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Some are doing that, but continued by the high demand in the Telluride, consumers let be the new vehicle. It has definitely shaken things up in its class.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SubconsciousMe
I am glad that you have had a positive experience with your local dealerships; however, that has not been my case. When dropping $45k on a vehicle, as with the Telluride, it seems reasonable to wait a few years to make sure those awards are consistent.
Some are doing that, but continued by the high demand in the Telluride, consumers let be the new vehicle. It has definitely shaken things up in its class.
C'mon you are totally over-selling this Telluride. High demand? Shaking things up in it's class? Here are some 2020 Jan-June cumulative mid-size SUV sales numbers for you:
Ford Explorer = 101K sales
Jeep Grand Cherokee = 96K
Toyota Highlander = 79K
Toyota 4Runner = 57K
Honda Pilot = 54K
Chevy Traverse = 52K
Hyundai Palisade = 35K
GMC Acadia = 33K
Dodge Durango = 30K
Nissan Pathfinder = 27K
Kia Telluride = 25K
So where is this high demand you speak of? I'm not seeing it.....customers are still choosing other products way more than the Kia/Hyundai twins.
Also note the Hyundai Santa Fe sales (23K units down) and the Kia Sorrento sales (12K units down) are both getting cannabalized by the Palisade/Telluride in a big way. So the net sales gain for Hyundai/Kia on the Palisade/Telluride are marginal, at best.
C'mon you are totally over-selling this Telluride. High demand? Shaking things up in it's class? Here are some 2020 Jan-June cumulative mid-size SUV sales numbers for you:
Ford Explorer = 101K sales
Jeep Grand Cherokee = 96K
Toyota Highlander = 79K
Toyota 4Runner = 57K
Honda Pilot = 54K
Chevy Traverse = 52K
Hyundai Palisade = 35K
GMC Acadia = 33K
Dodge Durango = 30K
Nissan Pathfinder = 27K
Kia Telluride = 25K
So where is this high demand you speak of? I'm not seeing it.....customers are still choosing other products way more than the Kia/Hyundai twins.
Also note the Hyundai Santa Fe sales (23K units down) and the Kia Sorrento sales (12K units down) are both getting cannabalized by the Palisade/Telluride in a big way. So the net sales gain for Hyundai/Kia on the Palisade/Telluride are marginal, at best.
If you add the Kia/Hyundai twins together they are in between the Highlander and the 4runner in total sales.
To your cannibalizing comment, too early to tell, most sales are down since the March or April figures in this market.
I think it's a bit of an overstatement to call it a game changer vehicle, but it did do what most new vehicles in a segment tend to do, that is cause every other manufacturer to up their game. The every few years model upgrades by each manufacturer ( for the past few decades) has been proof this model works by improving the "breed".
If you add the Kia/Hyundai twins together they are in between the Highlander and the 4runner in total sales.
To your cannibalizing comment, too early to tell, most sales are down since the March or April figures in this market.
I think it's a bit of an overstatement to call it a game changer vehicle, but it did do what most new vehicles in a segment tend to do, that is cause every other manufacturer to up their game. The every few years model upgrades by each manufacturer ( for the past few decades) has been proof this model works by improving the "breed".
Well if you add the Acadia and Traverse together that will add up more than the Palisade/Telluride, too.
These trucks, with the exception of the Palisade front-end IMO, are good looking inside and out. They are also priced aggressively. Unfortunately, though, the Achilles heel is the woefully underpowered and high-revving engine in these products. If they put a better engine in it, I think it could have made more of an impact.
Well if you add the Acadia and Traverse together that will add up more than the Palisade/Telluride, too.
These trucks, with the exception of the Palisade front-end IMO, are good looking inside and out. They are also priced aggressively. Unfortunately, though, the Achilles heel is the woefully underpowered and high-revving engine in these products. If they put a better engine in it, I think it could have made more of an impact.
I agree, vehicles that are essentially the same under the skin should be added together when comparisons are made in sales numbers.
I haven't driven the Kia or the Hyundai at this point, so I can't speak to engine power levels.
I will say that at some point we will be in the market to begin test driving this category of SUV. The Kia and Hyundai are in our sights, as are most everything in the class.
The 4runner gets high marks, mainly because I have driven one and liked it, along with Toyota's proven reliability on average.
I don't normally buy the first year redesign of any vehicle, so that will play into the picture.
AWD is a must for us, so Hyundai/Kia will have to iron out the issues with that drivetrain.
NOTE: It is a bit concerning to see the peak torque being reached at over 5000 RPM compared to it's competitors which reach peak torque at a much lower RPM. But, the RPM for HP is close to most of the competition.
Driving will be the key.
I agree, vehicles that are essentially the same under the skin should be added together when comparisons are made in sales numbers.
I haven't driven the Kia or the Hyundai at this point, so I can't speak to engine power levels.
I will say that at some point we will be in the market to begin test driving this category of SUV. The Kia and Hyundai are in our sights, as are most everything in the class.
The 4runner gets high marks, mainly because I have driven one and liked it, along with Toyota's proven reliability on average.
I don't normally buy the first year redesign of any vehicle, so that will play into the picture.
AWD is a must for us, so Hyundai/Kia will have to iron out the issues with that drivetrain.
NOTE: It is a bit concerning to see the peak torque being reached at over 5000 RPM compared to it's competitors which reach peak torque at a much lower RPM. But, the RPM for HP is close to most of the competition.
Driving will be the key.
RPM at peak torque is what matters, and having to spin your engine at 5,000RPM's constantly is just way too high. In this day and age of engine engineering it's mind boggling. That's an obvious sign they went cheap on the motor and didn't put much effort into it, so I don't expect that engine to win many durability contests. I'm a firm believer in the hotter the engines run over time the quicker they fall apart.
Explorer: 300hp / 310 torque at 3,500 RPMS with 10-speed transmission
Telluride: 291hp / 262 torque at 5,000 RPMS with 8-speed transmission
Night and day there, and Telluride only offers one engine while Explorer has more than just that base engine. But even the base engine has 50 lb-ft more torque at 1,500 RPM's less and mated with more gears in the transmission. Drive those two vehicles back to back and it's not even close.
My neighbor got a Telluride about 6 months ago and after a few months I saw a new Explorer in the driveway. (Telluride was in the garage - I didn't see it at first.) I asked him what happened and he said he couldn't take it anymore as the Telluride was just a dog, especially when loaded with people, so he gave that to his wife and got an Explorer ST for himself.
Last edited by iamweasel; 07-21-2020 at 12:37 PM..
Reason: *
RPM at peak torque is what matters, and having to spin your engine at 5,000RPM's constantly is just way too high. In this day and age of engine engineering it's mind boggling. That's an obvious sign they went cheap on the motor and didn't put much effort into it, so I don't expect that engine to win many durability contests. I'm a firm believer in the hotter the engines run over time the quicker they fall apart.
Explorer: 300hp / 310 torque at 3,500 RPMS with 10-speed transmission
Telluride: 291hp / 262 torque at 5,000 RPMS with 8-speed transmission
Night and day there, and Telluride only offers one engine while Explorer has more than just that base engine. But even the base engine has 50 lb-ft more torque at 1,500 RPM's less and mated with more gears in the transmission. Drive those two vehicles back to back and it's not even close.
My neighbor got a Telluride about 6 months ago and after a few months I saw a new Explorer in the driveway. (Telluride was in the garage - I didn't see it at first.) I asked him what happened and he said he couldn't take it anymore as the Telluride was just a dog, especially when loaded with people, so he gave that to his wife and got an Explorer ST for himself.
Yeah, I'm definitely a Ford man, but the Explorer leaves me unfullfilled. The new 10-speed isn't doing much to help either.
These guys had some really odd takes. I love how these folks judge vehicles based on value versus a number, MSRP, that isn't relevant to anything. I guess that is because they are too lazy to figure out what actual transaction prices are, which ultimately is what matters. Hyundai/Kia did a nice trick there by making the MSRP low and not putting much room there between MSRP and Dealer cost. That helps with reviews like this but unfortunately the dealers are screaming because they can't make enough money on these things.
That being said, reviews like this don't matter if nobody buys them, though, does it? There are countless examples of media groveling over certain vehicles that never sell well. Go look at the past Car and Driver 10-Best lists....half of those cars sold like crap. That's not a knock on Car and Driver as that is a good magazine, but the market has their own opinions and can see through certain tricks.
Ultimately market share in your respective segment is the biggest indicator of success of any vehicle line. In that regard the Hyundai/Kia twins are still far away from the top of the class.
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