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Even though Fountain of youth didn't quote the post before his, I think it was obvious that he was speaking in terms of statewide metropolitan distribution with both GA and IL having one big major metro and a scattering of significantly smaller metros. Of course the two states aren't clones of each other in this respect but the general dynamic is the same with the major metro driving the statewide metrics to an inordinately large degree in both states. IL is most likely the state most like GA when it comes to that with not *too* dissimilar population figures for the urban centers in each state.
At the very least, I think we can all probably agree that GA is unique among Southern states when it comes to this.
Chicago is 9.5 mil.... IL is 12.7 mil
Atlanta is 5.8 mil... GA is 10.5 mil
This means Chicago make a much larger share of IL than Atlanta does with GA, at the same time Georgia has more people outside of it's largest metro.
AL is 4,863,300
LA is 4,684,333
GA outside of Metro Atlanta 4.7 million, this means outside of Atlanta, Georgia has a comparable population to AL and LA while being like 2/3 their area size. And AL and LA have major cities, GA outside Atlanta have a large enough pop that a second city the size of Birmingham and New Orleans could had formed, it just instead the population is spread around to more midsize then those states have. This is not the same as IL out side of Chicago, IL is like 3 likely 2 million something. Yes there one major city in both states but Chicago and IL is far more whoop sided,
Chicago is far bigger than Atlanta while outside Chicago IL is far more rural than Georgia, it's similar pop as Mississippi. While Atlanta is small than Chicago but outside of ATL, in GA there nearly a SC amount of people.
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Yes NC have more separate major metros but those separate major metros are all adjusted to each other on the piedmont. This not like Cali, Texas, Florida Ohio with most there majors spread apart,
The distribution of population both states are actually similar, So if you had look at it you have say most GA population 6 million is one Piedmont, Most of NC population 6 million..... is on the Piedmont. The only real difference is GA have one larger central major metro, Atlanta CSA spreading from Hall county to Athens to Rome to lagrange. Denser toward Atlanta core, but NC has 3 separated metros 3 smaller centers but group together in same region of the state.
Both states have similar population 10 million, similar annual state growth, and growing most of their Piedmont. The only difference NC mid tier size cities are growing a little more. but GA situation is way more closer to NC than IL. NC may have technically more cities but it has a dominate urban region of 6 million and rest of the state being 4 million this mirrors GA.
This means Chicago make a much larger share of IL than Atlanta does with GA, at the same time Georgia has more people outside of it's largest metro.
AL is 4,863,300
LA is 4,684,333
GA outside of Metro Atlanta 4.7 million, this means outside of Atlanta, Georgia has a comparable population to AL and LA while being like 2/3 their area size. And AL and LA have major cities, GA outside Atlanta have a large enough pop that a second city the size of Birmingham and New Orleans could had formed, it just instead the population is spread around to more midsize then those states have. This is not the same as IL out side of Chicago, IL is like 3 likely 2 million something. Yes there one major city in both states but Chicago and IL is far more whoop sided,
Chicago is far bigger than Atlanta while outside Chicago IL is far more rural than Georgia, it's similar pop as Mississippi. While Atlanta is small than Chicago but outside of ATL, in GA there nearly a SC amount of people.
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Yes NC have more separate major metros but those separate major metros are all adjusted to each other on the piedmont. This not like Cali, Texas, Florida Ohio with most there majors spread apart,
The distribution of population both states are actually similar, So if you had look at it you have say most GA population 6 million is one Piedmont, Most of NC population 6 million..... is on the Piedmont. The only real difference is GA have one larger central major metro, Atlanta CSA spreading from Hall county to Athens to Rome to lagrange. Denser toward Atlanta core, but NC has 3 separated metros 3 smaller centers but group together in same region of the state.
Both states have similar population 10 million, similar annual state growth, and growing most of their Piedmont. The only difference NC mid tier size cities are growing a little more. but GA situation is way more closer to NC than IL. NC may have technically more cities but it has a dominate urban region of 6 million and rest of the state being 4 million this mirrors GA.
This means Chicago make a much larger share of IL than Atlanta does with GA, at the same time Georgia has more people outside of it's largest metro.
AL is 4,863,300
LA is 4,684,333
GA outside of Metro Atlanta 4.7 million, this means outside of Atlanta, Georgia has a comparable population to AL and LA while being like 2/3 their area size. And AL and LA have major cities, GA outside Atlanta have a large enough pop that a second city the size of Birmingham and New Orleans could had formed, it just instead the population is spread around to more midsize then those states have. This is not the same as IL out side of Chicago, IL is like 3 likely 2 million something. Yes there one major city in both states but Chicago and IL is far more whoop sided,
Chicago is far bigger than Atlanta while outside Chicago IL is far more rural than Georgia, it's similar pop as Mississippi. While Atlanta is small than Chicago but outside of ATL, in GA there nearly a SC amount of people.
As I stated in my post that you quoted: "Of course the two states aren't clones of each other in this respect but the general dynamic is the same with the major metro driving the statewide metrics to an inordinately large degree in both states."
Quote:
Yes NC have more separate major metros but those separate major metros are all adjusted to each other on the piedmont. This not like Cali, Texas, Florida Ohio with most there majors spread apart,
The distribution of population both states are actually similar, So if you had look at it you have say most GA population 6 million is one Piedmont, Most of NC population 6 million..... is on the Piedmont. The only real difference is GA have one larger central major metro, Atlanta CSA spreading from Hall county to Athens to Rome to lagrange. Denser toward Atlanta core, but NC has 3 separated metros 3 smaller centers but group together in same region of the state.
Both states have similar population 10 million, similar annual state growth, and growing most of their Piedmont. The only difference NC mid tier size cities are growing a little more. but GA situation is way more closer to NC than IL. NC may have technically more cities but it has a dominate urban region of 6 million and rest of the state being 4 million this mirrors GA.
The whole "Piedmont Crescent" term is a more modern marketing term and is not or has ever been representative of a cohesive large region within the state that people identify with; in short, there is no one "dominate urban region of 6 million" within NC. When you speak of regions within NC, you're talking about western NC and eastern NC from a historic, political, cultural, and economic perspective. Raleigh (which is actually located on the fall line where the coastal plain begins transitioning to the Piedmont) has long served as the hub of eastern NC, the more agricultural region of the state where most of its rural Black population is concentrated, and is where folks from the smaller towns to the east gravitated to for work, leisure, entertainment, etc. The secondary cities of the region would include Fayetteville (which is actually in Raleigh's DMA), Wilmington, Rocky Mount, and Greenville. Because eastern NC was the traditional agricultural region of the state, this is where the political power in the state has historically been concentrated and why NC's first official (New Bern) and current capital, as well as the towns the state legislature met in to conduct business when there was no permanent capital in place, were in eastern NC. It wasn't a coincidence that the 1950s economic brainchild of the state's political, academic, and business leaders--RTP--was located just east of Raleigh.
Charlotte, on the other hand, is considered western NC and the closest "big city" for that part of the state (secondary areas being Asheville and Hickory/Morganton/Lenoir) and you don't have to go very far to the west of the city to notice subtle Appalachian influences with more rolling terrain, poor rural White communities, etc. This is why things like the textile industry and NASCAR had huge footholds in Charlotte and, by contrast, were quite minimal in Raleigh/Durham which depended more on the tobacco industry. Charlotte was historically viewed as somewhat 'other' in NC and sometimes you'll hear eastern NC'ers refer to it in jest as SC's largest city and political leaders would call it "the great state of Mecklenburg." There is definitely truth to that though as for its first 100 years, Charlotte was more connected to SC via railroads, trade, etc than NC. Even today, industries in Charlotte are more likely to utilize the port of Charleston than Wilmington's port, which has no direct interstate access to Charlotte. In many ways, Charlotte is more Carolinian than North Carolinian.
The Triad (Greensboro/Winston-Salem/High Point) essentially serves as the point of convergence in the state with influences and elements from both the east, with Greensboro leaning slightly more in that direction, and the west, with Winston-Salem leaning slightly more in that direction, as well as having its own unique cultural identifiers such as the Quaker and Moravian presence. It has representation of both the traditional (textiles, tobacco, furniture) and modern (banking, higher education, healthcare/medical research) economic sectors that have come to define NC over the years. It is really THE Piedmont region of NC, lying entirely within that region and completely within the state's borders without nearly as much influence into western or eastern NC as Charlotte and Raleigh, respectively. Its growth over the past few decades has been more average, allowing rapidly-growing Charlotte and Raleigh to pull more growth and development more towards the west and the east, respectively.
So no, the metropolitan dynamic in GA and NC aren't very similar at all. The so-called Piedmont Crescent isn't a singular region with a singular identity sourced in one city; it is a collection of five dynamic cities with their own unique histories, identities, economies, and spheres of influences with the southernmost city (Charlotte) having a slightly more mountain vibe with sway over the western part of the state and the northernmost city (Raleigh) having a slightly more coastal vibe with sway over the eastern part of the state. Apart from the far remote corners, what this means is that no part of the state is too far removed from either Charlotte or Raleigh and this set-up has influenced the trajectories of NC and GA in profoundly different ways; it has resulted in NC being a much more balanced 'bipolar' state than GA. To get that same effect in GA, you'd basically have to pull metro Atlanta down to about where Macon is and add some sort of equivalent of the northern suburbs down on the south side. And if none of this convinces you, think about it like this: by claiming that the Piedmont Crescent is the NC equivalent of metro Atlanta, you're basically saying that Eastern-style (associated with Raleigh) and Western/Lexington-style barbecue are both from the same "region" in NC. And if you know anything about NC and how seriously it takes its barbecue, you'd know that's outright blasphemy.
Any serious comparison of states has to include quantity of county courthouses.
Looks to me like Georgia is nearly 60% better than North Carolina and Illinois... Don't even get started on South Carolina....
You lost me here.
I don’t think the amount of county courthouses has anything to do with whether a state is better than another... if anything, it’s more bureaucracy.
I don’t think the amount of county courthouses has anything to do with whether a state is better than another... if anything, it’s more bureaucracy.
Haha. Visited friends that recently left this corner of Texas for Morton, IL (just outside of Peoria) on way to move daughter up to DePaul. I was impressed with that corner of IL I must say. Good salt of the earth people, lovely acreage neighborhood, a 60s era ranch with full finished basement backing up to nice hardwood forest. Could have been a nice part of Atlanta if you didn't know where you were.
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