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[Premont]

I wonder in Briargrove Park busses to Lamar or Westide High? Even though they're HISD, they're not bad schools. It seems like a nice place to live. Briargrove Park thrives in west Houston | Chron.com - Houston Chronicle

[John84]

Originally Posted by EasilyAmused

Kappinator. Re:Champions/1960. The slummy apartments,empty store fronts, massage parlors, vagrants and dirty streets are a far cry from 20 years ago. While once you get into the actual neighborhoods they are ok (however appreciation has been fairly stagnant), the area around them is sketchy. Not to metion the traffic and stoplights on 1960 are a deal breaker by themselves. Grumbling about the schools are all over these boards.

As Supermac implied, please define what you mean by "Champions/1960" area, which could be define anywhere from 249 to 90 NE of Houston. You're argument seems to suffer from a whole to part fallacy. For instance, I hear Champions and I think of Champions proper, roughly between Champions Park and Champion Forest Drive and I don't see the 'slummy apartments' 'massage parlors' 'vagrants' and 'dirty streets' you refer to.

[Bike4Life]

Originally Posted by Supermac34

This is all pretty much East of Kuyukendahl. The area around Champion Forest and 1960 is still nice, and the area around Louetta and 249 is getting a big pick up by the new Vintage area. Champions Golf Course is still the best around, Champions, Champion Forest, and Huntwick are all still considered top notch neighborhoods. Klein and Cy Fair are still some of the best school districts in the Houston area, with Klein High still being in the tier 1 schools. Multimillion Dollar homes are still being built along Cypresswood. Just a little bit North, around Spring-Cypress has had a huge explosion of growth and has very nice neighborhoods and ameneties.

Also, for the 400s for something new:
Champion Woods has some new stuff in the 400s near Louetta and Stuebner Airline. Its back behind the HEB and butts up against Memorial Northwest. Very, very nice. There's a patio home section, upper end tract section and a custom section. You'd either be in in the high end tract, or a smaller custom inside the gate.

Reminds me of a friend's parents who moved from some where in NW to Old Oaks/Northgate in the early 80's, then moved out to The Woodlands in the 90's, and last year, they got a far away from another not-so-fresh suburbs. They are now in Austin.

[AK123]

I agree with EA, the general area around Champions has gone seriously downhill. Have a few friends up there. One lives in the swanky Northgate Forest which is nice inside, but once you get out on FM 1960, what a mess. Billboards absolutely everywhere, vacant buildings, trashy businesses. And just ugly aside from the trees that have actually been left. Go past some bad areas to get on I-45 from there. The part of 1960 by Champions is a little better, but keep in mind that's only about 2 miles from all kinds of undesirable places like Veteran's Memorial/Bammel and Kuykendahl. Friend was at lunch recently (actually I think the restaurant was in a strip center called Champions something or other) and his car was broken into along with a few others... police acted like it's common in that part of town.

[John84]

Originally Posted by JJP

The part of 1960 by Champions is a little better, but keep in mind that's only about 2 miles from all kinds of undesirable places like Veteran's Memorial/Bammel and Kuykendahl.

2 miles? In an unzoned place like Houston? Heck, you can be a stone's throw from anywhere in Harris county and hit an undesirable place within that radius.

I agree that the Kuykendahl intersection has gone downhill, but I wonder if that's because of the major construction there rather than some inherent issue with the location. I would certainly expect some of the companies to leave. To the immediate west is Northgate as you mention, as well as the new hospital across the road. I'm not as familiar with the locations east, so I'll refrain from commenting.

As for Veterans Memorial, I'm not as certain. It's the polar opposite of the Kuykendahl intersections in terms of vacancies, and in fact just had Staples move in. If there was a problem with business or crime, why would a major office supply outlet choose that intersection as a location?

Your ancedotal story about an unknown location in Champions strip center nothwithstanding, it's hard to pinpoint where this may have happened as there are "Champions" named strip centers 5 miles away from Champions proper, so it's easy to generalize about a specific location from such evidence. Example - burglary happens in Missouri City, "down the road" from Sugar Land Town Center - well that area must be going down hill, right?

Yes, I wish that Houston would become Vermont too and take the billboards down and make the McDs signs be two feet high, but it is not going to happen any time soon. There a blight from an aesthetic perspective to be sure, but it's a false cause to believe they make a location undesirable. There's been billboards along 1960 for more than 30 years.

[AK123]

Originally Posted by John84

2 miles? In an unzoned place like Houston? Heck, you can be a stone's throw from anywhere in Harris county and hit an undesirable place within that radius.

I agree that the Kuykendahl intersection has gone downhill, but I wonder if that's because of the major construction there rather than some inherent issue with the location. I would certainly expect some of the companies to leave. To the immediate west is Northgate as you mention, as well as the new hospital across the road. I'm not as familiar with the locations east, so I'll refrain from commenting.

As for Veterans Memorial, I'm not as certain. It's the polar opposite of the Kuykendahl intersections in terms of vacancies, and in fact just had Staples move in. If there was a problem with business or crime, why would a major office supply outlet choose that intersection as a location?

Your ancedotal story about an unknown location in Champions strip center nothwithstanding, it's hard to pinpoint where this may have happened as there are "Champions" named strip centers 5 miles away from Champions proper, so it's easy to generalize about a specific location from such evidence. Example - burglary happens in Missouri City, "down the road" from Sugar Land Town Center - well that area must be going down hill, right?

Yes, I wish that Houston would become Vermont too and take the billboards down and make the McDs signs be two feet high, but it is not going to happen any time soon. There a blight from an aesthetic perspective to be sure, but it's a false cause to believe they make a location undesirable. There's been billboards along 1960 for more than 30 years.

I know there are some people here that will defend the area to death... sorry, I just think it's not attractive. That 1960 corridor has more billboards and visual blight than most other residential corridors I can think of in the Houston metro. Many of the schools in Spring ISD have really gone downhill in the last several years. Champions/Klein is better than the surrounding area but you're still in unincorporated Harris County (lack of regulations/planning) and have a bad commute for anyone who works in/near downtown.

[EasilyAmused]

Originally Posted by John84

As Supermac implied, please define what you mean by "Champions/1960" area, which could be define anywhere from 249 to 90 NE of Houston. You're argument seems to suffer from a whole to part fallacy. For instance, I hear Champions and I think of Champions proper, roughly between Champions Park and Champion Forest Drive and I don't see the 'slummy apartments' 'massage parlors' 'vagrants' and 'dirty streets' you refer to.

Definition of Champions/1960: 1960 from 45 to 249.
The entire strip is a blight. Even Westhiemer is prettier.

[John84]

Originally Posted by JJP

I know there are some people here that will defend the area to death... sorry, I just think it's not attractive. That 1960 corridor has more billboards and visual blight than most other residential corridors I can think of in the Houston metro. Many of the schools in Spring ISD have really gone downhill in the last several years. Champions/Klein is better than the surrounding area but you're still in unincorporated Harris County (lack of regulations/planning) and have a bad commute for anyone who works in/near downtown.

Agreed - there's a lot more that could be done to make the road itself prettier. Which is a shame, as the roads feeding into aren't bad at all. Champions Forest Drive, Champions Dr., Wunderlich, Cutten, even larger roads such as Kuykendahl all are lush with big pines and in some cases green esplanades. Speaking of which, hopefully the plan to put one along the entire center of FM1960 will come to fruition. I heard that they were starting on it in 2009.

Westheimer prettier? Call me easily amused. Why don't we just agree that both could be improved. Certain parts of it are nice such as inside the loop and right around the Galleria, but I see it being no different than 1960: a major 7 lane thoroughfare, with similar business along it. Instead of tall pines, you have Williams Tower to look at.