Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Quizzes or attendance that counts towards grades are the easy solutions. I went with five minutes late = zero credit for showing up that day. Homework assignment one minute late - zero points. Most get it rather quickly. Show up after the quiz has started, you get however much time is left (quizzes must be timed - I generally give enough time for people who have prepared to answer every question, and no more).
I have no idea why you'd let them interrupt your class though. Just keep going to don't even acknowledge that they walked in the room. If they ask about something that was already covered, just say it was already discussed and move on. Do not provide the information they're looking for.
If they think they can get away with acting up, showing up late, interrupting class, handing things in late, etc, they will. You have to make it clear that you're not going to tolerate it.
OP is using case studies and other group projects, so quizzes might not be a viable option.
Grading for group projects sounds tough - possibly would have to do some sort of peer grading on contribution to the project. This will likely open a new can of worms and complaints by the students to your administration.
I've taken two classes where the instructor gave quizzes at up to 50% of the classes. One of the classes started at 6PM. Half the class would be in their seats by 5:45 and studying for the potential quiz. At exactly 6PM, the instructor's cell phone alarm would go off, and he would either start lecturing or give a quiz. He dropped the lowest quiz grade. It was obvious that the majority of the class were reading the lengthy reading assignments and coming to class on time. He didn't care if you arrived late. I have never seen a student expect the instructor to review material that was covered before they arrived late. I have only seen one instructor get irritated because students arrived late.
adjunct lecturer here. lateness became a serious problem in a class i teach (also a 3 hour time slot, although frankly 3 hour lectures are a terrible idea, no one can either pay attention or lecture well for that long consistently). this was not cc, but was a public college
finally one semester i instituted a policy of pop quizzes in the first 20 minutes of lecture. for the whole semester these quizzes accounted for about 8 -10% of total grade. this was clearly announced the first day and included on syllabus
this pretty much eradicated the problem. the quizzes were always very easy and based very obviously on the previous week's lecture notes. i gave 50% credit just for signing your name, since my goal was to improve attendance, not to penalize those who didn't have time to study for a pop quiz
there were a few occasional stragglers, but i usually just let those slide since having 2 or 3 people walk in late is not a problem (previous semesters, over half the class would show up late, which is a problem). any lecturer who gets all huffy that one or two students quietly enter the room while they talk has too much ego, IMO. if you are a good speaker, it is easy to keep your flow in this case
depending on the size of your class, this may or may not be feasible. I also took attendance, although this was solely to help me remember names. i would recommend this up to about 40 people, larger than that and it might not be feasible. students will show up more regularly if they think you care about their learning, and knowing names is a great way to show that
i urge you not to take it personally or lock out students who come late or have some sort of zero tolerance rule. instructors sometimes forget that college students often have real lives and real responsibilities, and usually aren't late because they were doing keg stands all night as stereotype would have you think. our goal is to teach, not to prove how much more valuable our time is than theirs
good luck!
EDIT - didn't read the thread, appears many others had similar advice, apologies for redundancy!
adjunct lecturer here. lateness became a serious problem in a class i teach (also a 3 hour time slot, although frankly 3 hour lectures are a terrible idea, no one can either pay attention or lecture well for that long consistently). this was not cc, but was a public college
finally one semester i instituted a policy of pop quizzes in the first 20 minutes of lecture. for the whole semester these quizzes accounted for about 8 -10% of total grade. this was clearly announced the first day and included on syllabus
this pretty much eradicated the problem. the quizzes were always very easy and based very obviously on the previous week's lecture notes. i gave 50% credit just for signing your name, since my goal was to improve attendance, not to penalize those who didn't have time to study for a pop quiz
there were a few occasional stragglers, but i usually just let those slide since having 2 or 3 people walk in late is not a problem (previous semesters, over half the class would show up late, which is a problem). any lecturer who gets all huffy that one or two students quietly enter the room while they talk has too much ego, IMO. if you are a good speaker, it is easy to keep your flow in this case
depending on the size of your class, this may or may not be feasible. I also took attendance, although this was solely to help me remember names. i would recommend this up to about 40 people, larger than that and it might not be feasible. students will show up more regularly if they think you care about their learning, and knowing names is a great way to show that
i urge you not to take it personally or lock out students who come late or have some sort of zero tolerance rule. instructors sometimes forget that college students often have real lives and real responsibilities, and usually aren't late because they were doing keg stands all night as stereotype would have you think. our goal is to teach, not to prove how much more valuable our time is than theirs
good luck!
EDIT - didn't read the thread, appears many others had similar advice, apologies for redundancy!
Wow! 50% credit just for signing your name! Those are the kind of quizzes that I love!
Wow! 50% credit just for signing your name! Those are the kind of quizzes that I love!
i used real exams and assignments to test their knowledge. the weekly pop quizzes were just about attendance, and to highlight what were the most important concepts of the previous lecture. and if they didn't show up, they couldn't sign their name!
fwiw, this was not an easy intro course, this was a 300 level CS course
I have had several professors that handled lateness different was. Some have done quizzes on a certain day and have assignments on others. Now yes you COULD hand in the assignments through e-mail prior to class to but there needs to be a good reason for it or something. Others have participation points (typically easy points) or actually take attendance during class.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollytree
A lot of students think this way. But imagine how insulting and demoralizing it is for a teacher to be standing up in front of a a room trying to teach and looking out over people chatting, on their phones, looking at the internet, having some french fries, walking in and out, or dozing off.
In Asia, teachers are revered and respected.... perhaps that's why Asian students are generally higher achievers?
The Asian culture also has more reverence to elders. In America, it has not been as import for many people since the 50's/60's. Maybe we need more parents to be parents and godforbid actually teach their kids respect.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucFan
If I were a student and I knew that I might be late due to work or other circumstance, I'd make sure my boss (teacher) knew ahead of time that it could be an issue and I'd apologize ahead for any disruption that it might cause. I'd try to enter the class with the least amount of disruption, hopefully entering the class in the back and sitting in the back.
It's all about respect for the instructor.
I agree, I tried to be on-time and make as little interruptions during classes. Of course sometimes you forget to turn off your cell phone, wake-up late, had an unforeseen emergency prior to class, got into an accident and waited for the cop to show up, getting off a shift that you couldn't switch off and having to drive straight to the class, ect.
Wow! 50% credit just for signing your name! Those are the kind of quizzes that I love!
Yes, 50% just for signing your name, but 100% fail if you come in late and miss the quiz. This guy knows how to get results, and he's fair. That communicates a lot to the students. I bet they liked him as an instructor, for the freebie credit for signing their name on the quiz. That's how you build loyalty.
Are you a college instructor or student? What do you think about students who show up late all the time?
I've been teaching community college since 2009.
I don't let them get away with being that late.
My policy is that, in a 3 hour class, if you show up more than 20 minutes late, you are considered absent for the day. I still let them come in and be in class (get the information), but they are considered absent for the day.
During the regular semester, in a 3-hour class they are allowed two absences with no penalty. The third absence means they can only get a C, at best, in the course, even if their actual grades are As and Bs. If they are absent a 4th time, they get an F or are dropped from the course.
Don't let them come in 30 minutes late without a penalty.
our goal is to teach, not to prove how much more valuable our time is than theirs
It's true our goal is to teach, but the class needs to have some boundaries. It's true that students often have legitimate reasons for being late (even over 30 minutes late), but my stance is...they're allowed some leeway in general. In a 3-hour class (which the original poster said he taught), I give them 20 minutes grace period. I don't *like* them being 18 minutes late, but I don't punish it either. Twenty minutes is a lot of time. After that, even if they did have a legitimate reason for being late, they just have to take it on the chin and let it count as one of their absences. (most every class allows a few absences with no penalty).
Most professors probably aren't penalizing lateness just on principle ("how dare students be late to MY class!"). Routinely late students cause problems and more work, even if they don't mean to, by asking questions that were already covered in the 20-30 minutes they weren't there, by emailing you about stuff they missed, emails that have to get answered (not saying answering emails isn't a part of teachers' job, but they much prefer to answer emails that are about concerns of the class, about needing extra help, about not understanding a concept, about setting up a one-on-one conference; they hate getting emails that force them to re-teach or re-cover things that were said in class or dealt with in class. And when a lot of students send those types of emails, it's very very frustrating.). Late students also distract the class in general when they come in. The teacher often has to stop, give them handouts, get them quickly acquainted with what the class is doing, etc. They also often miss important announcements and then claim "I didn't know" and want you to excuse them for things they would have known if they had been there.
Anyway, my advice to most teachers is to have not *too* strict, but reasonably strict policies, and then bend on a case-by-case basis when it comes to implementing penalties for lateness, tardies, etc. It's much easier and more effective to operate under strictness that bends (you don't announce to your students "I will bend on my policies," but on an individual basis, when you hear about the student who got into a fender bender, who had a sick relative, etc., you can bend. It's easier to operate that way than to have a free-for-all structure and then have to try to rein that in as the semester goes on.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
