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Old 06-12-2011, 08:23 AM
 
Location: Space Coast
1,988 posts, read 5,385,835 times
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It's a societal problem, so everyone has their share of blame. Oh - and let's not forget to check the validity and reliability of the tests being used. Somehow the general public and elected politicians who make these standardized mandates forget to question that.
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Old 06-12-2011, 08:23 AM
 
Location: Middle America
37,409 posts, read 53,584,768 times
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You invest in what's most important to you.
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Old 06-12-2011, 08:50 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,779,853 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by zthatzmanz28 View Post
THANK YOU!

It is also why upper income areas spend more per pupil than lower incme schools. MONEY may not be the GREATEST influence, but it sure makes for more resources to benefit the student.
Not in every state. Some try to be more equitable in distributing funds to eliminate the "rich district/poor district" situation.

***********************************************

It seems to be an occupational hazard of teachers to want to blame parents for everything. I feel like I was duped all the years my kids were in school by teachers who acted nice to me. They probably hated me.
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Old 06-12-2011, 10:33 AM
 
2,612 posts, read 5,586,790 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennifer5221 View Post
As a teacher (and parent) it is getting hard to understand why low test scores are blamed on the teachers...where are the parents!
Blaming the parents is almost as useful as blaming teachers and schools. Maybe we should be looking elsewhere to place blame - like on a system that allows economic and social inequity to divide children so thoroughly that those on the wrong side of the divide can not achieve success in school no matter how much time, money and effort we throw at the problem.

The poorest students, many of whom are not native speakers of English, begin school with almost no preparation. Some have never seen a book or even a letter (in any language). Their parents are frequently illiterate or just barely literate. Their parents are both working full time, so their is neither time nor money to provide them with the kind of attention and experience that middle class kids have. When I was a teacher, many of my students had never seen: the ocean, a waterfall, a bird's nest. They could not identify things like a volcano or a palm tree. If you asked them where lions and tigers live, they'd tell you "the zoo." They spent most of their free time watching tv or playing video games. Hard to blame dad when he works as a laborer 7 days a week in all types of weather and mom cleans houses every day. And that's if there is both a mom and dad. I remember one single mother who lived in an unfinished basement and worked day and night cleaning houses.

You really can't blame these people because they don't KNOW what they are supposed to do to prepare their children for school, much less have the means to do it. It would never occur to some of them to purchase a book. They never owned one and the entire concept is foreign. The concept of participating in their child's academic life is also foreign. Some come from countries where parents are not allowed inside the school or to have any contact with teachers or administrators. And they wouldn't know where to begin any more than you or I would know how to teach our child to work a farm in Cameroon. These are people who are trying hard just to *feed* their children and keep a roof over their heads.

If we are going to blame anyone, we need to look elsewhere, beyond the school and beyond the parents. But of course, that would be too hard to fix - just easier to blame parents and teachers. Keeps the focus off the real issues.
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Old 06-12-2011, 02:30 PM
 
Location: Eastern Kentucky
1,236 posts, read 3,117,244 times
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Where are the parents? Working to provide a living for their children. When they get home, they are trying to get a meal on the table, the house cleaned, the laundry done, the yard mowed, the bills paid,time for their children, and the million and one things it takes to keep a family going.
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Old 06-12-2011, 03:22 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,546,439 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by masonsdaughter View Post
Where are the parents? Working to provide a living for their children. When they get home, they are trying to get a meal on the table, the house cleaned, the laundry done, the yard mowed, the bills paid,time for their children, and the million and one things it takes to keep a family going.
...as parents have always done...

It's not an issue of being busy, IMO. It's an issue of attitude. People today are entitled and they are raising children who are entitled. When I was a kid, if I didn't get what was being taught, I was expected to study. Today they expect the teacher to, somehow, cater to each and every child because they're all special snowflakes. Back in the day *I* was responsible for learning. Today, we put the onus on the teacher to make a child learn. MY job was being a student. Now, education is everyone's job except the student.

Someone posted a really good cartoon a few weeks back. It had a 1960's and a 2010 frame. In the 1960 frame, the parents are yelling at the child saying "WHAT DO YOU MEAN YOU FAILED". In the 2010 frame, parents and child are yelling at the teacher "WHAT DO YOU MEAN HE FAILED". IMO, that cartoon sums up what is wrong with education.

The only good thing that will come out of online/computer learning, and we will go that direction because we're convinced teaching with teachers doesn't work (when it's the attitude of the learner that is the problem) will be that we will realize that it is the kids who put in effort who succeed. We will have no choice but to accept that when every child has the same computer program and can go at their own pace and we see the bottom 1/3 of the class failing.
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Old 06-12-2011, 03:32 PM
 
73,020 posts, read 62,622,338 times
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Parents are a major factor. If the parents are not doing their job, there will be problems. I speak from personal experience. I remember some kids who constantly bullied me. One of them destroyed my mailbox. I told my father where the kid lived and my father confronted his father. His father basically yelled at him and pretty much told him to get out of his face. The apple didn't fall very far from the tree. This was the same father whom his older son shot me with a paintball gun. The only thing that happened was his paintball gun got taken away. I partially blame the parents for not doing their job. Their sons behaved horribly. This same kid gave me problems at school.

I knew that my father would never buy a paintball gun for me at age 11. I knew I couldn't be out at dark.
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Old 06-12-2011, 04:39 PM
 
Location: On a Slow-Sinking Granite Rock Up North
3,638 posts, read 6,169,592 times
Reputation: 2677
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eresh View Post
It's a societal problem, so everyone has their share of blame. Oh - and let's not forget to check the validity and reliability of the tests being used. Somehow the general public and elected politicians who make these standardized mandates forget to question that.

Agreed. We also need to follow the money when it comes to what lousy curriculum is foisted upon the schools/parents in the name of the almighty test score (the 'results' of which are often provided by the very companies who put out the product).

Also, it's easier for a higher-income parent to move their children to a better school to avoid peer pressure and/or get exposure to a better curriculum.
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Old 06-12-2011, 04:40 PM
 
4,040 posts, read 7,443,879 times
Reputation: 3899
Quote:
Originally Posted by marie5v View Post
Blaming the parents is almost as useful as blaming teachers and schools. Maybe we should be looking elsewhere to place blame - like on a system that allows economic and social inequity to divide children so thoroughly that those on the wrong side of the divide can not achieve success in school no matter how much time, money and effort we throw at the problem.

The poorest students, many of whom are not native speakers of English, begin school with almost no preparation. Some have never seen a book or even a letter (in any language). Their parents are frequently illiterate or just barely literate. Their parents are both working full time, so their is neither time nor money to provide them with the kind of attention and experience that middle class kids have. When I was a teacher, many of my students had never seen: the ocean, a waterfall, a bird's nest. They could not identify things like a volcano or a palm tree. If you asked them where lions and tigers live, they'd tell you "the zoo." They spent most of their free time watching tv or playing video games. Hard to blame dad when he works as a laborer 7 days a week in all types of weather and mom cleans houses every day. And that's if there is both a mom and dad. I remember one single mother who lived in an unfinished basement and worked day and night cleaning houses.

You really can't blame these people because they don't KNOW what they are supposed to do to prepare their children for school, much less have the means to do it. It would never occur to some of them to purchase a book. They never owned one and the entire concept is foreign. The concept of participating in their child's academic life is also foreign. Some come from countries where parents are not allowed inside the school or to have any contact with teachers or administrators. And they wouldn't know where to begin any more than you or I would know how to teach our child to work a farm in Cameroon. These are people who are trying hard just to *feed* their children and keep a roof over their heads.

If we are going to blame anyone, we need to look elsewhere, beyond the school and beyond the parents. But of course, that would be too hard to fix - just easier to blame parents and teachers. Keeps the focus off the real issues.
This was a good post. I rep-ed.
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Old 06-12-2011, 04:57 PM
 
Location: Eastern Kentucky
1,236 posts, read 3,117,244 times
Reputation: 1308
Well, Ivorytickler, I have to disagree with you there. In the 60's most mothers in my area were stay at home moms. That means that they could do their housework though the day and spend more time with the family in the evenings.
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