Germanic language mutual intelligibility (Portuguese, names, compare, Germany)
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Linda, I'm not 100% certain but I think "des Mannes" should be "vom männer"
No, I remember back in secondary school we had a schedule with all the different German cases. The second case (about belonging) went like this, IIRC:
des [noun + s/es] - der [noun] - des [noun + s/es] - der [noun (plural)]
In the masculine and neuter cases, I think if the noun consists of one syllable, the suffix is +es and if it's more than one syllable it's +s. So for example:
The child of the man = Das Kind des Mannes
The child of the father = Das Kind des Vaters
The child of the woman = Das Kind der Frau
The child of the mother = Das Kind der Mutter
The child of the parents = Das Kind der Eltern
German does not use the literal "of the" construction, at least not in formal language. I don't think "vom Männer" is ever correct because "Männer" is plural (men) while "vom" (von dem) is singular.
However, like I said, my German is a little rusty and this is stuff I was taught many years ago so I might be wrong. Perhaps one of the native German speakers here can clear this up.
No, I remember back in secondary school we had a schedule with all the different German cases. The second case (about belonging) went like this, IIRC:
des [noun + s/es] - der [noun] - des [noun + s/es] - der [noun (plural)]
In the masculine and neuter cases, I think if the noun consists of one syllable, the suffix is +es and if it's more than one syllable it's +s. So for example:
The child of the man = Das Kind des Mannes
The child of the father = Das Kind des Vaters
The child of the woman = Das Kind der Frau
The child of the mother = Das Kind der Mutter
The child of the parents = Das Kind der Eltern
German does not use the literal "of the" construction, at least not in formal language. I don't think "vom Männer" is ever correct because "Männer" is plural (men) while "vom" (von dem) is singular.
However, like I said, my German is a little rusty and this is stuff I was taught many years ago so I might be wrong. Perhaps one of the native German speakers here can clear this up.
Correct, I wouldn't be able to explain this any better
Funny story: I am from Western Blekinge in south-eastern Sweden, and one time a friend of mine actually had to speak English in Stockholm with one couple, in order to be understood.
Stockholm must be a special case. I need to throw in every Swedish word I know in order to be understood out there. If I speak standard Norwegian they looked puzzled. It must be because of their isolation by the Baltic Sea. Stockholm is not a drive-through city for Danes and Norwegians. What is it? 500-600 kilometers to either Norway and Denmark from Stockholm? The typical Scandinavian tourist trail runs from Copenhagen through Malmö, Göteborg and up to Oslo. That coastline of course has four of Scandinavias biggest cities and most populated areas. The people best trained in the three languages are likely to live in that region.
No, I remember back in secondary school we had a schedule with all the different German cases. The second case (about belonging) went like this, IIRC:
des [noun + s/es] - der [noun] - des [noun + s/es] - der [noun (plural)]
In the masculine and neuter cases, I think if the noun consists of one syllable, the suffix is +es and if it's more than one syllable it's +s. So for example:
The child of the man = Das Kind des Mannes
The child of the father = Das Kind des Vaters
The child of the woman = Das Kind der Frau
The child of the mother = Das Kind der Mutter
The child of the parents = Das Kind der Eltern
German does not use the literal "of the" construction, at least not in formal language. I don't think "vom Männer" is ever correct because "Männer" is plural (men) while "vom" (von dem) is singular.
However, like I said, my German is a little rusty and this is stuff I was taught many years ago so I might be wrong. Perhaps one of the native German speakers here can clear this up.
My German is very likely rustier than yours so I won't argue. I also thought you were saying from for some reason LOL. But I think you are correct here. I like studying German but the grammar is a nightmare. I actually tried Dutch first but in the US, it's less useful than German so there isn't a whole lot of study material or opportunities to use it. Dutch grammar is easier though IMO.
Stockholm must be a special case. I need to throw in every Swedish word I know in order to be understood out there. If I speak standard Norwegian they looked puzzled. It must be because of their isolation by the Baltic Sea. Stockholm is not a drive-through city for Danes and Norwegians. What is it? 500-600 kilometers to either Norway and Denmark from Stockholm? The typical Scandinavian tourist trail runs from Copenhagen through Malmö, Göteborg and up to Oslo. That coastline of course has four of Scandinavias biggest cities and most populated areas. The people best trained in the three languages are likely to live in that region.
Stockholmers are sure one of a kind, and around 2 million people lives around that area. Even their choices of neighbor-country vacations is differnt from ours, while people in southern and western Sweden goes to Denmark and Norway for vacation, Stockholmers goes to Finland which is their nearest neighbor (through ferry). And Finnish is certainly not a language that you can be trained in easily. Finns however are quite good in Swedish since they learn it in school, then there is also Finlandssvenskar (Finland Swedes) who speaks Swedish as their native language. Stockholm is often looked down on as "too snobbish" in both southern, western and northern Sweden and Stockholmers are a common subject of jokes. I feel much closer to Copenhagen, both culturally and geographically. There is nothing wrong with Stockholm, but Copenhagen feels more like home for me and many other southern Swedes.
Northerners (Norrlänningar) in particular those in the north-west, are likely to understand Norwegian pretty well since they live close to Narvik, Lofoten, Bodø and Trønderlag. For example the dialects in Härjedalen and Jämtland (in the southern parts of Norrland) is very similar to the dialects in neighboring Trønderlag, they can understand each others very well, here's an article, written in Nynorsk:
And in some parts of northern Sweden, mainly on the north-eastern side, Finnish is actually more common than Swedish. For example Haparanda is an almost entirely Finnish speaking city, just like their neighbor Torneå which is on the Finnish side of Torneälven (the Torne River). And Pajala and Övertorneå is also Finnish-speaking, they speak "Meänkieli" (Tornedalsfinska) which according to the Swedish government officially is a language of its own, but is really just Finnish with some Swedish words in it. Of course they can also speak Swedish, with a slight Finnish accent.
The knowledge that many Swedes has of these sparsely populated northern parts of the country is very limited, they know that it lives Sami people there, it's cold, you can ski there and that they have a hotel made of ice, not much else than that.
Last edited by Helsingborgaren; 11-17-2013 at 03:37 PM..
Does anyone know if Frisian is mutual intelligible with Dutch? And how about Limburgish? None of them are national languages, but still officially considered as languages, would be intresting to know if they are more seen as dialects or languages within the Netherlands, Frisian is also spoken in parts of northern Germany.
Last edited by Helsingborgaren; 11-17-2013 at 06:36 PM..
Interesting how the Frisian one also pronounce Germany as "Tyskland", I thought that was only in North Germanic languages.
As for the Danish speaking minority (around 50,000) in Schleswig-Holstein, there is also a German speaking minority (around 20,000) in Denmark right across the border.
The peninsula of Jutland (part of Denmark and Germany) is a very interesting part of Europe that meant alot for the creation of modern England, both the Angles and Jutes came from Jutland. If it was not for Jutland, there wouldn't be any England...
Last edited by Helsingborgaren; 11-17-2013 at 07:11 PM..
So Jutland is basically England's fatherland? Interesting.
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Stockholm must be a special case. I need to throw in every Swedish word I know in order to be understood out there. If I speak standard Norwegian they looked puzzled. It must be because of their isolation by the Baltic Sea. Stockholm is not a drive-through city for Danes and Norwegians. What is it? 500-600 kilometers to either Norway and Denmark from Stockholm? The typical Scandinavian tourist trail runs from Copenhagen through Malmö, Göteborg and up to Oslo. That coastline of course has four of Scandinavias biggest cities and most populated areas. The people best trained in the three languages are likely to live in that region.
