Why is Houston so ghetto? (Dallas, Sugar Land: high school, college, live)

[RocketSci]

Originally Posted by Jack Lance

BTW have you ever noticed they only take street view photos of Chicago in the Spring and Summer ? Why do you suppose that is ?

It would be great to have winter pictures of Northern cities, even satellite views. I suppose that cloud cover prevents many good satellite views, though.

Maybe there could also be some Houston street views taken on rainy days, perhaps. I have seen them for San Francisco, for example.

[Vicman]

Houston doesn't have very many poor whites. Bacliff and the rural areas have more of them.

Back in the 1960s and 1970s several East End areas had poor whites but they have become overwhelmingly Hispanic.

Originally Posted by radiolibre99

I agree that there are a lot of low income folk in Houston and this adds to the blight BUT you guys need to quit acting as though the only low income people are Black and Hispanic. I don't know what Texas did but they pretty much told any blue collar redneck from other states to move to Houston. I saw a lot of guys in beat up pick up trucks and cammo seat covers with New York license plates. I know some of you might not count blue collar white folk in the low income category you guys deride but to me it's no different. I don't see the separation.

[radiolibre99]

Originally Posted by Vicman

Houston doesn't have very many poor whites. Bacliff and the rural areas have more of them.

Back in the 1960s and 1970s several East End areas had poor whites but they have become overwhelmingly Hispanic.

They're not overwhelming over the black and Hispanic population but don't act as though they're not there or that it's a low number. Sorry but headed north the numbers increased. It didn't make it any less "ghetto." I would include the poor whites in there with whatever else you're trying to describe as a "blight."

[bu2]

Originally Posted by LisaMesa

Just to let you guys know, I am not trolling. Just giving my honest obsersation, I was just surprised how unkempt a lot areas of Houston were given that it is the fourth largest city in America and is experiencing a population boom. I never said that all of Houston was trashy looking, I saw many beautiful/decent neighborhoods while I was there as well. Perhaps gritty is a better word than trashy, sorry if I offended anyone by using that word.

Just give you guys a reference frame, I grew up in Charleston and I have lived in Chicago, Washington DC and currently San Diego. I think someone was right when they pointed out that lower income neighborhoods are more spread out throughout Houston, in most cities I have lived in the less desirable areas were usually highly concentrated on one side of the city and easy to avoid.

You have a distorted view of reality. San Diego and Charleston are unusually aesthetically pleasing tourist cities. But even Charleston has some really dumpy, scary areas. Washington has some really awful parts as does Chicago, whole sectors of the city.

Houston is very clean for an American city, just not compared to San Diego. People litter less than a lot of other places. Now Houston doesn't have zoning, so you don't have the rougher edges neatly segregated and hidden away. You don't have all the poor moved out to the suburbs that cities like San Diego and Minneapolis tend to.

[Texyn]

Originally Posted by Treasurevalley92

Sure, but but Houston is notorious for huge set back requirements, massive parking requirements large block sizes and wide road requirements, more so than Dallas and Atlanta.

Most older cities were built without zoning but with some code requirements and those code requirements have a much bigger effect as to what a city looks like than zoning. Art Deco in NY is a great example of this, as well is the ally ways and slight setback you find in Chicago neighborhoods. Houston codes called for big setbacks from the street and lots of parking so that is the real reason it looks the way it does.

This is especially the case for the urban areas outside of downtown/close areas. Currently, Downtown, then parts of Midtown, Eado, and 4th Ward do not have parking minimums.

[Jack Lance]

Originally Posted by RocketSci

I wasn't trying to do a comparison with other cities, as it was stated elsewhere that even in the best of cities there are relatively less visually appealing areas.

I was only addressing some of the causes which may have resulted in the impression Houston presents.

Many people in Houston may in fact consider the popular disjointed lower Westheimer sections as appealing or "quirky" while out-of-towners may find the shattered sidewalks, potholed streets, broken-down buildings covered in ivy, muddy standing water, dirty gravel parking lots, vacant overgrown building lots, and vagrants at the bus stops as less-so. And this is in a relatively wealthy neighborhood.

When you post "Houston is ghetto" it clearly implies that Houston is in a state of deterioration that is unique to Houston and other cities that are Ghetto as well, and has a lower quality of life than those cities that are "not" ghetto. All I'm asking is which cities are on those list.

Originally Posted by RocketSci

It would be great to have winter pictures of Northern cities, even satellite views. I suppose that cloud cover prevents many good satellite views, though.

Maybe there could also be some Houston street views taken on rainy days, perhaps. I have seen them for San Francisco, for example.

They do, here is a view of the Fred Hartman Bridge taken in Feb 2017 showing some very foggy conditions that totally block out any views of Galveston Bay. Something tells me some cities may insist they only show their cities during better weather conditions and perhaps even give heads up so some areas can clean up for the view.

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.7036...8i6656!6m1!1e1

[RocketSci]

Originally Posted by Jack Lance

When you post "Houston is ghetto" it clearly implies that Houston is in a state of deterioration that is unique to Houston and other cities that are Ghetto as well, and has a lower quality of life than those cities that are "not" ghetto. All I'm asking is which cities are on those list.

I did not post that Houston was "ghetto" - I don't like that term. But if the OP feels that way I listed several reasons why it may not have met the OP's standards.

Houston has flaws, and has done an honorable job of trying to address many of these in the last decade.

I don't maintain a list and ratings scale of cities in relation to Houston. As others have pointed out, the OP lived in 2 cities with lower rates of poverty, and greater attractions for out of town visitors. Compared to the OPs frame of reference, Houston is larger, poorer, has worse climate and natural disaster history, has lower spending on infrastructure and maintenance, is less scenic in a tourist sense, and has difficulty keeping up with its population growth.

Many of the reasons I described (but not all) can apply to several of the major cities. But that is not what the OP asked. The OP felt it looked ghetto. Just saying "its not" or "other cities are worse" doesn't answer the OPs question.

[Jack Lance]

Originally Posted by RocketSci

I did not post that Houston was "ghetto" - I don't like that term. But if the OP feels that way I listed several reasons why it may not have met the OP's standards.

Houston has flaws, and has done an honorable job of trying to address many of these in the last decade.

I don't maintain a list and ratings scale of cities in relation to Houston. As others have pointed out, the OP lived in 2 cities with lower rates of poverty, and greater attractions for out of town visitors. Compared to the OPs frame of reference, Houston is larger, poorer, has worse climate and natural disaster history, has lower spending on infrastructure and maintenance, is less scenic in a tourist sense, and has difficulty keeping up with its population growth.

Many of the reasons I described (but not all) can apply to several of the major cities. But that is not what the OP asked. The OP felt it looked ghetto. Just saying "its not" or "other cities are worse" doesn't answer the OPs question.

Yes the OP did eventually give us a point of reference after I asked her what she was comparing Houston too

[DavePa]

Originally Posted by Jack Lance

I enjoy the work you do on your post if not necessarily the points you are making. Chicago has been built out for a much longer period of time than Houston . We get there are more of these established neighborhoods in the windy city. Houston has many fine inner loop neighborhoods that have been establish for decades now. I'm sure if you searched Google Maps you will come across them eventually.

BTW have you ever noticed they only take street view photos of Chicago in the Spring and Summer ? Why do you suppose that is ?

When I searched street-views in Dec Jan? I got plenty of late fall and winter scenes. But I wanted green warm season views. LOL

Now I get mostly spring thru fall street-views and most green.
If I saved some winter ones months ago I'd find them easily. But this season far less chance to hit them.
This one a old high-end Victorian one. I can still pull up different seasons.

Summer AUG 2016
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9230...7i13312!8i6656

Same in late fall NOV 2015
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9229...7i13312!8i6656

Same in winter March 2009 w/dusting of snow
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9229...7i13312!8i6656

Bungalow and 2-flat higher crime neighborhood

June 2011
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9112...7i13312!8i6656

Same Dec 2015 w/snow
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9112...7i13312!8i6656

If Chicago ---> did NOT have standard set-backs required???
Where do you think these homes might be???
NEAR THE CURB? Probably

More like Philly? Maybe in how much of it got built

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9835...8i6656!6m1!1e1

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9745...8i6656!6m1!1e1

Philly was a no-set-back required city.

Originally Posted by Treasurevalley92

Sure, but but Houston is notorious for huge set back requirements, massive parking requirements large block sizes and wide road requirements, more so than Dallas and Atlanta.

Most older cities were built without zoning but with some code requirements and those code requirements have a much bigger effect as to what a city looks like than zoning. Art Deco in NY is a great example of this, as well is the alley ways and slight setback you find in Chicago neighborhoods. Houston codes called for big setbacks from the street and lots of parking so that is the real reason it looks the way it does.

I don't think Houston requires huge set-backs today as we see New infill and whole blocks re-did denser. But they can't go streetside ---->of the ditch... The developer though can choose to cover the ditch and curb the street with a sewer-type grate. 'CAUSE THE CITY AIN'T GONNA DO IT.

The set-back thing in Houston is a "Don't Mess with the Ditch" needed aspect? LOL But honestly, who wants a modern city with homes to the street today and no frontage needed OR A DITCH? But in Houston it's fine with it...

Do you want a look of a older Philly in a tight built to the sidewalk there in more of Houston allowed?
I doubt it very much....

[Treasurevalley92]

Originally Posted by DavePa

When I searched street-views in Dec Jan? I got plenty of late fall and winter scenes. But I wanted green warm season views. LOL

Now I get mostly spring thru fall street-views and most green.
If I saved some winter ones months ago I'd find them easily. But this season far less chance to hit them.
This one a old high-end Victorian one. I can still pull up different seasons.

Summer AUG 2016
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9230...7i13312!8i6656

Same in late fall NOV 2015
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9229...7i13312!8i6656

Same in winter March 2009 w/dusting of snow
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9229...7i13312!8i6656

Bungalow and 2-flat higher crime neighborhood

June 2011
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9112...7i13312!8i6656

Same Dec 2015 w/snow
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9112...7i13312!8i6656

If Chicago ---> did NOT have standard set-backs required???
Where do you think these homes might be???
NEAR THE CURB? Probably

More like Philly? Maybe in how much of it got built

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9835...8i6656!6m1!1e1

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9745...8i6656!6m1!1e1

Philly was a no-set-back required city.


I don't think Houston requires huge set-backs today as we see New infill and whole blocks re-did denser. But they can't go streetside ---->of the ditch... The developer though can choose to cover the ditch and curb the street with a sewer-type grate. 'CAUSE THE CITY AIN'T GONNA DO IT.

The set-back thing in Houston is a "Don't Mess with the Ditch" needed aspect? LOL But honestly, who wants a modern city with homes to the street today and no frontage needed OR A DITCH? But in Houston it's fine with it...

Do you want a look of a older Philly in a tight built to the sidewalk there in more of Houston allowed?
I doubt it very much....

Those are great pictures! My understanding is that there are certain historic districts in Houston where the codes are different/grandfathered in etc. This isn't that uncommon. Even in NYC something like 80% of the buildings do not meet current standards.

Chicago has smaller setback requirements than Houston you can see that developers try to maximize efficiency. Philly was built before setback requirements were the norm.