College admission counselor (San Diego, Howe: student loans, private school, colleges)

[numbersguy100]

Originally Posted by EDS_

Having seen both my kids go through college admissions and medical school admissions.........even very high achieving 17yos need help navigating the college application waters.

Oh absolutely. My college regularly sends about 20% of the graduating class to med school and you can bet that they are getting TONS of guidance with that entire process. My point was simply that it comes at a price and sending your kid to a large public high school will not come with the kind of guidance that OP is seeking. Even most people I know in HP hire private consultants because they aren’t satisfied with the levels of personal attention at HPHS. So whether the cost of this service is built into private school tuition or paid for on the side, the point is if that’s the level of attention OP wants, it will cost.

[texasdiver]

College Confidential forums have many type-A parents who have gone through these issues and grind them into the ground. That's one place to go look for advice.

https://talk.collegeconfidential.com/

[deenie1]

I PM'd you re: someone we've been using.

[NDGRAD07]

My college admissions counselor was absolutely useless. Had never heard of my top choice school (a top 10 liberal arts school) and discouraged me from taking more than a few AP classes because it would be too hard.

[Wittgenstein's Ghost]

Originally Posted by Taub201

Do you want your kid to apply to a variety of out of state, competitive colleges but you desire help in choosing the best ones or navigating the admissions process (essays, recs, etc.)?

Take the ACT and SAT 3x each starting next year.
Take a prep course.
Take challenging courses and do well in them.
Be excellent in something besides academics.

Originally Posted by cordata

All sounds like good advice. But do colleges see an issue in taking the exam 9 times ?

I run a fairly large test prep company, and if you Google any relevant SAT or ACT prep terms in DFW, you'll see my company. I don't agree with this advice (regarding testing 3x).

Taking the test multiple times is not in itself likely to raise scores. The tests are simply too reliable. Instead, I would recommend taking an official practice test for both of them (free PDFs are available online, just make sure they are official) and picking the one with the higher score (in percentile terms). 85% of students that we have do this score about the same, though. The tests are very similar now.

Once you pick a test, start prep. Hire a tutor if it's in the budget. Rather than a course, I'd choose private tutoring. We offer both, but we honestly only do it because so many parents and students come to us dead-set on a group course. I would rather have fewer sessions with a private, highly-skilled tutor than a lot of sessions in a group. 10-12 sessions is usually enough to get 90% of kids very close to their score potential.

If your kid is a rising junior who has taken Algebra 2 already, you can start this process now. If he or she has not taken Algebra 2 already, start on Khan Academy (free) right now and target a spring test date. Start prep at the beginning of the fall semester.

A good tutor should have your kid doing homework out of official practice tests, so he or she will know what his score should look like before test day. If the average on these practice tests has been 1300, and your kid gets a 1280-1320 on the real deal, the real deal was accurate. In order to get a better score, he or she needs to prep or study more. If the read deal test comes back at 1240, take it again....he or she underperformed.

I hope that helps. Btw, when talking to tutoring companies, ask what their tutors' qualifications are. If they don't have a standard for test scores, go somewhere else. I could hire a million people with masters degrees, but that's meaningless. Having a high test score standard is much harder, but it's worth it. It's not sufficient, but it is necessary.

[Wittgenstein's Ghost]

Originally Posted by calgirlinnc

Leading colleges across the country are waiving the SAT/ACT requirement for 2021 applicants due to CV. Some schools are waiving the test for the next 3 years.


"But with many high schools closed or teaching remotely for the rest of the academic year, a growing number of colleges and universities are waiving standardized test requirements amid the coronavirus pandemic.

Some went further than that, with leaders of the University of California system voting on May 21 to phase out the SAT and ACT as an admissions requirement over the next four years.

The test will be optional through 2024, when the system’s 10 schools could develop its own admissions test. The system had already eliminated the standardized test requirement because of the outbreak of the virus."

The article then provides further information from top schools and lists the schools that are so far waiving the requirement.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nyt...virus.amp.html

This is an even better article:

"Some of the most selective liberal arts colleges in the country have suspended the testing requirement, including Williams, Amherst, Haverford, Davidson, Pomona, Rhodes, Scripps and Vassar colleges. Davidson, Rhodes and Williams, which routinely ranks as No. 1 in national liberal arts colleges on U.S. News & World Report rankings, are launching three-year pilot programs to test whether the requirement is needed at all. Vassar plans to review the matter next year to see whether to extend it. So is Trinity University, a liberal arts college in Texas."

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.was...outputType=amp

Here is a link to a website that updates daily, with a list of non testing schools. (They do not list schools that already did not require an SAT/ACT):

https://2021admissions.org/list-of-a...21-admissions/

This list is incomplete, however. For example, SMU has waived the test and I don't see it on the list.

Waiving the requirement isn't the same thing as saying students with no score are on equal footing with students who have a good score. I would always rather have an average score for a school than no score.

If a kid has great grades and saved a baby out of a burning building but has an average test score, sure....apply with no score. But for most kids, I think a score that is near the average for a college is the best chance of admission.

-------------------
OP: We don't really specialize in college admissions consulting, so I can't be of great help there. But I would caution you to not get ahead of yourself in the whole pre-med course while in high school thing. If your kid goes on to a strong college (let's say UT), and he or she took Chem 1 and Chem 2 at a local community college, Organic Chem at UT might be a real wake up call. That's not to say that dual credit classes aren't useful -- they are -- but keep an eye on the long game here. Your kid getting into med school will depend on what he or she does in college, not high school. The goal at this point is to get your kid into a decent college and set him or her up for success. Any college that most of us have heard of is a good enough college to be a path to med school if he or she does well.

[Jimmy1953]

I did BBA at Norrth Texas, Master at Texas Tech. I made a good living. I retired at age 57.

[Jimmy1953]

Originally Posted by Jimmy1953

I did BBA at Norrth Texas, Master at Texas Tech. I made a good living. I retired at age 57.

I ran in Mexico Guadaljara San Juan Cosala when I retired,

[calgirlinnc]

Originally Posted by Wittgenstein's Ghost

Waiving the requirement isn't the same thing as saying students with no score are on equal footing with students who have a good score. I would always rather have an average score for a school than no score.

If a kid has great grades and saved a baby out of a burning building but has an average test score, sure....apply with no score. But for most kids, I think a score that is near the average for a college is the best chance of admission.

Yes, actually, that is what even top colleges and universities are saying.

Cornell:

At least two Ivy League schools adjusted their policies for applicants. On April 22, Cornell University suspended its testing requirements, saying in a statement that “due to this extraordinary circumstance,” students could submit applications without ACT or SAT exam results starting in August 2021.

“We can’t pre-define in absolute, comprehensive terms what economic or personal disruptions will look like,” the statement added. "We don’t plan to require any students to justify their reasons for not submitting test results."


Harvard:

"Harvard College recently told applying high school juniors that they would not face penalties if they were unable to submit SAT subject test results and Advanced Placement test scores.

"We know that there are fewer opportunities to take the SAT or ACT given the cancellations to date,” Harvard said in a statement. “You will not be disadvantaged in any way if you do not submit subject tests."

Princeton:

"Two other Ivy League schools, Princeton and the University of Pennsylvania, do not require students take SAT subject tests for admission. In a recent message to potential applicants, Princeton’s dean of admission, Karen Richardson said, “while our policy has long been that SAT subject tests are recommended but not required, now seems the appropriate time to reiterate that applicants who do not submit subject tests will not be disadvantaged in our process.” She added, “SAT or ACT test scores are only one part of our holistic review.”


From the NYT article cited above.

The no test movement is growing and many top schools are experimenting with no test scores as part of their admissions requirements. Corona virus has accelerated that process. Awesome test scores are never a negative, of course, but this coming application year may look very different than recent years.

[Wittgenstein's Ghost]

Originally Posted by calgirlinnc

Yes, actually, that is what even top colleges and universities are saying.

Cornell:

At least two Ivy League schools adjusted their policies for applicants. On April 22, Cornell University suspended its testing requirements, saying in a statement that “due to this extraordinary circumstance,” students could submit applications without ACT or SAT exam results starting in August 2021.

“We can’t pre-define in absolute, comprehensive terms what economic or personal disruptions will look like,” the statement added. "We don’t plan to require any students to justify their reasons for not submitting test results."


Harvard:

"Harvard College recently told applying high school juniors that they would not face penalties if they were unable to submit SAT subject test results and Advanced Placement test scores.

"We know that there are fewer opportunities to take the SAT or ACT given the cancellations to date,” Harvard said in a statement. “You will not be disadvantaged in any way if you do not submit subject tests."

Princeton:

"Two other Ivy League schools, Princeton and the University of Pennsylvania, do not require students take SAT subject tests for admission. In a recent message to potential applicants, Princeton’s dean of admission, Karen Richardson said, “while our policy has long been that SAT subject tests are recommended but not required, now seems the appropriate time to reiterate that applicants who do not submit subject tests will not be disadvantaged in our process.” She added, “SAT or ACT test scores are only one part of our holistic review.”


From the NYT article cited above.

The no test movement is growing and many top schools are experimenting with no test scores as part of their admissions requirements. Corona virus has accelerated that process. Awesome test scores are never a negative, of course, but this coming application year may look very different than recent years.

You're misinterpreting the quotes you posted. The last two deal with SAT subject tests, not the SAT. The first says students don't need to justify why they aren't submitting test results. That isn't the same thing as saying they are on equal footing. There is no world in which two students apply to Cornell with equal GPA, class rank, etc. and the one with a 1500 SAT isn't looked at better than the one without a test score.

The test-optional movement in general is a whole different discussion, but I think it has been overblown in the media because testing is looked at negatively due to disparities in outcomes between races and income levels.