand. Even if you are very tidy and restrained, that bonfire is going to encourage many others who are not.
The law is that dogs must be restrained, either confined on/in property (land or car) or on leash.
Actual practice is that some dog owners let their dogs out to poop and roam. In our neighborhood we first ask the owners to walk and clean up after, but if they continue to let their dogs roam we will report them. Not just because of the mess, but because we have many small children who run around screaming and playing, and we don't want any chase-attack triggers. Besides, the owner needs to be responsible for their pet, not put the inconvenience onto the rest of the neighborhood.
We do see unleashed dogs at the beaches, but usually only during off-peak season or times of day, and usually with the owner close at hand. We have seen dog owners cited for leash violation. I think the article you found was about Keawakapu, and was from 2006, so 4 years of growth has changed things. Keawakapu is the beach we go to, and yes there are dogs there, but not during heavy visitor times, and usually on a less populated stretch. The reaction to anyone with a dog, restrained or not, is usually in relation to how the owner is handling the situation. If the dog runs up to a passer-by, they can take that as threatening, and owner just sits there shouting "don't worry, he doesn't bite"... not so good. After all, the risk there is all with the person who might get bitten, right? Who cares if you are fined, when I'm missing a piece of my leg or butt? Or if the dog is pooping all over the sand, and the owner just kicks some sand over the pile, again not so great, because we know someone is going to step on that pile sooner or later. But if the owner stays by the dog, calls him/her over when someone is walking by, and cleans up and takes the mess OFF the beach, then things are generally fine. Fine as in no one will call to report. But an officer will still cite you.
One thing to remember is that Maui is dependent on visitors. You, as a camping local, aren't necessarily bringing income to the island. You are just enjoying. So you might think it's fine to build bonfires, let your dog run around, sleep in your truck. OK for you and your personal experience, but if it drives away visitors, then it isn't so great for those of us who live here and need those visitors to have a pleasant experience.
If you go to a more 'local' beach, not so pretty, more remote, then you are more likely to see people with their dogs running about. But then of course there are the owners and dogs who are not so well trained, and any dog runs the risk of a fight, human or animal.
Beach camping areas are heavily patrolled, because of problems with drugs and crime. I would say that leash violations run a big risk of citation there.
The article also said that the officers were taking a zero tolerance to leash law violations.
Maui County Code of Ordinances - a few bits, not the whole text
6.04.010 Definitions.
"At large" means a situation where a dog is off the real property of the owner and is not under restraint.
"Dangerous dog" means any dog which attacks a person while on or off the owner's property, or a domestic animal while off the owner's property causing bodily injury to the person or serious injury or death to a domestic animal, or behaves in a manner that a reasonable person would believe poses an imminent threat of bodily injury to one or more persons or serious injury or death to domestic animals. A dog's breed shall not be considered in determining whether or not it is dangerous. Mere growling or barking or a combination of both shall not constitute grounds upon which to find a dog to be dangerous.
"Dog park" means an enclosed area within a County park that has been designated for use as an off-leash dog area.
"Enforcement officer" means any law enforcement officer, any employee of the County authorized to enforce this chapter, and any employee of the humane society authorized to enforce this chapter.
"Excessive barking" means continuous and/or incessant barking, baying, crying, howling, or any other noise which disturbs any person at any time of day or night for ten consecutive minutes or intermittently for twenty minutes; provided, however, that barking shall not be deemed excessive if such barking is the result of a trespass or threatened trespass by a person or persons on private property on which the dog is situated or is the result of a person teasing or otherwise provoking the dog.
6.04.040 Animal regulations--general. A. An owner of a dog shall keep the dog under restraint, except the following:
1. A dog being used by law enforcement agencies for law enforcement purposes;
2. A dog used during hunting; accompanied by its owner, and used with the consent of the owner of the real property upon which the hunting occurs;
3. A dog used during organized competitions, or during training for such competitions, accompanied by its owner, and used with the consent of the owner of the real property upon which the dog is used; and
4. A dog being monitored by its owner or handler within the confines of an authorized dog park.
B. An owner of an animal shall treat the animal in a humane manner.
C. An owner of a dog shall not allow the dog to cause a nuisance. The owner shall be held responsible for every behavior of such dog under the provisions of this chapter.
D. No person shall abandon an animal.
E. An owner of a dog shall not intentionally, knowingly, recklessly, or negligently permit the dog to:
1. Attack a person or domestic animal; or
2. Behave in a manner that a reasonable person would believe poses an imminent threat of bodily injury to a person or serious injury or death to a domestic animal. The terms "negligently", "intentionally", "knowingly", and "recklessly" shall have the same meaning as are ascribed to the terms in section 702-206, Hawaii Revised Statutes.
F. No person shall own, harbor, train, or use any dog for the purpose of dog fighting.
6.04.110 Penalties. A. Any person convicted of a violation of any section or provision of this chapter, except the provisions relating to excessive barking dogs and dangerous dogs, shall be fined not more than $500. The minimum fine shall be as follows: for a first violation, a fine of not less than $50; for a second violation within five years after a prior violation under this section, a fine of not less than $100; and, for a third violation within five years after two prior violations under this section, a fine of not less than $200.
B. Any person convicted of a violation of any section or provision of this chapter relating to excessive barking dogs shall be fined not more than $500. The minimum fine shall be as follows: for a first violation, a fine of not less than $100; for a second violation within five years after a prior violation under this section, a fine of not less than $200; and, for a third violation within five years after two prior violations under this section, a fine of not less than $500.
C. Any person convicted of a violation of any section or provision of this chapter relating to dangerous dogs shall be fined not more than $1,000 and imprisoned not more than thirty days. The minimum sentence shall be as follows: for a first violation, a fine of not less than $200; for a second violation within five years after a prior violation under this section, a fine of not less than $500; and, for a third violation within five years after two prior violations under this section, a fine of not less than $1,000. In addition, a court may require restitution for damages caused by a dangerous dog; provided, that this section shall not preclude a person damaged by a dangerous dog from pursuing a civil remedy.
D. The portion of the fine equal to the minimum fine shall not be suspended.
E. A successive violation of the same owner involving different dogs shall be considered a subsequent and not a first violation.
F. For purposes of this Section 6.04.110, a violation is defined to include the payment of a fine directly to the district court or the finding of guilt by a court after a contested hearing.
A primary appeal of Mexico to me is lack of rules - You can take a truck out of town a bit in any direction, drive out on a beach, pitch a tent, play with your dog, build a bonfire, drink, relax, and be merry - no permits, rangers, etc to worry about. This is great, as beach bonfires are in my top 5 favorite things in life.
Why don't you do this where you live now, or where your family and friends live, or do this by your employers house! Park in your local park and build a fire there, let your dog poop on your land!
You like Cabo because of the lack of rules? and lack of rules and Maui are in your same thinking? Keep your disrespectful loser butt back where you live now. How would you like it if Hawaiian residents moved to where you live and started shacking on your front lawn? You wouldn't like that. It is so disrespectful to think that because Hawaii isn't exactly like the rest of the mainland that just being a BUM is perfectly acceptable for Hawaii!
Calico Salsa- Thank you very much for the comprehensive reply.
Fortunately, we have a very well-trained, docile dog and are very conscientious owners. I pick up poop I see from lazy owner's in addition to our dog's. She doesn't bite, growl, or have any aggressive behavior, she just likes to chase sticks, especially in the water - sticks that we find on the ground, I've never broken any off of a tree. That's why I asked about the strictness of leash laws in general; not to aggregiously violate with people around but to know for reference.
As for the bonfires - totally understandable, would never want to negatively impact the wildlife or residents. I grew up in San Diego where there are a number of beaches with fire rings and regular bonfires, attracting locals and tourists alike - just didn't know if these existed anywhere in Maui.
And for camping - I inquired about general laws and restrictions because I'd like to camp on a remote beach. Pitching a tent somewhere tourists would see, in view of residents, etc, isn't exactly appealing to me Designated campgrounds are cool I guess, and camping isn't a big part of my life anyway, so not a huge deal. Just curious on what's possible in enjoying a more laid back lifestyle.
Again, much appreciated.
PacificFlights- how about you go ahead and start assuming that not everyone in the world is a disrespectful a**hole? I am a successful, wealthy professional seeking a more laid back, worry-free lifestyle. Does that make me a BUM? While I have property to do whatever I please here, and will there as well should I move, I'm not going to have a 10-20 million dollar home on the sand. I have the utmost respect for my surroundings and for people who show me respect in kind. Thanks for your misplaced assumption.
I think this discussion started wrong. "Lack of rules" and "no permits, rangers, etc to worry about" are not the best way to start the conversation. Honestly, without your second post I'd be thinking that you are rude, looking for the place with no law and order. So, I absolutely understand PacificFlights' answer.
By the way, did you read lately about Mexico? The country is absolutely out of law, the president doesn't control almost 10% of the country and drug gangs are killing as they like. "Lack of rule" in its purest form, I don't see moving there as a clever move.
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Designated campgrounds are cool I guess, and camping isn't a big part of my life anyway, so not a huge deal. Just curious on what's possible in enjoying a more laid back lifestyle.
