The new and improved Houston Pavilions! (San Antonio, Canyon: hotels, restaurant, shop)

[Truth713]

Originally Posted by oceangaia

Besides a few concerts at House of Blues, why would I go here instead of City Centre?

Thats great for you.. but for certian sides of town , city centre , is just as big a hassle.. why would I someone who stays near white oak.. go all the way to city centre if, I can go DT ?

[blkgiraffe]

Originally Posted by gsmj

No residential component = No change.

The commercial tenants are there to support a day-time lunch crowd, and maybe even a happy-hour crowd, but the shopping and night-life entertainment will continue to suffer with no residential base to support it. Why do you think 90% of downtown closes after 5pm? And citing that there are any number of people within a certain distance of this does nothing to prove their spending habits. Most of those people that are used to prop up numbers are in the end still commuters, which means they aren't gonna take the train or bus or bike or even walk to HP just to do what it is they already currently do more conveniently and comfortably in their car.

The above poster was correct in questioning why someone would pass multiple entertainment and shopping centers/districts across the city (I.e. commuter friendly City Centre) just to come to this one?

Originally Posted by Spade

I like it. But again, for this to work, Houston needs residents downtown. Skyhouse is a start. Whenever that starts construction.

I agree. I don't understand why I got grilled for saying this. It's just a fact that the reason why places like City Centre work is because there is a large population within the area. Downtown Houston can't compete with that at this time and also parking is much less of a hassle in suburban areas. Not matter how much we hate them; parking lots are preferred over parking garages as far as efficiency.

[oespinoza83]

You think the parking situation at City Centre is a "suburban area" blessing? Or am I not reading that correctly? And, City Centre is not in the suburbs, once again assuming you were stating that.

[blkgiraffe]

Originally Posted by oespinoza83

You think the parking situation at City Centre is a "suburban area" blessing? Or am I reading that correctly? And, City Centre is not in the suburbs, once again assuming you were stating that.

Nope, but in Houston people like to park close to their destinations. In Downtown [especially when crowded], your going to walk. This is an car-centric city; so parking lots seem to be the preferred choice.

Yes because city centre and the suburbs location are competely different.

I'm mostly speaking about suburban developments. Downtown and City Centre aren't the same regardless of where CC is.

Even with the parking garages in CC; you're still not far from anything.

[oespinoza83]

CC =/= suburbs, except to those who don't breathe outside of the loop. And last I visited, CC parking was a nightmare compared to parking for Rockets games I attend (where parking options are vast and convenient).

[blkgiraffe]

Originally Posted by oespinoza83

CC =/= suburbs, except to those who don't breathe outside of the loop. And last I visited, CC parking was a nightmare compared to parking for Rockets games I attend (where parking options are vast and convenient).

I never said CC parking was great or easy, but if one had to choose between downtown and CC. CC would get the most votes.

[Redlionjr]

People go clubbing downtown(no matter if it's a hip-hop crowd)people eat and also go to shows at House of Blues all the time downtown. People go see the Rockets and Astros play downtown. It is as simple as if you build it they will come. You can't put businesses that City Centre has in Green street(horrible name btw). Downtown is still in the center of the city and is an ideal location for people. If I could afford it I wouldn't mind staying downtown because it's dap in the middle. Case and point Wednesday the Phoenicia market was pretty packed and active and seems to be doing successful. All you have to do is build things that other areas of Houston don't offer and people will flock to it. Last night was a good turn out people flocked to the event not to mention restaurants in HP were pretty packed and continue to do quite well.

[oceangaia]

Originally Posted by oespinoza83

You think the parking situation at City Centre is a "suburban area" blessing? Or am I not reading that correctly? And, City Centre is not in the suburbs, once again assuming you were stating that.

Being 20+ miles from DT it would have been considered in the sticks at one time. Now it may not be "suburbs" but it's 20+ miles closer to the west suburbs. Woodlands draws the north suburbs. Nobody in the east suburbs has any money to spend. Sugarland could use a CC-type development.

Parking is not so bad at CC. Even in prime time weekend evening I can park in a garage right next to everything or a few blocks away for free. If I get there before 7pm I can usually park free in the garage by the theater. It's bounded by SHTR and I-10 so easy in/out access.

HP will be/was a nice and attractive place to visit, but the question is whether it will draw enough frequent visitors to be profitable. And people go see the Rockets and Astros but there is nowhere near that kind of parking space by HP.

[blkgiraffe]

Originally Posted by Redlionjr

People go clubbing downtown(no matter if it's a hip-hop crowd)people eat and also go to shows at House of Blues all the time downtown. People go see the Rockets and Astros play downtown. It is as simple as if you build it they will come. You can't put businesses that City Centre has in Green street(horrible name btw). Downtown is still in the center of the city and is an ideal location for people. If I could afford it I wouldn't mind staying downtown because it's dap in the middle. Case and point Wednesday the Phoenicia market was pretty packed and active and seems to be doing successful. All you have to do is build things that other areas of Houston don't offer and people will flock to it. Last night was a good turn out people flocked to the event not to mention restaurants in HP were pretty packed and continue to do quite well.

I never said people don't go to HP or downtown though. You're really just repeating everything I've said. However, I agree.

Originally Posted by oceangaia

Being 20+ miles from DT it would have been considered in the sticks at one time. Now it may not be "suburbs" but it's 20+ miles closer to the west suburbs. Woodlands draws the north suburbs. Nobody in the east suburbs has any money to spend. Sugarland could use a CC-type development.

Parking is not so bad at CC. Even in prime time weekend evening I can park in a garage right next to everything or a few blocks away for free. If I get there before 7pm I can usually park free in the garage by the theater. It's bounded by SHTR and I-10 so easy in/out access.

HP will be/was a nice and attractive place to visit, but the question is whether it will draw enough frequent visitors to be profitable. And people go see the Rockets and Astros but there is nowhere near that kind of parking space by HP.

[Truth713]

Originally Posted by oceangaia

Being 20+ miles from DT it would have been considered in the sticks at one time. Now it may not be "suburbs" but it's 20+ miles closer to the west suburbs. Woodlands draws the north suburbs. Nobody in the east suburbs has any money to spend. Sugarland could use a CC-type development.

Parking is not so bad at CC. Even in prime time weekend evening I can park in a garage right next to everything or a few blocks away for free. If I get there before 7pm I can usually park free in the garage by the theater. It's bounded by SHTR and I-10 so easy in/out access.

HP will be/was a nice and attractive place to visit, but the question is whether it will draw enough frequent visitors to be profitable. And people go see the Rockets and Astros but there is nowhere near that kind of parking space by HP.

The only thing that under minds that arugument is the veunes with in the HP are profitable.

people make this rather mis-informed mindset that because the HP as a complex failed it is therefore a failure ..ignoring that the bussiness within the complex do and have been making a profit, so that being the case how can you call HP a failure.. in fact the only real problem with HP was on the mangament side