Logan Square, west bucktown input (Chicago, Roscoe: home, neighborhoods, private schools)

[Attrill]

The area is certainly fine, although as noted there can be some problem houses on the side streets South of Bloomingdale. They aren't anything to worry about unless you live next to them. The same can be said of many side streets around the North Ave. location. Both areas are perfectly safe for walking around at all hours - I've been doing so for over a decade. The whole "don't go West of Western" thing is definitely out of date.

While both areas are good I'd go with the Armitage area. It's much closer to the Blue Line and there are more new businesses and construction happening in the neighborhood. The stretch of Milwaukee between Armitage and California is about to see a lot of new construction, and new places are opening along Armitage all the time. For some reason a lot of the places that have opened along Armitage over the last 10 years have been poorly thought out, and failed quickly, but the ones that are solid (90 Miles, Osteria Longhe, Dante's, Parson's, Scofflaw) have all done very well.

Oh, and while the area can be considered to be Palmer Square, Logan Square is a better description that most people will understand.

[jonnynonos]

Again, I was not talking about crime or safety. I was talking about continued gentrification and thus the prospects of real estate investment. My post was clearly about population and its impact on gentrification.

So, if it's now a given to the point of being dismissive that everything east of California is a sure play, where do you think the gentrification is likely to stop?

Is it just as obvious that everything east of Central Park and Armitage is a solid investment?

Inquiring minds want to know; I want to get in on this sure fire deal.

[jdiddy]

Originally Posted by jonnynonos

I'm not really sure what the glib comments are meant to imply, but I was talking about appreciation in real estate more than anything.

But I hate to contest, you know, any absolute authority on the subject.

You were the one who correctly mentioned you weren't familiar with Logan Square, don't get defensive.


In Chicago
Mapping the Development Boom Along Milwaukee Avenue - Curbed Maps - Curbed Chicago

[jdiddy]

Originally Posted by jonnynonos

Again, I was not talking about crime or safety. I was talking about continued gentrification and thus the prospects of real estate investment. My post was clearly about population and its impact on gentrification.

So, if it's now a given to the point of being dismissive that everything east of California is a sure play, where do you think the gentrification is likely to stop?

Is it just as obvious that everything east of Central Park and Armitage is a solid investment?

Inquiring minds want to know; I want to get in on this sure fire deal.

Probably Belmont/Kimball area. After that, zoning, the Blue Line's location in the middle of the Kennedy, and the neighborhood blue hair's fighting any/all development will limit any major changes in those areas.

[jonnynonos]

You sound like most of the flip, know it all, hipsters I know who are now and forever more the proud owners of houses in Humboldt Park valued around 40 percent of what they paid for them pre crash.

I mean it is OBVIOUS that when a chicken restaurant opens up, things are only going one way, baby!

I personally don't think Logan Square will look terribly different 10 years from now.

A lot of those businesses on Milwaukee will, sadly, bite it in the next couple of years. They will be replaced, but I'm not sure the area will have the same kind of growth as the closer neighborhoods.

But I could be wrong.

[Attrill]

Originally Posted by jonnynonos

You sound like most of the flip, know it all, hipsters I know who are now and forever more the proud owners of houses in Humboldt Park valued around 40 percent of what they paid for them pre crash.

If you're talking about the areas South and West of what's being discussed in this thread, then yes, some people took a bath during the crash. But the areas in question in this thread actually did a good job of holding their values during the crash. I followed actual sales in the area around Armitage/California throughout the crash, and while the number of houses that sold plummeted, houses held their values pretty well. They've been increasing steadily for last year or two.

Originally Posted by jonnynonos

A lot of those businesses on Milwaukee will, sadly, bite it in the next couple of years. They will be replaced, but I'm not sure the area will have the same kind of growth as the closer neighborhoods.

But I could be wrong.

Have you been on Milwaukee between California and Fullerton on a weekend night in the last year or two? It is crazy busy, and pretty much all of the new places are packed. There is ceertainly a high demand for places in the area,

While they're aren't as many new businesses along Armitage, all of the ones I mentioned above are packed almost every night of the week. There are some places that aren't doing well, but that's because they're awful. Katakana looks to be more of a front than an actual business, and I can't figure out what they're thinking with the Red Lion - a BYOB sports bar with so-so food? It doesn't make much sense. Any place in the area with decent quality food and drinks is thriving, and that includes old standbys like Margie's and Arturo's.

[jdiddy]

Originally Posted by jonnynonos

You sound like most of the flip, know it all, hipsters I know who are now and forever more the proud owners of houses in Humboldt Park valued around 40 percent of what they paid for them pre crash.

I'm not sure how I could sound like that, because I haven't mentioned home values at all. I just corrected you on your hilariously outdated observation about going 'West of Western'. Logan Square gentrifying isn't speculation anymore, it hasn't been up for debate for at least 5 years now. That doesn't mean any RE investment is a sure thing, but buying in Logan Square doesn't carry the speculative risk that it may have had 15 years ago, or for those buying in East Humboldt Park in 2005 (and to a lesser extent still today).

If you buy a nice property, stay for at least 5-7 years, you'll be fine.

I mean it is OBVIOUS that when a chicken restaurant opens up, things are only going one way, baby!

Uh,

[jonnynonos]

Originally Posted by Attrill

If you're talking about the areas South and West of what's being discussed in this thread, then yes, some people took a bath during the crash. But the areas in question in this thread actually did a good job of holding their values during the crash. I followed actual sales in the area around Armitage/California throughout the crash, and while the number of houses that sold plummeted, houses held their values pretty well. They've been increasing steadily for last year or two.



Have you been on Milwaukee between California and Fullerton on a weekend night in the last year or two? It is crazy busy, and pretty much all of the new places are packed. There is ceertainly a high demand for places in the area,

While they're aren't as many new businesses along Armitage, all of the ones I mentioned above are packed almost every night of the week. There are some places that aren't doing well, but that's because they're awful. Katakana looks to be more of a front than an actual business, and I can't figure out what they're thinking with the Red Lion - a BYOB sports bar with so-so food? It doesn't make much sense. Any place in the area with decent quality food and drinks is thriving, and that includes old standbys like Margie's and Arturo's.

Good post.

[jonnynonos]

Originally Posted by jdiddy

I'm not sure how I could sound like that, because I haven't mentioned home values at all. I just corrected you on your hilariously outdated observation about going 'West of Western'. Logan Square gentrifying isn't speculation anymore, it hasn't been up for debate for at least 5 years now. That doesn't mean any RE investment is a sure thing, but buying in Logan Square doesn't carry the speculative risk that it may have had 15 years ago, or for those buying in East Humboldt Park in 2005 (and to a lesser extent still today).

If you buy a nice property, stay for at least 5-7 years, you'll be fine.



Uh,

My observation is only hilariously outdated if you are dense. My point is regarding buying a home and the general macro trends about the city. I apologize if anyone even bringing up the specter of a shadow if a doubt about the viability of buying around California and Armitage strikes you as preposterous; apparently real estate speculators don't necessarily agree with you as home price growth year over year seems fairly modest for Logan Square in general.

I personally have some doubts about the area because I am not sure it is going to get the yuppies moving in for good you really need to make it an attractive neighborhood to people older than the age of 25, not that there is anything wrong with it, but because I am just not sure there will ultimately be that many more transplants moving to Chicago.

The entire city cannot keep gentrifying in all directions.

If the OP wanted to know about the neighborhood as is I suspect he could just walk through it and look up crime stats.

Pilsen has gentrified a lot too, I wouldn't necessarily recommend anyone buy a house there thinking it's going to be the next Wicker Park in 10 years.

[jdiddy]

Originally Posted by jonnynonos

My observation is only hilariously outdated if you are dense. My point is regarding buying a home and the general macro trends about the city. I apologize if anyone even bringing up the specter of a shadow if a doubt about the viability of buying around California and Armitage strikes you as preposterous; apparently real estate speculators don't necessarily agree with you as home price growth year over year seems fairly modest for Logan Square in general.

Thank you for your passive aggressive apology. The YOY median sales price in Logan Square was up only slightly, that's true. It was also higher than Wicker Park or Lakeview. That reflects the fact that housing prices overall stabilized last year in Chicago, after several years of significant price increases. As the article I posted earlier stated, prices are up 33% over the last two years.

Here's another gauge of Logan Square's status within Chicago neighborhoods. In Trulia searches, Logan Square was searched more often than Wicker Park, Bucktown, Ravenswood, West Town, Ukranian Village, among others.

Chicago Home Prices and Heat Map - Trulia.com

I personally have some doubts about the area because I am not sure it is going to get the yuppies moving in for good you really need to make it an attractive neighborhood to people older than the age of 25, not that there is anything wrong with it, but because I am just not sure there will ultimately be that many more transplants moving to Chicago.

Again, you're speculating against something that's already taken place. Have you been to Fullerton/Milwaukee on a Saturday night? Gone to the farmer's market in the summer? The big question for Logan Square is if all of these currently planned developments are allowed to proceed to fulfill some of the existing demand, or whether that will push people into more teardowns/gut rehabs of marginal properties. Wicker Park has become one of the most expensive neighborhoods in Chicago (actually the priciest to rent in) because housing supply failed to increase to meet the demand. Whether supply is allowed to meet demand in Logan Square will go a long way in addressing how many long time residents can stay.