Comparing 4 Fort Collins schools (Kinnard, Cache, Liberty, Webber) (Bennett: home, best schools)

[sdchap]

Our 9 and 11 year olds will be entering school in Fort Collins this fall, and I'd be grateful for some "local knowledge" about my final four choices:

(1) Kinnard Junior High,
(2) Cache La Poudre Junior High
(3) Liberty Common Charter
(4) Webber Junior High.

I'm looking for a nurturing, supportive environment (as opposed to militaristic or disciplinarian, which my kids simply don't need). I'm not a big fan of tons of homework, because I'd rather my kids have some "down time" to read, do their own projects, etc. Thanks for any help!

(By the way, our 9 year old will likely be attending Werner Elementary. Is there a natural progression from Werner to any of the 4 Junior HS above? I'm a bit confused by how easy it really is to enter from one school to another.)

Again, thank you!

[cobmw]

Not into homework? Then I'd skip Liberty Charter. They are one of the best schools in the state, but like Ridgeview Charter (the school our kids attend) they have high expectations for the kids. And that includes having to do homework. I don't see how a kid can get a good education and not put in lots of effort.

[sdchap]

Originally Posted by cobmw

Not into homework? Then I'd skip Liberty Charter. They are one of the best schools in the state, but like Ridgeview Charter (the school our kids attend) they have high expectations for the kids. And that includes having to do homework. I don't see how a kid can get a good education and not put in lots of effort.

Thanks, cobmw, for your input. I agree that effort is important in education. My belief, though, is that effort has to be appropriately focused. (Significant studies, for example, show that excessive homework is counterproductive. I know it sounds counterintuitive, but again, there’s a lot of data to back it up.)

Because we've lived so long overseas, our perspective may be a bit more international. Kids in Japan, for example, have about an hour of homework a week. In Europe, about 10 minutes per grade level per day seems to be the norm.

Believe me, I LOVE America, and I can't wait to get our kids back into an educational environment there where LEARNING is encouraged, as opposed to rote memorization and test preparation. One of the many things I’m so proud of about America and being American is our amazing creativity and sense of possibility. I’ve found that schools outside the U.S. often engender in their students a fear of failure, or of even making mistakes.

So that, I don't like. On the other hand, there's lots to admire about education outside the U.S. (Keep in mind that on international standardized tests, U.S. students score about average worldwide, in spite of the amount of homework they’re saddled with.) Again, I say this from a perspective of loving the U.S., hoping always for improvement, and of course wanting the very best for my munchkins.

I'm eager for input from other parents about Kinnard, Cache La Poudre or Webber. Thanks!

[Tom Emmerling]

I agree about Liberty. My friend has her kids there and they have a lot of homework. But on the other hand the payoff is that they are getting a excellent education. Also I am not sure you are aware of this but they accept kids through a lottery. It is very hard to get in there. I can not tell you much about the other schools. Most schools in Fort Collins offer a good education and I have not heard anything bad about the ones you mention.

[cobmw]

If you are really interested in a good education for your kids make a visit to Ridgeview Charter. They have been one of the top three schools (academically) in the state for the past six years and they have been number one for the last two years. Ridgeview offers a classical education with art, music (never thought my boy would play the violin) and a demanding curriculum. Homework is 10 minutes per night per grade level. So our 5th grader does about 45 minutes per night (most of which he does in study hall at school). Our 11th grader works hard with 1 1/2 hours per night. But that's pretty much in line with good public schools. We have heard that college is easy after the good preparation that Ridgeview students receive.

They have orientations several times each year to explain their program to parents. We chose the school not just because of the demanding academics but becasue of the healthy environment. It is a school where the teachers know all the kids and the kids are a cut above those in the typical public. More serious about learning and much better behaved (good, polite behavior is stressed at the school). Obviously I can't speak highly enough about the school.

Good luck with your search.

[lart]

My daughter went to Liberty and never recovered. It's a school that does not require their teachers to have a degree in education. It's all lecture based. They believe that all worthwhile knowledge is found in the teachings of the white European males. I find CSAPteaching scores indicate the ability of a child to become a parrot and not necessarily a thinker. And if a child thinks outside the box there....heaven help them.

[cobmw]

lart

This is such a litany of misinformaion that I don't know where to start. First Liberty Common Charter School is a great school. My kids don't go there, but I've talked to parents who do send their kids there. Your daughter's experience is a aberration. Other parents of Liberty kids speak highly of the school.

You say a degree in education is important. I would not place that at the top of the list for teacher qualifications. Better the teacher actually know the subject and how to teach and be interested in the kids rather than get their job by slugging it out to get a teaching degree as their proof that they can teach.

As for the white European males comment I'll let your comment speak for jtself.

And finally your comment about test scores not being indicative of the ability to think - this sounds like the sort of new age education speak that had been used in places like California where the school system is a disaster. In CA the kids don't know the answer to 12 squared, but they can tell you how they feel about it. I know of no bettter education than one where high expectations are placed on the kids and the curriculum follows a classical, core knowledge approach.

By the way, of all the disciplines studied in college (business, engineering, social sciences, music, languages, etc) can you guess the discipline where the students have the worst college grades and test scores? It is those students studying towards their teaching degree.

[woza]

As a family (like mine) that has international experience, yours may find Fort Collins a bit conservative. Keep asking questions so that you can make the best decision for your kids. Core Knowledge is promoted by conservatives and neo-conservatives, if that works for you. Over the last seven months, I have come to understand that a lot of the hostility about schools in Fort Collins stems from fear about embracing diversity (racial, economic, cultural etc.) The elementary kids of many international students at CSU attend Moore or Bennett schools. You may want to talk to educators there about middle school options and recommendations for your kids who have lived cross culturally.

Good luck, and trust your gut feelings!

[cobmw]

"neo-conservative" - - HOGWASH

A classical education following a core knowledge curriculum is the best way for kids to learn. My kids are in a core knowledge school and I am impressed by the time they spend reading the great books. My fourth grader read an abridged version of Shakespear. Now in the fifth grade he is reading the unabridged version! To my amazement he has developed enough interest in it to read Shakespear at home occasionally (when I can get him off the video games). And this is not a scholarly kid. He does not rank high in his class. It's just that when kids have high expectations placed on them they will do amazing things.

I don't see why any parent would not want their kids to get a solid educational foundation. To do so the time needs to be spent on the basic core subjects. Our school recognizes things like earth day and black history month. But they don't spend an inordinate amount of time on these things. If the parents feel that multiculturalism and other PC values are a vital part of eduction then they should teach those things at home and leave school time for developing essential skills.