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thriftylefty - you may or many not be correct - it is hard to say for sure without a lot of study.
An anecdotal observation that suggests otherwise:
Have you watched the show "Project Runway?" My wife and daughter watch it so I do also sometimes. The reality show is a competition between fashion designers who design and produce clothing as per a unique challenge each week. One contestent loses each week and is kicked out. Eventually there is one winner. I think it is roughly split between male and female contestants. With only one clear exception, every male contestant I have seen over three seasons is gay. This cannot be a result of a social environment, at least not at a young age.
Black children almost always grow up in a black parent led household. So a cultural pattern unique to Black people makes some sense. Gays do not grow up with gay siblings or gay parents nor do I think think they grow up in familes of fashion designers (at least none of the gay people I have known). So why does it seem that male fashion designers are overwhelmingly gay?
This is just a generalization, I suppose, but I was always intrigued by the fact that certain specific communities - minority groups, you might say, seem to excel or even dominate in specific fields, occupations, and/or industries.
First of all, let's get one thing clear: this is meant to be a respectful and non-prejudiced inquiry. PLEASE NO BIGOTED, POLITICAL, RACIST or STEREOTYPING RANTS.
Let's honestly discuss how the myriad communities of our land contributed in a positive way, and how they came to specialize in those areas.
A few examples:
African Americans - professional sports, popular music, entertainment, religion, etc.
Irish Americans - politics, law, literature, journalism, film and television, etc.
Gays & Lesbians - fine arts, theater, literature, classical music, etc.
Jews - business and finance, medicine, higher education, film production, etc.
These few examples represent a racial minority, an ethnic minority, a sexual minority, and a religious minority.
I would like to learn more about other groups, say German-Americans (engineering?), Italian-Americans (Culinary Arts, Opera, Architecture?), etc.
Also, why do you supposed these groups gravitated to these particular fields?
Are my assumptions way off base? Are these really just stereotypes?
I'm here to learn!
Some years ago a player for the Green Bay Packers, Reggie White, stood in front of the Wisconsin general assembly and gave a speech. He proclaimed that blacks were "gifted in worship and celebration". He announced that whites were "good at structure and organization" and knew how to "tap into money". Hispanics excelled at family, Reggie said. "They can put 20 or 30 in one home". Asians are good with "creativity and inventions". "They can turn a television into a watch", according to Reggie. And finally, "Indians are good at spirituality". "Put them all together and it forms the image of God," White stated.
He initially got cheers from the listening audience, but after a few seconds of thought, most folks realized that Reggie was a racist, a good-natured, religious racist, but a racist nevertheless.
Anyway, to tell you the truth, there may be something to these stereotypes. I mean, these notions came from somewhere. But I'll tell you, I haven't a clue how you can seriously approach the questions you ask without bigoted, racist, or stereotyping comments, even if the replies are polite and discreet in tone.
thriftylefty - you may or many not be correct - it is hard to say for sure without a lot of study.
An anecdotal observation that suggests otherwise:
Have you watched the show "Project Runway?" My wife and daughter watch it so I do also sometimes. The reality show is a competition between fashion designers who design and produce clothing as per a unique challenge each week. One contestent loses each week and is kicked out. Eventually there is one winner. I think it is roughly split between male and female contestants. With only one clear exception, every male contestant I have seen over three seasons is gay. This cannot be a result of a social environment, at least not at a young age.
Black children almost always grow up in a black parent led household. So a cultural pattern unique to Black people makes some sense. Gays do not grow up with gay siblings or gay parents nor do I think think they grow up in familes of fashion designers (at least none of the gay people I have known). So why does it seem that male fashion designers are overwhelmingly gay?
one distinct advantage gay men have over straight men in the women's fashion industry is that women in various stages of undress are comfortable working around them. It may be that women or perhaps the industry seeks out these men rather than the men seeking a particular type of work
I believe that gay men as a group have gravitated towards the fine arts - and I would argue that the stereotypical professions of fashion, interior design, and even floral design are extensions of the fine arts - because traditionally those were areas where gay men would not ridiculed or harassed.
Several weeks ago I was visiting the house and museum of the highly acclaimed American artist Charles Demuth in Lancaster, PA. You may not have heard of Demuth but he really was a major artist, painter, and water colorist of the late 19th century and early 20th century: his works are in the major museums of the world. Demuth was gay (in fact when he lived in New York he was happiest when he and his friends were hanging out at various gay bath-houses). When in Paris, Demuth was recognized by fellow painters Picasso, Matisse, and others, became friends with Gertrude Stein and her salon; in the US Demuth was admired by and became friends with people like playwright Eugene O'Neill and poet William Carlos Williams. He was known to be gay, but these fellow artists and intellectuals accepted him and befriended him ... and this was nearly a century ago, long before it was fashionable to have gay friends.
I've read that Asians often tended to go into fields that required mathematics, because it was an area where they could excel without being completely fluent linguistically.
Jews tend to emphasize education, so maybe that's why they end up in fields requiring greater education (like medicine). Historically, they were banned from owning businesses century ago, which is what supposedly propelled them into finance.
The simple answer is that people (grouped by race, ethnicity, gender, religious beliefs, sexual orientation, etc) tend to follow along well-worn paths by those who are like them, who have come before them and who were successful.
That is a very interesting question. I think a lot of it has to do with the ethnic culture. Take for example the Italians. Although they excel in many areas they are especially involved in construction trades and really dominate some of those trades. Where I live I would guess that over 90% of people doing concrete work are Italians. This is also the case in paving, stone work, stucco work and other building trades. The culture has a tradition of doing those kinds of things well.
Here is an example that I find amusing. Just about 100% of the high quality hand made carpets in the world are made in the various Muslim countries of the middle east and central Asia. Even though that is the case almost 100% of the people who buy and sell and trade these carpets are Armenian Christians. Go into almost any high class carpet store and see who owns that store. I can almost bet you their last name ends with ANIAN because that is an Armenian name ending and they are the carpet sellers. I asked a friend of mine who is one of them about it and he told me that's just the way it's been for a thousand years or more.
I'm 100% Scottish decent and the Scots are way over represented in Banking, Insurance and strangely unions. I really don't know why that is but it is.
I've read that Asians often tended to go into fields that required mathematics, because it was an area where they could excel without being completely fluent linguistically.
Jews tend to emphasize education, so maybe that's why they end up in fields requiring greater education (like medicine). Historically, they were banned from owning businesses century ago, which is what supposedly propelled them into finance.
Also, in his book Outliers, Malcolm Gladwell makes the case that Asians, particularly Chinese people, excel at math because of their language. In English, we count from one to ten, then we have these other words like 11, 12, 13, etc., then 20, 30, 40 and so on. In most Chinese dialects, you have one to ten, then "two tens" for 20, "three tens" for 30, and so forth, and so 23 is two tens three. If you are adding 23 and 44, for example, it takes longer using our LANGUAGE to add up twenty-three and forty-four to get sixty-seven than it does to add up two tens three and four tens four to get six tens seven. It's only a few seconds faster, but over time using math words in their language works out so that Asian children are advancing through the earliest stages of learning arithmetic much faster than western children.
This is just a generalization, I suppose, but I was always intrigued by the fact that certain specific communities - minority groups, you might say, seem to excel or even dominate in specific fields, occupations, and/or industries.
First of all, let's get one thing clear: this is meant to be a respectful and non-prejudiced inquiry. PLEASE NO BIGOTED, POLITICAL, RACIST or STEREOTYPING RANTS.
Let's honestly discuss how the myriad communities of our land contributed in a positive way, and how they came to specialize in those areas.
A few examples:
African Americans - professional sports, popular music, entertainment, religion, etc.
Irish Americans - politics, law, literature, journalism, film and television, etc.
Gays & Lesbians - fine arts, theater, literature, classical music, etc.
Jews - business and finance, medicine, higher education, film production, etc.
These few examples represent a racial minority, an ethnic minority, a sexual minority, and a religious minority.
I would like to learn more about other groups, say German-Americans (engineering?), Italian-Americans (Culinary Arts, Opera, Architecture?), etc.
Also, why do you supposed these groups gravitated to these particular fields?
Are my assumptions way off base? Are these really just stereotypes?
I'm here to learn!
The reason that say Blacks are better track runners isn't because they are necessarly more physically gifted, it leads towards where they came/come from. For example which state produces better baseball players California or Pennsylvania? If you guessed California your right. Why? Because children in California have 12 months a year to practice as opposed to Pennsylvania. The representative difference here is climate.
Concerning the Irish you state politics ,law and literature as being of their finer gifts. Why ? Once again the answer is climate. No one wants to sit outside in the cold wet dampness all the time. Because of this it brought people closer together where things such as debating, writing, music and rule of law could all come together under the guise of kinship and a good pint or two or three, you get the picture.
With the Italians you state architecture,. Why? Money due to expantion of land and tax revenue. If the people don't see their money at work than they wouldn' have lasted as long as they did. So why not build a metropolis that represents the attitude and ideas of the people.
So in the end sterotyping and words like racist/racism are just words used by angry people to make their point. In the end we are all racist ,prejudice and bias to our own ,due to the exclusivity that we know and understand.
And you know what.....there isn't anything wrong with it. Words with truth in them constitute change towards attitudes and ideas that many cannot/will not or rufuse to except. Words barbed in anger are a polite form of character assasination. At times we are all guilty as charged.
When I was a little kid, we had certain stereotypes about occupations that attract one group or another. I do not know if there was any truth to these assumptions but some of them are:
policemen - Irish (the vehicle where arrested persons were put in was called a "Paddy Wagon")
barbers - Italians
independent grocers - Italians
train porters - African American men (usually older)
maids/house keepers - Hispanic women
jewelers - Jews
clothing stores - Jews
laundry services - Chinese
Nowadays, in my area at least these are some of the newer stereotypes:
7/11 or Convenience Store clerks - Indians (South Asians)
Diner and family restaurant owners - Greeks
Dry Cleaners - Koreans
landscaping crews - Mexicans
nail salons - Chinese
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