Millennials the new poor in the USA, while seniors are the new rich - Is there any hope for those 18-34? (Arizona, Colorado)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
This was my 3rd home purchase... about every 18 months I would move on to my next project... the demand for Engineers was nil... the valley simply was not hiring new grads in the early 80's during the "Recession"
There were actually a lot of homes in Oakland for 150k and less up to about 2012...
Just checked and there are 50 homes at 175k or less in Oakland right now.
Since 91 I've been working with lots of new grad nurses... often the topic comes to Real Estate and buying a home.
Did my best to encourage those thinking about a home to buy from 2009 through 2012 and not a single person did.. they had read that renting is more cost effective... no home repairs to deal with and how owning is fraught with risks...
Which is very true and in some areas it IS cost-effective to rent.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner
Now that Bay Area home prices are surpassing the highs in many areas... many are first time home buyers... the mentality is to get in while they can... too bad they didn't get in when it was a buyers market... even 3 years ago...
If they invest their money in the stock market, they'll get in eventually because in the long haul stock grows faster than real estate. It might take 20-30 years but eventually their portfolio value will exceed the price of the house.
If they invest their money in the stock market, they'll get in eventually because in the long haul stock grows faster than real estate. It might take 20-30 years but eventually their portfolio value will exceed the price of the house.
God bless those that have the stomach for it and make it work... I say this in all sincerity.
My experience has been a disaster...
I bought a few stocks when I was young... several companies are no longer around and all the money was lost...
I know, I know... I did not do it right... I should not have invested in individual stocks... could of or should have done it differently...
Part of it is my distrust of the Wall Street Money Changers... I will always be an outsider and my life savings mean nothing to them...
My Grandmother made the Great Depression very real for an impressionable young kid... she pointed out homes on her street that were lost when the market crashed... she said every generation has to learn there is no such thing as easy money...
One point on Real Estate... it may or many not appreciate... true enough.
However, all the time it is generating income and building equity.
Appreciation is just the icing on the cake if and when it happens...
Besides... I have a peasant mentality... owning the land is everything.
The problem is that it's all BS. I did it, and I know. I started college in 1965. Room and board, tuition, fees and books at an economical state university ran $2500 a year. My summer job paid $1.25/hour. I worked 10 hour days 6 days a week, so my gross pay was $90 per week, or about $83 a week after taxes. By mooching off my parents in the summer and being frugal, I could clear about $750 in the 10 week summer vacation. I had a really good medium skill part time job as a radio station engineer that put another $1000 in my pocket during the school year. I was able to make up the $800 a year shortfall by tapping savings from work during my teen years. By the time I started my Junior year I was tapped, but made up the difference by enlisting in the Army Reserve as part of the ROTC program. That paid a stipend of $50/month not subject to social security withholding. It was a big boost, but came with a commitment to 4 years of active duty and 20 years of reserve status, so the step was not taken lightly. I almost enlisted in the regular army, because the GI Bill paid the same $50/month for every month on active duty, with no other obligation, and I could have saved myself a year on active duty.
Yes all the numbers are bigger today, but qualitatively, my experience was not much different from what is facing today's millennials. It was an 8 year commitment to get my degree, plus 5 years of summer and weekend work as a teenager to pay for it. It was nothing like the picture you paint of sailing through a 4 year degree by working part time. It's why I have trouble believing your are as old as you say you are. You seem to think the '60s were some kind of worker's utopia. It wasn't.
I'm younger than you as I attended college in the 80's...
That said, each generation faces it's own trials and tribulations... just part of life.
What strikes me as odd... is my generation was saying the same things and I was just not buying it... things like they will never be able to afford a home... if only we didn't have 13% mortgage money and could go back to the good old days of 4% money... or gas at 25 cents a gallon with gas wars and trading stamps... heck, my parents still use the Shell Steak Knives they got for filling up!
I don't ever want to go back and think those born today will experience wonders we can't even imagine...
And... I will say it over and over again... much of what is reminisced about was MADE POSSIBLE through military service... and that option still exists.
Last edited by Ultrarunner; 01-26-2015 at 07:51 PM..
God bless those that have the stomach for it and make it work... I say this in all sincerity.
My experience has been a disaster...
I bought a few stocks when I was young... several companies are no longer around and all the money was lost...
I know, I know... I did not do it right... I should not have invested in individual stocks... could of or should have done it differently...
Part of it is my distrust of the Wall Street Money Changers... I will always be an outsider and my life savings mean nothing to them...
My Grandmother made the Great Depression very real for an impressionable young kid... she pointed out homes on her street that were lost when the market crashed... she said every generation has to learn there is no such thing as easy money...
One point on Real Estate... it may or many not appreciate... true enough.
However, all the time it is generating income and building equity.
Appreciation is just the icing on the cake if and when it happens...
Besides... I have a peasant mentality... owning the land is everything.
If you had seen what has happened in my family, you would know that everything can go wrong with real estate just like stocks. It is no safer.
As a result of a water leak, neither of my parents can ever get homeowner's insurance at a reasonable price anymore. This happened over 10 years ago and my mother still has to pay high premiums.
A family situation necessitated a relocation for my father and also makes him not spend much time in the city of his house. He has yet to sell or rent it out. Could he? Probably, but it is so much trouble and hassle. He has some chemicals to dispose of which has been very difficult, and has had long-standing issues with neighborhood codes as well. It is also very expensive to hire people to do maintenance when you are out of town.
Neighborhoods can deteriorate as well. My mom's house may be very difficult to sell as a result of what has happened in the area, which NO one could possibly have seen coming. Due to barking dog problems and the fact that the houses around it have become rentals, most people who would come to look would be turned away.
These type of nightmares never happen with stocks. You never have waste to dispose of, never have neighbors with obnoxious barking dogs*, and never have to nearly abandon it due to relocation. Nor do you have to hire people to take care of your stocks when you are out of town. Nor do you have to pay insurance on your stocks that can skyrocket due to water leaks and consequent floor damage. Nor do you have to pay carrying costs while waiting to sell a stock. Nor do you have to spend thousands of dollars keeping your stock up to code, or bringing it to code.
There are two sides to the story. You presented the first, so I am coming with the second.
*If you rent, you can just move out at the end of your lease, with no need to sell a house just when the place is LEAST desirable.
The thing is with distressed property... there really is no where to go but up... it is already rock bottom and cheap!
Insurance... never made a claim in 30 years... I have $2500 deductibles so I just take care of whatever it is... Grandfather sold insurance way before I was born and his philosophy is, "Insurance is there to make the unbearable bearable"
Today.... I've seen neighbors turn in a broken window for $600 and wonder why their claim history is bad?
That said... insurance is great... if the worst happens I'm protected.
Do most of my own work or use a select small group of trades people I'm come to know...
One guy was a one man roto-rooter company... always available and it only took a call and he would take care of it... I bought his cable machine when he retired... sure, it's work but nothing out of pocket.
Can't speak to the rest of the country... I know few places can compare to the vibrant, diverse and dynamic economy of the SF Bay Area... I was lucky enough to be born in California so I can't take credit for that...
I make it a point to visit each rental at least every other week... makes it much easier to have a set time and my renters will let me know if something needs attention.
Several of my long term tenants are also coworker at the Hospital where I work... all good people...
May I ask where your family Real Estate is located?
PS... I have a retired family friend that is a CPA... he does very well in the stock market and says no one is ever going to call him at midnight for some calamity... he also pulled his money before the bust... said the fundamentals were no longer there and was able to preserve his wealth... this comes from a lifetime of money management experience... he has, however, said he admires how I followed my dream and jumped in with both feet at a young age and built a portfolio one property at a time.
If you saw the post of my first house you see I buy distressed property.
The thing is with distressed property... there really is no where to go but up... it is already rock bottom.
Insurance... never made a claim in 30 years... I have $2500 deductibles so I just take care of whatever it is... Grandfather sold insurance way before I was born and his philosophy is, "Insurance is there to make the unbearable bearable"
Today.... I've seen neighbors turn in a broken window for $600 and wonder why their claim history is bad?
That said... insurance is great... if the worst happens you are protected.
Do most of my own work or use a select small group of trades people I'm come to know...
One guy was a one man roto-rooter company... always available and it only took a call and he would take care of it... I bought his cable machine when he retired... sure, it's work but nothing out of pocket.
Can't speak to the rest of the country... I know few places can compare to the vibrant, diverse and dynamic economy of the SF Bay Area... I was lucky enough to be born in California so I can't take credit for that...
I make it a point to visit each rental at least once every other week... makes it much easier to have a set time and my renters will let me know if something needs attention.
Several of my long term tenants are also coworker at the Hospital were I work... all good people...
May I ask where your family Real Estate is located?
If you saw the post of my first house you see I buy distressed property.
The thing is with distressed property... there really is no where to go but up... it is already rock bottom.
Insurance... never made a claim in 30 years... I have $2500 deductibles so I just take care of whatever it is... Grandfather sold insurance way before I was born and his philosophy is, "Insurance is there to make the unbearable bearable"
Today.... I've seen neighbors turn in a broken window for $600 and wonder why their claim history is bad?
That said... insurance is great... if the worst happens you are protected.
Do most of my own work or use a select small group of trades people I'm come to know...
One guy was a one man roto-rooter company... always available and it only took a call and he would take care of it... I bought his cable machine when he retired... sure, it's work but nothing out of pocket.
Can't speak to the rest of the country... I know few places can compare to the vibrant, diverse and dynamic economy of the SF Bay Area... I was lucky enough to be born in California so I can't take credit for that...
I make it a point to visit each rental at least once every other week... makes it much easier to have a set time and my renters will let me know if something needs attention.
Several of my long term tenants are also coworker at the Hospital were I work... all good people...
May I ask where your family Real Estate is located?
Also, the water leak would not have come within a $2500 deductible. The floor was damaged over nearly 1/4 of the house's total floor area.
Neither of my parents are landlords, but that can be a nightmare as well, especially in cases of prolonged vacancy or nightmare tenants that take 6 months to evict and costs you over $10,000 in lost rent and legal costs of eviction. This does not include lost income from the time spent on the issues either.
It gets worse - even in my area, I know some folks who could not sell or rent a very large, expensive house in a desirable neighborhood and were forced to move back into it, despite its suburban location. It has cost the family over $100,000 in commute costs alone.
I've never visited Arkansas although I know several that retired their with their pensions and really like it...
One bought a nice property with a couple of acres for 120k... this was after they sold their California home for 500k so they had a 380k cushion plus both have pensions and social security...
My co-worker of 25 years just moved to Alabama last week... her husband has family there and they sold their double wide in the Bay Area for 85k and bought a home 10 year old home on two acres for 100k...
The range of Real Estate prices around the country is mind boggling...
It sure sounds like Millennials would have little trouble buying a home if they avoided high cost east and west coastal states.
I've never visit Arkansas although I know several that retired their with their pensions and really like it...
One bought a nice property with a couple of acres for 120k... this was after they sold their California home for 500k so they had a 380k cushion plus both have pensions and social security...
My co-worker of 25 years just moved to Alabama last week... her husband has family there and they sold their double wide in the Bay Area for 85k and bought a home 10 year old home on two acres for 100k...
The range of Real Estate prices around the country is mind boggling...
It sure sounds like Millennials would have little trouble buying a home if they avoided high cost east and west coastal states.
Sure, I could buy a house in Detroit, the problem is in being an absentee landlord!
It sure sounds like Millennials would have little trouble buying a home if they avoided high cost east and west coastal states.
They wouldn't. The hard part, though, is finding a good job in the lower-cost-of-living states. The jobs exist, but they aren't as plentiful as in the coastal states.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
