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Many local towns have dealt very well with "outside" private companies owning facilities in town. This has been going on for decades. Plus many local towns deal well with their public schools, police departments, fire departments, etc.
Maybe Stafford is a very small town, but a small town bands with other small towns for aggregating services.
Not sure what you are proposing, if any....
Right and we recently closed a elementary school (granted it was just a few grades) due to lower population.
My point is if the population doesn't grow you have to do things to make yourself more attractive to get more people to come in and spend money.
If we have a town that doesn't manage anything what exactly are they in control of if there are complaints? What's the point of taxes if everything is outsourced and someone elses fault? What exactly is being used to measure performance exactly? CT doesn't have a graduation test like NY and Mass to graduate high school (Regents and MCAS). Heck for teachers it contracted with Praxis (like NY) for teacher certification so there was no local decision on qualifications. In Mass the MTEL's are more homegrown.
I understand what shared services/regionalization is but again that shows a lack of buying power and pretty much makes my argument.
We can talk about wealth and GDP all we want but at the end of he day the fact of the matter is many services and products are commodities and frankly it's the customer count that matters. Glastonbury and West Harford are on MDC...why? Because they don't have the population to do it themselves and if they tried it would cost much more.
As for crime that's where it can also get funny. Crime stats are usually where the arrest is but it doesn't factor back to where the criminals are actually from. For example I know a very affluent area on the south shore of mass. I recall a prostitute that would go Brockton for clients and go back. I don't know how she could afford it but anyways the arrests and charges were in brockton because that's where the act took place. Ok well that's just one person what about all the other crimes in urban areas that are performed or sourced by those out of the cities? Then you have the dumping of issues like drugs and homelessness that usually falls on urban areas. If the sending district of a school district can provide tuition to a town why can't these urban areas charge back for such things if it isn't their populations doing it?
There's also a fair amount of products and services that cater to given time in life. Once the population ages out it's much harder to operate. Would kids clothing store exist if the average age was 64 in a town? Probably not. But you'd get your life insurance companies. going from Groton to Sharon is nearly a leap of 25 years https://patch.com/connecticut/hartfo...der-40-over-50
Steve this is for everyone else on here who thinks all the money is moving away from Connecticut.
"HARTFORD — Another big bump in income and sales tax revenue means the next state budget will not only support a record $600 million in tax relief, but will also allow a $3.5 billion payment into Connecticut’s long-underfunded pension programs for state employees and public school teachers, Gov. Ned Lamont announced Monday."
I have been hearing that the rich are leaving our state since the day I found this forum yet there is no real evidence of it. We are still at or near the very top for income and wealth by every measure. It hasn’t changed. Some posters love to cry “The sky is falling, the sky is falling” but they have no real proof of that. As you both note, the rich have moved out of our state but they have been replaced by other wealthy people. It’s that simple. If it wasn’t our economy (and tax revenue) would look much different. Jay
While it's true many have left, and not just Boomers retiring, they have no idea the impact of wealthy NYers who plowed into CT unmercifully during the Covid boom and beyond. They were unrelenting. Many don't care they paid over ask or if their values go down.
I can understand Obekyman not knowing if from upstate somewhere, but Bpt111, a Stamford guy/gal, should know better.
Seasonality also comes into play. Say if someone is here for the spring and summer and then down south for autumn and winter that doesn't mean they left in entirety. Bradley airport has done a significantly high amount of expansion to places down south. It's easier and probably faster to fly to Charlestown SC or even Palm beach then it is to go to block island. You have a pick of places in Florida. Yeah it isn't europe or asia but the expansion is significant. snowbirds do exist
I think it can depend specifically where in the state. You can have people leave a local government in the state and go to another one. When I mention that the city of Hartford as a declining population and it has declined about 33% since Peak it's usually counted by the argument that they still live in the Hartford area but they don't live in Hartford itself. Although that could be true and probably was true it's certainly not true today. I know people in West Hartford and Glastonbury that would never set foot in the Hartford today.
The other thing to remember though is that just because people are affluent doesn't mean that they're spending money. Consumption can be marginal. Yes there's always going to be upkeep of a building I understand that but there's only so much that can be put in. If you have one inside swimming pool you're probably not putting another one in. You're not putting solar panels on your house every other year they should be able to last a few decades.
Sometimes there's a difference between old money and new money. Old money might have invested in the biggest state and everything looks pristine and they spend a fair amount of time there. New money might have a smaller place but jet sets all over the place.
What really gets an economy going is when you have a broader base of people make social gains. But even today that's a bit harder to do since we've Advanced so much with technology. Technology helps replace the physical need to do things that you otherwise would have paid much more for. Back in the day if you were really rich and MP3 players didn't exist you could actually just hire the band to be there. Some of this still exist today I've heard of private concerts that Beyonce puts on in Asia.
The trouble is is that I think everybody agrees that they're like some strong local communities but frankly I just don't see a whole lot of that happening. I see small communities that Outsource a fair amount of their operations the Quasi operations and to consortiums and at the same point we see these large National companies that pretty much employ everybody with very little locally sourced and manufactured that stays in the area.
I live by the Stafford Speedway which is owned by a guy in Hampton Massachusetts, down the street is a plaza owned by a real estate firm out of springfield, the Big Y which talks about its *locally sourced* food from Braintree Massachusetts( ironically 2 hours away). The Holy Trinity here is mostly dollar general, CVS and Dunkin Donuts.
In terms of local service even a place like West Hartford and Glastonbury can't afford to have their own water system so it goes to MDC. They also can't afford to run their own pension systems so that goes to the state, in terms of buying things they also rely on consortiums even out of state like the mhgc, you might not have enough for a student population so it then becomes a Regional School District. If there's significant crime then you're going to have to rely on the state police to step in because a lot of these local places with hardly any crime don't have the resources or experience to deal with these things. I recall one stabbing in the South Shore where none of the police department said any experience so they had to call each other about seven towns had to respond.
So when you talk about these nice small strong local towns I have to ask what exactly are they responsible for when *everything* is outsourced?
Oh my god, what a crock. Yet again you present a very narrow view (only yours) of Connecticut that I have to call out. First, what person lives in West Hartford resident does not go into Hartford. They are literally attached to each other with an invisible line separating them. You can’t tell the difference between West Hartford and the West End, it’s that cohesive. The areas major hospitals are in Hartford so I find it unlikely that they haven’t used or visited at least one of them. Also Hartford has excellent entertainment and cultural attractions so only an idiot would not take advantage of them. I live in Glastonbury and know many people here and I know no one that hasn’t taken advantage of these. It’s just ridiculous to say that.
I’m also sorry but there is NOTHING wrong with small towns outsourcing services or buying things through a cooperative. It saves the town money and keeps taxes down. No small town has the ability to provide all services they need. It’s ludicrous to expect that here or any small town throughout the country.
You have the claim that northern Conn3cticut relies on western Massachusetts before. I proved you completely wrong and that if anything western Massachusetts relies more on Connecticut for things. Be it air travel from Connecticut’s Bradley airport to western Massachusetts companies like Friendly’s and Big Y being owned by Connecticut residents. I’m not going through all that yet again.
Greater Hartford’s Metropolitan District Commission (MDC) is just like Boston’s MDC. It’s a regional agency that provides water and sewage services to many towns. Those services are best provide pd on a regional basis. It’s a model that is used throughout the country. It really is telling you think otherwise. It reflects NOTHING on those towns at all. Giv3 up trying to make something out of nothing already. It does not reflect well 9n you. Jay
Right and we recently closed a elementary school (granted it was just a few grades) due to lower population.
My point is if the population doesn't grow you have to do things to make yourself more attractive to get more people to come in and spend money.
If we have a town that doesn't manage anything what exactly are they in control of if there are complaints? What's the point of taxes if everything is outsourced and someone elses fault? What exactly is being used to measure performance exactly? CT doesn't have a graduation test like NY and Mass to graduate high school (Regents and MCAS). Heck for teachers it contracted with Praxis (like NY) for teacher certification so there was no local decision on qualifications. In Mass the MTEL's are more homegrown.
I understand what shared services/regionalization is but again that shows a lack of buying power and pretty much makes my argument.
We can talk about wealth and GDP all we want but at the end of he day the fact of the matter is many services and products are commodities and frankly it's the customer count that matters. Glastonbury and West Harford are on MDC...why? Because they don't have the population to do it themselves and if they tried it would cost much more.
As for crime that's where it can also get funny. Crime stats are usually where the arrest is but it doesn't factor back to where the criminals are actually from. For example I know a very affluent area on the south shore of mass. I recall a prostitute that would go Brockton for clients and go back. I don't know how she could afford it but anyways the arrests and charges were in brockton because that's where the act took place. Ok well that's just one person what about all the other crimes in urban areas that are performed or sourced by those out of the cities? Then you have the dumping of issues like drugs and homelessness that usually falls on urban areas. If the sending district of a school district can provide tuition to a town why can't these urban areas charge back for such things if it isn't their populations doing it?
There's also a fair amount of products and services that cater to given time in life. Once the population ages out it's much harder to operate. Would kids clothing store exist if the average age was 64 in a town? Probably not. But you'd get your life insurance companies. going from Groton to Sharon is nearly a leap of 25 years https://patch.com/connecticut/hartfo...der-40-over-50
Haven’t you previously posted complaints that Connecticut towns don’t do enough buying collectively? Why the change? Your question about MDC is ridiculous. See my response to your other comment for a reason. I’m done wasting my time with responding to you. JayCT, Moderator
Big Y is a private company owned (family) and the HQ is in springfield. https://corporateofficeheadquarters.org/big-y/ The D'mour family name is on a variety of buildings in the region and they have donated money all around, no argument there. The HQ is in mass and is in springfield. there's nothing blocking them from moving it to CT (could go well for that 3rd casino site in east windsor)
As for friendly's that's long gone at least from what it was. It filed for bankruptcy 18 months ago and was bought out by Amici Partners Group. They might have a distribution center or packing in wilbraham, the restaurant and store ice cream are separate. I have no issue with Bradley airport they do a fine job. But increasingly due to the population shifts it isn't exactly regarded as a Hartford airport
I have family near Cincinnati and a fair amount references the tri state area, same as near PA/NJ and NY. But you have to admit when a name changes it tends to reflect a legit change. In Brockton for example the local paper changed from Brockton Enterprise to Enterprise. The Hartford Courant is now the Courant. Brockton chamber of commerce became the "Metro South" chamber of commerce. I know many people there. Would Hartford chamber of commerce change their name to north central ct chamber of commerce? I don't know. Could the CT river be renamed New England river given that the vast majority of it is not in CT ? Again I don't know
My point with strong towns is that they should be able to do as much locally as possible otherwise what's the point about bragging about them? If you can get access to the same services why pay more? Let's say you have a regional school district with four towns. Access to that school district can be from the cheapest way of renting or owning in those four towns. Say one town has houses starting at 400K, another 500k, another 600k and another 700K. Why pay 700K for access to a school you can send your kids to at 400K ?
As for culture the opera closed after 67 seasons more than 10 years ago. Of course the whalers left as well but hardly anyone went. Pratt Street looks nice but the recent pullback simply means less people going in. Obviously those that work in a city would tend to dine out there but without them how many are going to go in. Max Resturant group just opened The place 2 be in springfield. Yet it's the largest one, bigger than west hartford and glastonbury. https://www.westernmassnews.com/2022...n-springfield/
My point is ultimately population growth and size does matter for businesses. Customer count and cash flow matters. Inflation is real and not all businesses can raise prices and expect the same sales. I'm literally looking at businesses downsizing due to a lower customer count. Customer count increases matter as it is growth. These days businesses have to grow to keep up and survive.
I would recommend those on this board to read the book Antifragile
Inflation and people being behind on rent/utilities is going on in the entire country. I am looking for a website that has the breakdown by state to see where it is worse but have not been successful yet but I will keep looking. https://endhomelessness.org/blog/ris...f-homelessness
I just remembered I saw this article which shows the states which are suffering the worst of the inflation. It is really sad. Connecticut IS NOT on the list of 32 states.
"To identify the 32 states where people can’t afford a Big Mac, 24/7 Wall St. reviewed Pantry and Larder’s report The Truth About Big Mac Inflation. To determine Big Mac affordability, the report used Big Mac prices in U.S. states (from fastfoodmenuprices.com) and per capita disposable income in each state for March 2022 from the U.S. Bureau of Economic Analysis."
If you think this inflation is bad for CT, inflation is crushing poor low income states.
Bay Area residents are flocking to Fairfield County 2nd most after Manhattan the trend have spill into 2022 as well.
The wealthiest movers into Connecticut in 2020 came from New York County (home to the borough of Manhattan) and moved to Litchfield County, totaling 652 individuals who made the move. Over $262 million in annual income came to Litchfield County from New York, making the average income of one of those movers to be just over $402,000.
However, the second wealthiest group of movers came to Fairfield County from Contra Costa county, a county in the Bay Area’s East Bay and home to cities like Walnut Creek, Danville and other suburban areas. Fairfield County saw 74 individuals with an average annual income of $235,400 move to one of its cities from Contra Costa County, totaling over $174 million in income into Connecticut.
“There has been a huge move from California in general, but in particular [from the] Bay Area," Skolnick said. “Part of it is that a lot of people in the tech industry don't necessarily need to be there anymore. Their cost of living is so high, and working remotely is an option for them, so they don't have to be in California anymore.”
Skolnick said most of her Bay Area clients were families that found themselves surprised by the amount of land they could get for the prices as well as the quality of schools. She says Bay Area movers were excited they could use the public school system in Connecticut given its strength, as many of those same families would have been enrolling their children in private schools in California.
Big Y is a private company owned (family) and the HQ is in springfield. https://corporateofficeheadquarters.org/big-y/ The D'mour family name is on a variety of buildings in the region and they have donated money all around, no argument there. The HQ is in mass and is in springfield. there's nothing blocking them from moving it to CT (could go well for that 3rd casino site in east windsor)
As for friendly's that's long gone at least from what it was. It filed for bankruptcy 18 months ago and was bought out by Amici Partners Group. They might have a distribution center or packing in wilbraham, the restaurant and store ice cream are separate. I have no issue with Bradley airport they do a fine job. But increasingly due to the population shifts it isn't exactly regarded as a Hartford airport
I have family near Cincinnati and a fair amount references the tri state area, same as near PA/NJ and NY. But you have to admit when a name changes it tends to reflect a legit change. In Brockton for example the local paper changed from Brockton Enterprise to Enterprise. The Hartford Courant is now the Courant. Brockton chamber of commerce became the "Metro South" chamber of commerce. I know many people there. Would Hartford chamber of commerce change their name to north central ct chamber of commerce? I don't know. Could the CT river be renamed New England river given that the vast majority of it is not in CT ? Again I don't know
My point with strong towns is that they should be able to do as much locally as possible otherwise what's the point about bragging about them? If you can get access to the same services why pay more? Let's say you have a regional school district with four towns. Access to that school district can be from the cheapest way of renting or owning in those four towns. Say one town has houses starting at 400K, another 500k, another 600k and another 700K. Why pay 700K for access to a school you can send your kids to at 400K ?
As for culture the opera closed after 67 seasons more than 10 years ago. Of course the whalers left as well but hardly anyone went. Pratt Street looks nice but the recent pullback simply means less people going in. Obviously those that work in a city would tend to dine out there but without them how many are going to go in. Max Resturant group just opened The place 2 be in springfield. Yet it's the largest one, bigger than west hartford and glastonbury. https://www.westernmassnews.com/2022...n-springfield/
My point is ultimately population growth and size does matter for businesses. Customer count and cash flow matters. Inflation is real and not all businesses can raise prices and expect the same sales. I'm literally looking at businesses downsizing due to a lower customer count. Customer count increases matter as it is growth. These days businesses have to grow to keep up and survive.
I would recommend those on this board to read the book Antifragile
Uhh…where to start with your garbage. First, The Hartford Courant is still The Hartford Courant. I have no idea why you think it’s official name was changed. It hasn’t. Here is a link to their website to prove you are wrong.
I never said that Big Y wasn’t based in Springfield but yet you claimed that Massachusetts residents owned businesses here in Connecticut but implied Connecticut residents don’t own Massachusetts businesses. That I proved wrong by showing you the owners of Big Y and the former owners of Friendly’s live in Connecticut. You further proved yourself wrong by citing that Connecticut based Max Restaurant Group has restaurants in Springfield. Thank you that.
Bradley International Airport has always been branded as Hartford/Springfield’s airport. CTDOT and the Connecticut Airport Authority branded that way as a courtesy to western Massachusetts. It’s not new and means nothing really.
There is no The Place 2 Be in Glastonbury and they are not owned by Max Hospitality (formerly Max Restaurant Group). They are separate and I’m not sure what the size of the restaurant has to do with anything.
I won’t go any further since you obviously don’t know what you are talking about. Just more misinformation. Jay
Last edited by JayCT; 08-30-2022 at 08:26 PM..
Reason: Finished post
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Then you have the dumping of issues like drugs and homelessness that usually falls on urban areas. If the sending district of a school district can provide tuition to a town why can't these urban areas charge back for such things if it isn't their populations doing it? 
