Started Teaching at a Community College, lots of students come in late. (grades, course)
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It's been already said... the students are your customer who shell out enormous amounts of money. Just upload the slides to your website so the students can read up on it later. It's none of your business if somebody comes to class or not. Again, they pay YOU. It's your job to teach well so students can actually understand it, and be a little accommodating by uploading it to the website.
Unless somebody is disrupting the class...then that's it.
Just because "it's already been said", doesn't mean it's valid! lol! It's a Community College. Nobody's shelling out enormous amounts of money. In most states, CC's are heavily subsidized by the state, even with recent tuition hikes. If students attend only half of each class session, they're throwing their money away. They decided to make an investment in themselves by paying tuition, but then they throw away their investment. If a student knows in advance that she'll be late to class on a regular basis due to personal demands, she should see the instructor before she registers for the class, to find out if that will be a problem.
OP, have you spoken to any of your colleagues at the CC to see what their experience has been, and how they've handled it? It might be time to get acquainted with some of your colleagues.
Most of my fellow instructors don't care if the students come in late, they are just there to make a paycheck. They are burned out and don't care about the students success.
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Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth
Just because "it's already been said", doesn't mean it's valid! lol! It's a Community College. Nobody's shelling out enormous amounts of money. In most states, CC's are heavily subsidized by the state, even with recent tuition hikes. If students attend only half of each class session, they're throwing their money away. They decided to make an investment in themselves by paying tuition, but then they throw away their investment. If a student knows in advance that she'll be late to class on a regular basis due to personal demands, she should see the instructor before she registers for the class, to find out if that will be a problem.
OP, have you spoken to any of your colleagues at the CC to see what their experience has been, and how they've handled it? It might be time to get acquainted with some of your colleagues.
Most of my fellow instructors don't care if the students come in late, they are just there to make a paycheck. They are burned out and don't care about the students success.
When you say fellow instructors do you mean in the same program or faculty in general. Because if we are talking faculty in general, perhaps they do not have the long-term view for jobs. If it is say people in the same program, it maybe a personal view. Judging by other posts, you have a point about arriving early whether it is for class, a job or an interview.
When you say fellow instructors do you mean in the same program or faculty in general. Because if we are talking faculty in general, perhaps they do not have the long-term view for jobs. If it is say people in the same program, it maybe a personal view. Judging by other posts, you have a point about arriving early whether it is for class, a job or an interview.
I am not trying to justify or excuse being late to class.. in fact I am one of those who feels so awful about being late that if I am going to be more than a minute or two late I will often just skip class out of a feeling of mortification about interrupting the class! However, I still don't think that someone who shows up late is necessarily unaware of the need to be early or prompt when it comes to jobs, interviews, and so on.
When I was in high school, I was in a work release half day program. I was very apathetic about school but I had a perfect attendance record at work, kept the same job through two years of high school and never missed a day. I would go out partying on a Friday night and come home in the wee hours with just enough time to sober up and maybe sleep for two hours then shower and be at work Saturday morning. I missed a lot of school though, and when they pulled me in to the principal's office about attendance, they'd checked with my boss to see if I was having attendance problems at work too. They point blank asked me why I showed up for work but not to school. My smart aleck teenage response: "Duh. They pay me to show up for work. You start paying me to come to school and I'll be here."
Yeah I had a bad attitude but you get my point.
It's reality, money talks, and especially when you are dealing with a non-traditional student population, I knew various students I went to school with who were late to class because they just got off work and the person who was supposed to cover their shift was late, or they were standing in line at the financial aid office for 2 hours to try and resolve some financial aid problem and couldn't give up their line spot and have to come back a week later, or their sitter didn't show up on time, or their spouse had the only car and was late returning it, etc. I'm sure some are just late because they are inconsiderate, that happens too. Just saying that it depends a lot on the particular student population.
I am not trying to justify or excuse being late to class.. in fact I am one of those who feels so awful about being late that if I am going to be more than a minute or two late I will often just skip class out of a feeling of mortification about interrupting the class! However, I still don't think that someone who shows up late is necessarily unaware of the need to be early or prompt when it comes to jobs, interviews, and so on.
When I was in high school, I was in a work release half day program. I was very apathetic about school but I had a perfect attendance record at work, kept the same job through two years of high school and never missed a day. I would go out partying on a Friday night and come home in the wee hours with just enough time to sober up and maybe sleep for two hours then shower and be at work Saturday morning. I missed a lot of school though, and when they pulled me in to the principal's office about attendance, they'd checked with my boss to see if I was having attendance problems at work too. They point blank asked me why I showed up for work but not to school. My smart aleck teenage response: "Duh. They pay me to show up for work. You start paying me to come to school and I'll be here."
Yeah I had a bad attitude but you get my point.
It's reality, money talks, and especially when you are dealing with a non-traditional student population, I knew various students I went to school with who were late to class because they just got off work and the person who was supposed to cover their shift was late, or they were standing in line at the financial aid office for 2 hours to try and resolve some financial aid problem and couldn't give up their line spot and have to come back a week later, or their sitter didn't show up on time, or their spouse had the only car and was late returning it, etc. I'm sure some are just late because they are inconsiderate, that happens too. Just saying that it depends a lot on the particular student population.
No I agree. Non-traditional students are different. I am not going to mention habitual late people because that is one thing. What I am talking about are the students who don't intend to be late that may do it once or twice a semester. The issue seems to be that if they are late, they haven't contacted the prof before or after-hand. Obviously you cannot anticipate the financial aid line or how long an issue will take to get resolved, particularly if the office is only open a few hours. The same with getting in an accident en route to school, getting called in for work in 30 minutes, a family member having the only car, family emergency, ect. However, a good student would think of sending either an e-mail, sending a phone call or even showing up in professor after class or during office hours the next day if it is a situation that happened just right before class.
Moral of the story, non-traditional students are hard to figure out if they do not care if they are late or sorry about it. In the future, I say the OP needs to stipulate to be on-time, or e-mail me the day (whether it is before or after the class) letting me know you will not be there in the syllabus. Of course, they would still need to either read-up or get notes from others.
No I agree. Non-traditional students are different. I am not going to mention habitual late people because that is one thing. What I am talking about are the students who don't intend to be late that may do it once or twice a semester. The issue seems to be that if they are late, they haven't contacted the prof before or after-hand. Obviously you cannot anticipate the financial aid line or how long an issue will take to get resolved, particularly if the office is only open a few hours. The same with getting in an accident en route to school, getting called in for work in 30 minutes, a family member having the only car, family emergency, ect. However, a good student would think of sending either an e-mail, sending a phone call or even showing up in professor after class or during office hours the next day if it is a situation that happened just right before class.
Moral of the story, non-traditional students are hard to figure out if they do not care if they are late or sorry about it. In the future, I say the OP needs to stipulate to be on-time, or e-mail me the day (whether it is before or after the class) letting me know you will not be there in the syllabus. Of course, they would still need to either read-up or get notes from others.
Good points, all true.
My financial aid line example was because the community college I attended was notorious for effing up financial aid EVERY SINGLE SEMESTER. They are still at it. At the beginning of any semester you can go and see the lines snaking out of the tiny little office, winding down the hall, around the corner, and down another long hall. Getting through on the phone was impossible and 9 times out of 10 if you did get through they'd tell you you needed to come in person anyway, and wait times in the lines are routinely 2 hours or more.
I don't know why they cannot get their crap together but I remember trying to go before class, getting their as soon as they opened then having to step out of line because class was about to start and trying again after class, and so on. Plenty of single parents with exhausted crying kids standing in that line too.
They were/are so inept it's even made our local news a couple of times, with people getting all their paperwork turned in way before the deadlines and still having no funds AFTER school has started.
I was absolutely blown away when I transferred to the university. State school, huge student population, but they didn't delay my aid at all. It was like a dream! They screwed up in other ways but whatever.
I like the simple idea of task at the beginning of class being responsible for 20% of the grade. No makeups. 20% is high enough to get people in their seats to guarantee points but won't fail someone if they are really a high achiever. It would also put iffy students on notice from day 1 that they might squeak by this class if they only show up on time.
It's been already said... the students are your customer who shell out enormous amounts of money. Just upload the slides to your website so the students can read up on it later. It's none of your business if somebody comes to class or not. Again, they pay YOU. It's your job to teach well so students can actually understand it, and be a little accommodating by uploading it to the website.
Unless somebody is disrupting the class...then that's it.
The last time I checked my property tax bill, I paid a decent amount of money to fund my local community college. The students are NOT customers. They are stakeholders along with the taxpayers and faculty.
Earlier this year I started a part time evening job at a local Community College where I teach as an Adjunct Instructor in Business Management. It has been quite an experience.
The one thing that bugs me more than anything is students who show up late. I am talking about 30-45 minutes late on a regular basis. (These are 3 hour classes) At 10 minutes after the official class start time I shut the door thinking that would send a message to the students that they are late and the class is already under way but they walk in like they own the place and expect me to stop the class and tell them what they missed.
When I ask them why they were late they usually go mute, or just say something like: "got held up, traffic, or I had other things I had to do."
I try to lecture them about the importance of punctuality but they just look at me like I am crazy and the rest of the class students freeze up and look embarrassed. I see them thinking, "just leave him alone, what's the big thing about being late!"
Are you a college instructor or student? What do you think about students who show up late all the time?
I had an instructor that was hard cord when you come in late and he is right to be like that. What he did is have quizzes right at the beginning of class. If you missed it, SOL! Oh, how many student cry and whine about that.
I like what my math professor does: show up whenever you want, leave whenever you want, with the condition that you do so quietly and don't make a scene. He just so happens to be the best teacher I've ever had, mainly because he's there to teach, not babysit. He also understands that you don't need to be physically present to learn the material, which for most people, is the goal of college.
My general experience has been that it's rarely the student that causes the disruption and more often than not, it's the professor who does so. In a geology class I had there was this younger girl who would quietly play on her IPad for the majority of the class; she didn't bother anyone, was quiet, and didn't ask stupid questions. The only interruption that she caused was when the professor decided to spend 15 minutes talking about how it was rude. So on one hand we have a student who caused no distractions, and on the other we have the professor that wasted 15 minutes with an off-topic lecture. This just so happened to be the only teacher I've had with any sort of attendance policy. I flew back to my home state to visit family at the beginning of the quarter missing 2 days of class, so my grade dropped from an A to a B-.
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They screwed up in other ways but whatever.
