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Mathjak and I AGREE that Wall Street had bad apples, no one denies that, but you and others minimalize the mess many individuals had control over like buying way more home than they could afford and using lines of credit like an ATM to buy those 60" plasmas and new cars when they were living paycheck to paycheck.
It was not just SOME as you say. Many many people did it and are STILL doing it, racking up credit bills rather than making the tough choices to sacrifice. Ask anyone and most will know the main characters on Twilight, but they don't know how many deductions/exemptions are taken out from their w-4.....that's the main problem w/financial america today. Personal responsibility.
As for my friends, family, colleagues it was at most some. Keep in mind a lot of the affected families were not buying 60" inch plasmas, but trying to put their sons and daughters through college. Show some respect. We must hang in different circles. Maybe you know more extravagant people than I do. There were responsible people that got adversely affected and some have recovered. Others are taking a little longer. The debate was scored 42-9. Not very many people agree with you. You probably blamed Enron on everyone else EXCEPT Ken Lay and his top people, too. That would not surprise me.
Yes, I never said there was no personal responsibility. However, we also have a responsibility to the next generation to call attention to the fraud and abuses that occurred and lead to the 2008 financial crisis. You two got way more than you bargained for on this thread and the vote shows it. Just "man up" and admit the loss (42-9). I am thankful for our future generations you are outnumbered.
I could care less what a poll in an anonymous chat board results are....there are only 2 options and its heavily biased, so again, I could care less.
We all know the truth and for those who ignore and continue to spend and spend and not live within their means, its their financial grave they have to worry about....
So, go ahead and continue to whine and whine all you want. It won't make a difference if you don't take care of what you can control.
[quote=CouponJack;28816133]I could care less what a poll in an anonymous chat board results are....there are only 2 options and its heavily biased, so again, I could care less.
We all know the truth and for those who ignore and continue to spend and spend and not live within their means, its their financial grave they have to worry about....
So, go ahead and continue to whine and whine all you want. It won't make a difference if you don't take care of what you can control.[/QUOTE
You would be applauding the vote if it favored your view. Because it does not, you are actually the one WHINING about the "anonymous chat room" and arrogantly dismissing the input of 42 people and deciding that your conclusions are superior to anyone else's. if you were leading, you would call it an "informed cross section of American citizens".
A lot of this crisis actually occurred because those on Wall Street did not listen or heed the warnings as well or even consider listening to them.
Again, you have whined plenty in frustration while the 42 people you dismiss are merely calling it like it is. You just are not happy with the results, so deal with it by calling them whiners instead of admitting that they might have some valid points...not a very adult/mature way to handle it.
People needing to make good decisions about their money has not been disputed by me.
BTW, I acknowledge the opinions of the nine who disagreed with me and 41 others. You are people to be valued and not some anonymous poll takers in the chat room. I am hopeful that seven of you can at least agree we cannot have this sort of thing happen again and cannot deflect blame on corruption, fraud and abuse to the American people like two people have tried and failed to do on this thread. Thank You.
it sickens me how many folks i have seen walk away from their properties because they fell in value and they can well afford to pay their mortgages.
i bought my first property 2 weeks before the biggest real estate crash nyc ever saw . that was right after the stock market crash in 1987. i was in the hole by 30% when the smoke cleared.
but you know what? it was my decision to buy and my responsibility to pay for it.
today it is worth many times what i paid but the point is walking away was not an option i would even have considered.
I am glad it worked out for you. I knew only one couple that had to have a foreclosure done and they just needed a moderate adjustment on the mortgage with bank cooperation and could have kept it. The husband had been laid off and he was the one who brought in the most. They really did everything they could.
I am not suggesting anyone feel too sorry for them. They have been doing better since then. At the same time, we need to have a sense of decency that sometimes people do their best and it happens. We should have class and rise above automatically judging. too. So many people that do that have something unfortunate happen to them and then want our support when it happens to them. Mutual respect is important.
Money is not the only factor to consider in a person and am glad I have that perspective. I personally have done OK. If I worked on Wall Street it would be for a decade at most and then somewhere else before I lose that important perspective. I am sure there are some good people there, too.
Again, I'm glad to hear your situation worked out.
To think otherwise in my opinion is laughable like believing in the tooth fairy.
The 43-9 vote is a laughable gap between those that are calling like it is and not giving those who abused their already excessive power a free pass and those who want to look the other way and minimize the 2008 crisis.
That could bode well for the next generation hopefully. Hopefully, it will not happen again. As for me, I only need to work for another 7-10 years.
To think otherwise in my opinion is laughable like believing in the tooth fairy.
So be it, an underwater homeowner, and a mortgage broker, who was paid lavish bonuses, were both guilty. Not so equally punished. In fact we could not do enough for the chosen ones among the guilty.
Just for the record, I didn't vote as it was a stupid poll. I was never angry with Wall St. No one forced people to go chasing returns to invest in MBS. The S&P is back up where it was pre-crash, at least in nominal dollars. Given the generally anemic growth, I'd be more worried about another bubble if it was significantly above what it had been in real dollars. So anyone who didn't run around like a headless chicken buying high and selling low is now made whole. It's been three years, which isn't that long. You have a few people that were coming of retirement age and probably looking at shifting assets that probably did have to adjust plans. All prudent investors, however, who stayed in the market with a diverse portfolio are whole. Three years is very little in terms of financial planning for retirement.
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