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I have had listing agents refuse to show me properties b/c I am not represented. I have had listing agents tell me that its illegal for me to buy property without using an agent. I have had listing agents refuse to transmit my offer to the seller. The list goes on and on and its not isolated to my experiences. People are suspicious b/c most of the realtors are looking out for other realtors by refusing to do business with someone who is not a realtor. Its dishonest and its time for that change.
There is no reason in the world that a buyer should not be allowed to deduct half of the commission against the sales price if he does not come with a realtor except that realtors refuse to do it b/c they are rabidly protecting their livelihood. Realtors have a strong voice and are well organized....they are clinging to their commissions despite the fact that the internet is now doing 9/10 of their job for them.
The 6-7% commission is alive and well now, but it is in trouble. The internet is able to quickly and accurately answer nearly any question that a realtor can and it does it for free 24/7.
So..I'm not alone here
We have done all the work and I do not see why the seller's agent should be paid 6%. I mean, the only thing we asked about is to let us into the house to look at. That's all.
That may be true but that could also be said of a seller agent. Even though a buyer agent has a fiduciary responsibility to represent the buyer, there is still a conflict in interest in that the buyer wants the lowest price and the lower the price the less the agent makes. That's not to say that any particular agent would put their own interest over their client's but that the "conflict of interest" exists.
So, if I thought I could peel another $5K off the price, I wouldn't - because I could make another whole whopping $150 more off the client, in selling him out? I am sure there are a few that would do that - but it is career suicide to operate in that manner.
Now - talking about utilizing the same agent for both sides - I do feel that it a conflict of interest - you can't get the lowest price for the buyer and the highest price for the seller. It can't work. It is legal in Texas, but I don't think it should be. Whenever I have ever heard of a fraud case, it usually involved a transaction with only one agent.
The lender I like to uses operates like he thinks it's a game to see how low he can get the closing costs and the interest rate. Sure, he makes a tiny bit less than he would have, had he not been like that - but the guy gets lots and lots of referrals. That's just smart.
So..I'm not alone here
We have done all the work and I do not see why the seller's agent should be paid 6%. I mean, the only thing we asked about is to let us into the house to look at. That's all.
Not alone at all. I have bought multiple homes, rental homes, investment properties, commercial and industrial buildings, ranches, and vacant lots. By the time I have contacted the listing agent I know more about the property than they do.
Half the time I don't even need to see the inside of the property - I just need my offer transmitted to the seller....and even that simple task is met with 4-5 emails explaining why I cant do that without a realtor or a follow up email asking me to sign their representation agreement letting them be both listing and selling agent....I actually had one realtor try to get me to sign the dual representation agreement by telling me it was a disclosure statement I had to sign.
I am well aware that all of the things I have said the realtors do are technically against the TREC code, and I could report them, but they all do it, every single one I have done business with except for the one who sold the ranch...perhaps b/c a ranch listing is very different, I dont know?
My biggest peeve though is that the cost to sell an expensive property is still based on a percentage rather than a flat cost. A listing agent who lists and sells a $1,000,000 property collects a $30,000 or $60,000 paycheck for what? They took some photos, they stuck it on HAR, and they complete about an hour worth of paperwork...It is impossible to justify that cost for selling the property other than the fact that without HAR or the MLS listing it will never sell. The realtors costs don't change when the price on the listing is higher - just their profits.
Are you serious? The entire real estate market is fraudulent, starting with agents themselves. I would go into the business if it wasnt already so crowded with other opportunists as it is.
MY EXPERIENCE OF A REAL ESTATE AGENT FROM MY HISTORY (spoken in the shoes of a real estate agent)
OK, so I tell a buying client that he or she isn't paying for me because magically my outrageous cut won't affect bargaining ability with the seller. I look up super secret MLS databases that only I can have access to...well, at least that is what I tell my buying client. I then look up market value of comps to the house my client would be interested in...if it is lower then the asking I would gauge how my client feels. If my client really wants it, we would go full asking price. If client is hesitant, I would make the client feel better by going market price and tell the client that the price is actually 5K or so under market price. If the property is under market, I would overstate the undervaluation and recommend going immediately at asking price or over it (again depending on my gauging of client interest).
If I am selling a property I would try to trick people into signing me as a dual agent. If they catch on I would then just say that they cant see the prop without representation.
On my off days I propagandize the need for realtors while self promoting myself. I will do shady things like hold real estate seminars for FREE, but what people dont realize is that it is just an advertising tool. If I am really hurting I would give into doing kickback workarounds where I offer some of my cut back to the potential buying client through 'homebuying' programs like USAA's home circle program.
So, if I thought I could peel another $5K off the price, I wouldn't - because I could make another whole whopping $150 more off the client, in selling him out? I am sure there are a few that would do that - but it is career suicide to operate in that manner.
Going for the quick buck versus long term referrals may not be smart but people do it. Would you really peel off another $5k even if your client was tickled pink at the current price?
Everyone looks out for themselves, to some degree. Some do it honestly. Some do it unscrupulously. You usually can't tell by looking.
You are a realtor. You feel you are honest. Many of your friends are realtors. You feel they are honest. You see realtors as generally honest. Do you have the same faith in car salesmen? Do you have confidence they will offer you their best price because they are more interested in your referrals than the immediate extra bucks?
WOW, ok a business where there are honest and good Realtors and crappy dishonest ones. Imagine that, sounds like every other business on this planet we call earth.
Can you do the things that a Realtor does, sure you can. But you have to be educated in real estate. A previous post was coming from an investor. He knows his business so yes he does not not need a Realtor. But the average Joe does, most people do not know the full process of buying a home. How to judge what a good price is, which neighborhood is right for them and the list goes on and on.
As for the comment about a Realtor not talking to someone that has an agent is understandable. A Realtor only gets paid if they sell a home. There is a really good chance that someone without an agent is not even serious about buying and heck most likely not even approved for a loan yet.
For the person that mentioned about the million dollar home. Anyone that lists a million dollar home with an agent that is just list in the MLS is an idiot. That agent getting a larger commission should be spending money out of their own pocket to market that home in hopes of making it back when the home sells.
Going for the quick buck versus long term referrals may not be smart but people do it. Would you really peel off another $5k even if your client was tickled pink at the current price?
Everyone looks out for themselves, to some degree. Some do it honestly. Some do it unscrupulously. You usually can't tell by looking.
You are a realtor. You feel you are honest. Many of your friends are realtors. You feel they are honest. You see realtors as generally honest. Do you have the same faith in car salesmen? Do you have confidence they will offer you their best price because they are more interested in your referrals than the immediate extra bucks?
Actually, yes I do. I have bought 3 cars from the same guy because of the trust issue. Are others like him ? Some yes - some absolutely not. But I go back to him. I see realtors is different shades - some I have found to be terrible - some I would use myself, if not a realtor - sort of like all others in all other fields.
On your example - what would I do if the client is happy with a price? Tell him there is probably more we can get off - but strictly up to them. I have had some say "go for it" - others say "accept what we have". However, huge difference if we are not the only buyer bidding - then we have less bravado in countering. Each situation is different in that case - is there a back-up house, how would they feel if they lost it over a couple of thousand, etc. If you are the only buyer bidder, you can be more aggressive.
Just read one of those 5 Things to Ask Your Buyer's Agent articles. One of the TOP 5 things was to make sure your agent found out if the house was built on an ancient Indian burial grounds. To the OP, you can probably leave that question off your list. So much for lists.
Last edited by cheryjohns; 07-20-2012 at 12:00 PM..
There is a really good chance that someone without an agent is not even serious about buying and heck most likely not even approved for a loan yet.
.
In my case, we usually would provide some info to show the realtor that we are serious and we are approved for a loan. The result is the same - no show. Which is not ethical towards the seller. We were very interested in one house, we were ready to buy, but the realtor would not let us in it under any circumstances. I see it as doing a disservice to the seller.
Yes, I do believe there are good honest realtors, but I simply don't have time to go through a few of them untill I find the ONE.
Are you serious? The entire real estate market is fraudulent, starting with agents themselves. I would go into the business if it wasnt already so crowded with other opportunists as it is.
MY EXPERIENCE OF A REAL ESTATE AGENT FROM MY HISTORY (spoken in the shoes of a real estate agent)
OK, so I tell a buying client that he or she isn't paying for me because magically my outrageous cut won't affect bargaining ability with the seller. I look up super secret MLS databases that only I can have access to...well, at least that is what I tell my buying client. I then look up market value of comps to the house my client would be interested in...if it is lower then the asking I would gauge how my client feels. If my client really wants it, we would go full asking price. If client is hesitant, I would make the client feel better by going market price and tell the client that the price is actually 5K or so under market price. If the property is under market, I would overstate the undervaluation and recommend going immediately at asking price or over it (again depending on my gauging of client interest).
If I am selling a property I would try to trick people into signing me as a dual agent. If they catch on I would then just say that they cant see the prop without representation.
On my off days I propagandize the need for realtors while self promoting myself. I will do shady things like hold real estate seminars for FREE, but what people dont realize is that it is just an advertising tool. If I am really hurting I would give into doing kickback workarounds where I offer some of my cut back to the potential buying client through 'homebuying' programs like USAA's home circle program.
I just saw this post. Are you saying that you use to be a Realtor and that's how you acted? Or that's how you believe Realtors are?
That's extremely shady and anyone who acts that way won't last in this business anymore or won't be successful. Maybe in the pre-internet days, but not anymore.
I think agents do need to be careful however and not try and force their dislikes on the customer. I see this over and over again. This is done in many businesses as well. Here's an example.
I used to work for Coca-Cola. I would try and sell new products into accounts, increase volume..etc. A lot of times a shop owner would say something like..."I don't want Diet Coke in my store, I don't like it and it tastes like crap." Well, I would say, you might not like it, but since it's the #2 selling soda beverage in the world, your customers might appreciate having it.
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