Why I think Ford Fusion S/Escape S are more-reliable than Toyota Camry/RAV4 & Honda Accord/CR-V...
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Ford has no control over prices. Every Ford dealers nationwide charge different prices with different dealer discounts. Ford corporate only supplies the cashback rebates. Then Ford dealers will decide how much to discount their new vehicles with rebates applied. Some are aggressive, some are not. The lease prices shown are all based on MSRP plus available cashback rebates applied.
But, in my experience, Ford dealers have always been more generous on discounts and deals than Hyundai and Kia.
Lowest price nationwide shows $14,683, which means lease rate is about $169 per month, calculating. Region varies, of course. Not everyone will get this price, of course.
I just looked at what you posted and came across a 19 Escape S for 15,100.00
how is that possible?? a gimmick?? here in Fla there no less than 17,000
and another topic for another post I may make what about these rip off $1,000 dealer fees???
Hi, the deals I mentioned are for Ford Fusion S sedan only, which is as low as $14,500 in some USA regions. Ford Escape S is going to be a little more-expensive (despite similar MSRP), because it's a more-popular compact SUV configuration, so higher demand + tighter inventory = higher price. Escape also gets fewer cashback rebates than Fusion, historically. Fortunately, it's only about $1,000 price difference. Comparing a new Toyota Camry and Toyota RAV4 price difference would be a nightmare to start with.
I just looked at what you posted and came across a 19 Escape S for 15,100.00
how is that possible?? a gimmick??
According to terms & conditions, "Internet price includes all factory rebates, bonus cash, loyalty cash, college/military rebate, and finance incentives that are offered. Rebates & incentives may be in lieu of special financing. Not all customers will qualify for all incentives."
If you don't qualify for some rebates, it's about $16,500. Be thankful with this 2019 price, because the all-new (and less-reliable) 2020 Escape will be at least $22,000 lowest price at launch, and then gradually drops to $19,999. Buy now before price goes up, as your grandparents would say. Supplies are very limited on 2019 Escape S when we approach year-end clearance, as Ford is not interested in ramping up production number for buyers looking for reliability only.
There are die-hard traditionalists who've been saying that every automobile innovation is a mistake, for as long as I have lived (60 years and counting). Always I hear sniping from the peanut gallery that the new way is "only done to save money" or "adds useless complexity" or "won't last"... and what has been the net result of all these so-called mistakes? Cars routinely last 200,000 miles now whereas it used to be 100,000 miles, they require far less maintenance, they are faster, get better gas mileage, handle and ride better, and are quieter and much safer...
I've highlighted the items in your last sentence that hold up to scrutiny and are generally accurate. The "peanut gallery" is made up of the gullible who accept the rest of it, the dogma, on faith because they fear being shamed if they don't.
You're young enough to have missed, as an adult, the peak years of the American automotive industry's greatest era. By the time you came of age, things were going down the drain fast. Thus, like most others, you don't understand what we've lost.
New cars use less fuel and don't need regular tune-ups. That's where the pluses end abruptly. Most other "innovations" have been made to cut costs or weight....not to improve the driving experience.
While not a common problem at all and Consumer Reports still rate the 2.5L engine "excellent" in reliability, the only major issue I can find with a video is a knocking/tapping noise from #2 and #3 cylinder heads.
I've highlighted the items in your last sentence that hold up to scrutiny and are generally accurate. The "peanut gallery" is made up of the gullible who accept the rest of it, the dogma, on faith because they fear being shamed if they don't.
You're young enough to have missed, as an adult, the peak years of the American automotive industry's greatest era. By the time you came of age, things were going down the drain fast. Thus, like most others, you don't understand what we've lost.
New cars use less fuel and don't need regular tune-ups. That's where the pluses end abruptly. Most other "innovations" have been made to cut costs or weight....not to improve the driving experience.
Quieter? Ride Better? Don't make me laugh.
You believe that old cars are superior, so that's why you drive an old car. Good for you.
You believe that old cars are superior, so that's why you drive an old car. Good for you.
I do like older cars in big heartbeat, but it seems to be always incredibly difficult to find one used with low mileage and in perfect condition. I have no luck so far finding a less than 50,000 miles used 2005 Lexus GS300 for over a year now.
Motorreviewer.com doesn't have positive words to say about Toyota 4-cylinder engines regarding reliability and durability, compare to Ford/Mazda 2.5L, very, very shockingly, but I'm not surprised at all:
From Toyota A25A page: "The engine has even more complex design compared to the 2AR engine series. There are a lot of electronics, sensors, and small parts as a potential failure. Hope, that Toyota still uses good quality components and precise assembly. We also can see what the laser-clad seats in the head are unremarkable, and the cast-in cylinder sleeves don’t have enough juice for a rebuild. That all has a bad influence on the reliability and limit the engine life. It is hard to believe what the most engines will go over 150,000-200,000 miles line."
From Mazda MZR/5L-VE page, "The L5-VE engine doesn’t have typical problems at all. The only thing is that the 2.5l engine is a little bit noisy, and at low rpm, there is not enough torque to move a big SUV or a midsize sedan (Mazda6 for example). For a fast acceleration, you have to push the gas which negatively affected the city gas mileage. Mazda’s 2.5-liter engines of the L-series are very reliable, durable, and trouble-free engines. With proper maintenance, you can easily get 300,000 miles on it."
Please....Ford has immense influence on prices without setting them at a retail level. And they have complete control of the quality of their website and the impression it conveys. Theirs leaves much to be desired.
CrownVic95, I regret to report that your 2017 Hyundai Sonata engine was criticized sharply for its reliability.
"The reliability is not the strongest side of this engine. The manufacturer made recall companies for vehicles with 2.0l Theta II engines several times. Most of them were related to mechanical problems with serious/critical wear of moving parts: crankshaft, pistons and pistons rings (scratches on cylinder walls). Some failures lead to problems with oil flow caused the engines to seize. Theta engines produce a lot of noise at starts and cold engine temperature. A noisy operation is quite common for the 2.0L Theta engine. The sound reminds an old diesel engine. Chirring noise makes owners nervous, but that is just the work of the fuel nozzles (injectors). Some vibrations at 1000-1200 rpm are normal. The manufacturer did not lay in the engine greater durability. But the main point of that is a dirty cheap price. The average engine life is about 150,000 miles (250,000 km)."
(Redirected from 2.4L Theta page: "Engine problems are the same as two-liter engine has. There are different sounds, noises, knocks. You can read more information in the Theta 2.0L engine review.")
"The reliability is not the strongest side of this engine. The manufacturer made recall companies for vehicles with 2.0l Theta II engines several times. Most of them were related to mechanical problems with serious/critical wear of moving parts: crankshaft, pistons and pistons rings (scratches on cylinder walls). Some failures lead to problems with oil flow caused the engines to seize. Theta engines produce a lot of noise at starts and cold engine temperature. A noisy operation is quite common for the 2.0L Theta engine. The sound reminds an old diesel engine. Chirring noise makes owners nervous, but that is just the work of the fuel nozzles (injectors). Some vibrations at 1000-1200 rpm are normal. The manufacturer did not lay in the engine greater durability. But the main point of that is a dirty cheap price. The average engine life is about 150,000 miles (250,000 km)."
(Redirected from 2.4L Theta page: "Engine problems are the same as two-liter engine has. There are different sounds, noises, knocks. You can read more information in the Theta 2.0L engine review.")
I have the 2.4....and I frankly don't know what to believe about it. Though lots of reports of early failures can be found, I haven't run across any reliable source indicating how prevalent they are against the total population of that engine. In the absence of hard data, my hunch is that the percentage is still quite small.
Right now I have less than 14,000 miles on mine in a little over 2 years. If I can get 150,000 miles from it without major repair inconvenience/expense, I'll be happy. What I'm worried about and want to avoid is buying the car next year and then suffering catastrophic failure soon afterward. At the rate I'm driving now, if the car goes 150k without major issues, it could outlast me....or at least my driving years.
I continue to look every day for an ideal that, for practical purposes, doesn't exist any more. If my options remain limited to today's new cars AND my Sonata continues to perform all but flawlessly as it has, I'll probably stay with it. I've ridden in lots of other putt-putt cars and driven a few. Most fall way short of the quality feel that my Sonata has.
From where I sit, with my life experience, my Sonata's biggest weakness is that it isn't a Lincoln Continental Mark V. Once one resigns themselves to living with today's new cars, it leaves little to be desired.
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