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Minimum wage jobs often do not have benchmarks by which workers can make a case for a raise. It's not as if they get yearly performance evaluations or reviews.
At my previous job, two dozen employees were all paid within a 20-cent range (max was 20 cents above minimum wage).
Do you care to argue with a straight face that the worth of every single worker was within such a narrow range?
do you care to argue that most of them were worth a lot more than they were getting or that some of them werent overpaid even at that low wage?
Like most issues, there are two sides to this one. One one hand, we'll have the conservatives bringing up good points such as, the minimum wage being intended as a starting point for young people rather than a lifetime wage, that businesses will have to increase prices as wages increase, and that people have a responsibility to improve their skill sets if they want higher wages.
On the other hand, we'll have the liberals bringing up equally good points such as, more money in the hands of consumers will benefit the whole economy, sub living wage incomes put additional demand on the taxpayers via increased need for social programs, and the idea that some companies exploit workers in this economy by offering a low wage knowing desperate people will take it.
The way I see it, all of these are true to some degree, but they are just symptoms of the real problem. The real problem is that we have eliminated far too many jobs where regular people could reasonably expect to start at the bottom and work their way up to a decent standard of living. We have allowed entire industries to be off-shored to China and other low cost parts of the world instead of keeping them here. It isn't just manufacturing or factory jobs anymore either. The white collar world has been affected by this too. Technology, finance, and customer support type jobs have been especially hard hit in the last decade.
What we're left with is a service based economy. Most service jobs don't pay a whole lot and we have more and more people trying to get these jobs.
Equally important is that we have a currency which simply isn't worth anything. Inflation goes up while the real value of our money goes down. This hurts working people more than anything else IMHO.
I have more to add to this. Be back shortly.
no the problem is liberals don't understand how the economy works
some are very well intended but they just don't understand it at all
to put more money in people hands they either need to become more productive, you need to have inflation or businesses need to raise prices to be able to pay for the increased wages
additionally if you substantially raise minimum wage in addition to prices going up people making above minimum wage also want raises causing prices to be raised further
so since most people arent going to be more productive to warrant raises on merit to put more money in the hands of consumers you're going to cause inflation making no progess at all and in fact even make things worse since as you pointed out inflation is hardest on the poor
this doesnt even take into account people who are out of work who would be willing to work below min wage
of course its easier for politicians to try and turn people against each other than it is to look at real issues like the national debt and inflation
they rob you blind thru inflation, buy votes with your tax dollars, spend money with no accountability like some 19 year old bimbo who just got her dads credit card then tell you to hate people who actually pay the bulk of the taxes and creat the bulk of the jobs (and im saying this as someone who isnt rich) and people fall for it hook line and sinker
Im not saying their arent unethical rich people who do some shady things but they arent the rule
And there area lot more idiots who are shady and unethical who are broke because their hair brained schemes didnt work than there are people who were actually successful at swindling people
For those that are that useless there is SSI. But most of those can be trained to do better.
Full employment is everyone that wants a job has one those that want to leach don't count against full employment. As far as I am concerned.
Full employment is easy to get. Write a check to every man woman and child in the US for $3k and you will have full employment fast. That is about what is lacking in consumer spending to get full employment. You can argue that businesses would just up the prices rather than sell more product. But I would order more inventory in expectation of more demand and only raise prices enough to cover any higher prices that my suppliers would charge. If you mark your prices up and I don't I'll sell my inventory and you will keep yours.
Where do you get the money?
The national debt consists of two parts, T-bills and the paper cash in your pocket. Up the debt limit by $1trillion and write everyone a check. The government is already printing money to run itself. Well back door doing it. The Fed is buying up a lot of the T-bills that come up on auction. So why not put the money where it will increase the tax base. And upping the minimum wage far enough will dramatically increase the tax base. Do it far enough and we could balance the budget and start buying back our national debt.
write everyone is this country a check for 3k and you will have almost 0 employment
most people in this country make around that much or a little more a year
you give them that much to stay home and they won't do ****
then who are businesses supposed to hire? nobody will work for 3k a month and they can't afford to pay people 10 k a month because nobody will be able to afford their products do to the drastic price increases
and i didnt say disabled i said useless there is a difference
i feel bad for people with debilitating diseases and injuries but tons of people just have no intelligence or marketable skill and wanted to **** off instead of learning something useful and now they are unhirable or a detriment to whoever does hire them
the govt does a lot of stupid things that are running this country into the ground -printing money like crazy and adding to the debt as you pointed out are 2 of them
so your solution is to do more of the same? how does that help anyone?
look i can max out all my credit cards and live like a king for a year or 2 until the bills come due but all i have really done is put myself in a worse situation
printing more and more money to give to people accomplishes nothing but massive inflation, even more people out of work and a worse quality of life for everyone
we need things that are sustainable and sorry but while your idea may help things a drop for a month or 2 they would completely destroy this country within a few year
and that's a problem with politics
you dont win votes by thinking long term- you win them by using the tax money of people who make good money to buy votes from people with short term (often completely empty) promises
nobody cares how bad the next 50 years will be as long as they can have their iphones today
at some point the bills come due, bubbles pop and yet somehow you get some people like yourself who want to compound the problem with more short term unsustainable fixes that ruin things in the long term
In the case of my previous employer (who nets $3M per year), he can avoid charging more to recoup his costs by spending only 12 weeks a year globetrotting than the 16 weeks he spends now.
good for him
whats wrong with him making 3 million a year
if those people are such great employees go work somewhere else
if not be glad he exists or they wouldnt have a job
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osito Actually teenaged and young adult unemployment is pretty high due to all of the adults presently stuck in minimum wage and entry-level jobs.
Half of all minimum wage workers are over the age of 25.
so? what % of workers over 25 make minimum wage?the idea that by merely existing people are worth a lot of money to someone else is laughable and there are a lot of people on this planet whose only real function is to make sure the shoes on their feet don't blow away
Not every job is meant for you to raise a family on or to even put a roof over your head.
Get a 2nd or a 3rd job.
The business owner takes all the risk and who is smart enough to run a successful business can take every day off if they can afford it.
You get 2 days off a week, enjoy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt
In the case of my previous employer (who nets $3M per year), he can avoid charging more to recoup his costs by spending only 12 weeks a year globetrotting than the 16 weeks he spends now.
The federal minimum wage, affects all USA wages and salaries but the proportional extent of that affect is inversely related to the difference between the minimum and the job’s pay rate.
If USA’s median wage’s over $ 50 K, I would suppose that a quarter of USA’s wage and salary earners are at or below 20 K.
My guesstimates are:
Over 15% of our nation’s wage and salary earners depend upon incomes that are at or below $15,000/Yr. and are perceivably to extremely affected by the FMW;
An additional 1O% of USA’s wage and salary earners earn at or less than $20,000/Yr. and are less perceivably but certainly affected by the FMW.
I’m interested in any authoritative data that you members can come up with. I’m guessing but confident considering the FMW is considering factor that significantly affects a major segment of our population and USA’s economy.
To consider the FMW only as it relates to those actually earning precisely the FMW is analogous to limiting discussion of war casualties as only military KIA’s without considering civilians and rehabilitation, permanent injuries, or families’ sufferings.
Discussion of the minimum wage is much more than a discussion of teen-age unemployment or entry level jobs.
Not every job is meant for you to raise a family on or to even put a roof over your head.
Get a 2nd or a 3rd job.
Back before WWII the rate of pay for pulling a rickshaw wasn't high enough to buy the food necessary to maintain body weight as you did it. That job didn't have a standard of living it had a standard of dyeing. If something doesn't pay well enough to keep you alive then it should not be done. What you need to stay alive. Food to eat. Stuff to wear. Shelter from the elements. If 40 hrs a week doesn't cover that then it shouldn't be done in the US. Dead weight loss. Set that at where one person can survive on one job.
so? what % of workers over 25 make minimum wage?the idea that by merely existing people are worth a lot of money to someone else is laughable and there are a lot of people on this planet whose only real function is to make sure the shoes on their feet don't blow away
I think it's something like 2%, maybe not even that. Productivity seems a pretty good standard for compensation.
Payroll $500K, employer nets $3M, you do the math.
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