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I am having doubts about feeding my new kitty raw after going through my grinding experience tonight. Is all food out there junk besides raw? The way everyone makes it seem online is that its either raw or you are doing a dis-service to your cat. I just am not sure I can handle this over the long haul. It was utterly disgusting and a mess and I hated it so much that I want to explore other options. I know I can BUY raw online so that may be an option but I want to see what the best non-raw options out there are.
What brands and types do you recommend that aren't raw?
There is so much confusion out there about pet foods, it's a subject a lot of us are struggling with , and others have very strong opinions that can be quite different from each other. I myself feed half Evo dry and half Fancy Feast Classics (classics are much healthier than other FF products), because my cats won't touch any of the premium brands of canned foods. When I started feeding half canned, although it was a supermarket brand I could see an immediate difference for the better in my cats' coat, eyes, etc.
Here is an interesting webpage, that also links to other good sources of info. Find out all you can and then use your own best judgement.
No need to overdo it. There are some serious raw adherents here and elsewhere, this is true. But you can only do what you can do. I'm not doing raw from scratch. That's just not something I'm willing to take on. Does that mean I'm doing a huge disservice to my cat? Oh, I'm sure some may think so, but I think there are far worse things some do (perhaps some of the same people even).
So, where to start? There are lots of options. You can do a commercial raw, typically sold frozen. Primal is one brand that's fairly easy to find. There are several others. Nature's Variety, FWIW, had a recall on the raw at one point. There are even some much more natural seeming raw preparations that you can mail order. Some is even prey-appropriate (people get whole mice for example) or otherwise "frankenprey" (prey animals but ground up). Personal experience is I bought a Primal starter pack once, cat wasn't interested, although I didn't get any mixing going so I should perhaps try again (but still haven't, although I've mentioned it several times on here ).
Wysong makes some products that are heated no higher than I think it's 118 degrees. They consider this to be raw equivalent. They are freeze dried after that. I've just been trying a couple of these. The product called UnCanny is meant to be mixed with water, and I could tell after mixing it for the first time that this wasn't going to be appealing to Amber. Oh well. She does like the Dream Treats, which are processed the same way and freeze dried, very good. The treat I bought to try is made with pheasant! And Archetype, this freeze-driend food can be served dry. That went over really well, so we'll probably use it some in rotation or really more as a treat or addition to regular.
Beyond that, you have quality grain-free cans. These are cooked, of course, and what you're looking for is quality ingredients and like the other commercial stuff quality, safe manufacturing. Weruva is a good brand. I'm also using Fussie Cat and sometimes Tiki Cat, and Soulistic which is exclusive to Petco. Weruva and Soulistic are made in the same plant. If you want to go digging you might find Addiction which is an Australian brand. (I've mostly not bothered because Amber won't eat this pate-style food.) There are some others, too, that may be fine but I avoid because of the food texture. Amber only eats canned food that's chunky, and the ones I listed fit the bill.
With any of these you probably don't want to make tuna or other large fish too much of the diet, or fish at all. You can check on Seafood Watch to see which fish is a problem with mercury. It's tuna and I think swordfish and a couple others. But you can find a few seafood-based cans that don't have these. Not that this should matter for you; with any luck your cat will not have a big problem, but mine is none too interested in eating cans that only have land-based meats. So I went through a phase of looking for cans that had more desirable fish in it. Tiki Cat makes one that's all sardines, for example, and one Weruva seafood variety does not have any of the bad fish in it. You can at times get fairly prey-appropriate even. Some examples I know of are the aforementioned pheasant from Wysong and rabbit from Addiction. Getting hung up on these is, IMO, a bit of overkill, but they are out there. Addiction also makes food from an unusual source known as brushtail. This is an Australian possum of sorts, probably too big to truly be cat prey, but still an additional choice compared to the usual.
BTW, there is generally, as far as I can tell these days, no particular reason to introduce dry food apart from your own convenience. But if you need to for some reason, look first to Wysong's Epigen 90. It's not just grain free but starch-free and 90 percent meat. It's still a compromise, even they say this. I still have dry food in the mix because my cat grew up on dry food and while I have done well in recent months at having her stop eating it, right now it's more important that she eats enough and keeps her weight up.
Do what you can do and don't worry about it. Enjoy your kitty.
Very good info from Greg. I too feed half dry because my cats haven't been able to transition toall wet. I do think it's a good idea to feed something from more than one company in case one is missing something unknown nutritionally.
Cost may be a consideration for you too. I spend much more feeding 2 cats than I do my 2 55 lb dogs. And The Fancy Feast, cheaper than the premium brands, costs more than the premium kibble portion of their diet by far.
I also feed half dry. I only recently transitioned to wet food (after a long debate here on C-D about ash content in wet cat food), which is sold by a high-grade brand and which my cat seems to like. But before then, she was fed a mainstream (ProPlan) dry food and was just fine. I switched b/c the ingredients on some of the mainstream labels are just crap and I couldn't bear the idea of her eating it anymore. I have noticed a change in her behavior since switching her (she is more cuddly now, seems happier) but it wasn't as if she were ill or suffering on the other stuff. However, I do think that, in terms of longevity and trying to avoid a problem that will manifest when she is older, the higher grade cat food is a better choice.
However, even though she likes it, she doesn't seem to want to eat the wet food all of the time, probably b/c she has grown up on dry. I give her some wet in the mornings and the evenings--she meows for it in the morning and won't even touch the dry that I leave out for her--but then leave out some dry in the event that she is hungry. I am sure that there are some who don't like the idea of free-feeding and will say that she doesn't want the wet b/c I leave out the dry, but I like it that way b/c it means that my cat is not dependant on me for food and can eat according to her own needs; she always has something to eat if/when she is hungry. If/when she is ready to transition to an all wet diet, she will tell me. Transitioning always takes a while.
I feed my cat Blue Buffalo Wilderness grain-free dry and wet. I would recommend it but I have never fed it to kittens. They have a new kitten formula for their Wilderness line but, again, I have never used it:
Whatever you do, I would feed a food specifically designed for kittens and read the label; the above link has some tips on how to read labels. And remember to transition her from whatever the shelter is feeding, otherwise you will give her an upset tummy/the runs.
Feeding raw is ideal but if it isn't a necessity, then I wouldn't feel so badly about not being able to do it. There are some on here who have to feed raw b/c of food allergies and/or other health-related issues.
If you don't want to feed raw that you make yourself, you next best option is to feed raw that you buy. I would not go a big commercial processed brand like Natures Variety. Go with a smaller more controlled company. If you choose to stay away from raw completely then I would at the very least stay away from kibble.
Raw can be a bit of an undertaking. I'm finding out as I am a recent convert. There is a WEALTH of information online. DM me as I'd be HAPPY to share links etc that I have found. Books etc that are great as well. Don't go jumping in too fast - it's a sure fire way to end up feeling as you are now.
My suggestion is to go part canned and part bought raw until you figure out what you are doing! Then go part bought and part DIY raw. Then you can always do part canned or part bought to part DIY raw. It's good to give cats variety to keep them from getting picky which is why some raw feeders still give their cats some canned each week. This way they don't have cats that will completely turn their noses up at it.
The Bravo and Oma's is okay as far as a commercial product. I decided to go with a small company called Blue Ridge Beef. I got a complete mix that I do not have to supplement for not during my transition period. They seemed really great and A LOT of raw feeders on my Yahoo boards use them. Also Hare Today sells a great product already ground or you can grind yourself.
Nutrition this is a great site, and join some yahoo groups as well. Take is slow so you don't get frustrated, like anything else if you go in all at once you'll get overwhelmed and give up. It's a marathon not a sprint.
Although you asked for alternatives to Raw, there are still raw options that offer an alternative to grinding and preparing your cats food personally.
But first I'd like to say "Thank You" for becoming the real life test subject for those of us new to Raw, and for sharing your experiences.
I know Kittymom4 has been researching Raw feeding extensively and is extremely thorough.
She is also very vigilante, about a products current ownership and practices.
They are not allowed to rest on their past reputation.
She had looked into Honest Kitchen, at my request, for protein vs carbs and fat ratio, and as I recall the carbs were higher than I had hoped.
I haven't a clue, at this point in my education, how to calculate any nutritional values.
[ Does anyone know how to calculate protein, according to source, animal vs vegetable/grain?] Another thread? perhaps.
Honest Kitchen has such an ethical approach and transparent business model that I will continue to check back with them.
TruthAboutPetFoods, just recently, interviewed this company, Rawhealth
The interview is a starting point for further research, no conclusions or recommendations offered.
I would not feel comfortable feeding Natures Variety. They are now an "investment" of Catterton Partners the same company that invested in Wellness, and helped it become the company that it is today.
The ENTIRE Catterton Partners website provides insight into mindset, intent, and other pet related industries they are involved in.
I contacted Natures Variety over a month ago when I made the connection,
Dear
Thank you for e-mailing! In June 2008, Catterton Partners did invest in Nature’s Variety. While they do own a majority now, we can assure you that nothing in quality or production has changed. Nature’s Variety has experienced tremendous growth over the last few years with the increased popularity of our diets and products. Overall, this was a great opportunity for Nature’s Variety to explore new products and increase our availability of the products to more retailers, while maintaining the same quality standards and holistic approach we are known for.
Nature's Variety has been selling products to veterinarian offices since day one, but we do not have a relationship with Pethealth or the American Animal Hospital Association.
Sincerely,
Shannon
Customer Service
Nature's Variety
1-888-519-7387 Nature's Variety
I am having doubts about feeding my new kitty raw after going through my grinding experience tonight. Is all food out there junk besides raw? The way everyone makes it seem online is that its either raw or you are doing a dis-service to your cat. I just am not sure I can handle this over the long haul. It was utterly disgusting and a mess and I hated it so much that I want to explore other options. I know I can BUY raw online so that may be an option but I want to see what the best non-raw options out there are.
What brands and types do you recommend that aren't raw?
-Discouraged Zenmaster
My cats really don't like raw food much. A lot of it goes to waste. At this point we're feeding them canned Purina Friskies. They get canned twice a day and a dry kibble at night now. That kibble, more of a treat or midnight snack, is usually Wellness or one of the more expensive brands. But they're not crazy for the high priced brands. They would much rather have Purina Kitten Chow. And the kitten Chow smells so much better than the expensive kibble. They trample each other for it. Go figure. They get raw meat a few times a week but as time passes they're leaving more of it in the bowls.
We tried several of the more expensive canned foods but saw little actual difference. They're all compressed meats made like Spam, then shredded or cut into squares. Some add vegetables to make them look more appealing. Years ago you could actually see the chunks of meat and fish in the cans. Look close! You'll see even the expensive ones are not real chunks of meat.
So far our cats are thriving and their teeth are still as clean as when they erupted.
I like Honest Kitchen also, but the siamese would not touch it. Finally got her off the friskies wet and onto Wellness pouches and kibble. She ate those for years and did great, but still got her "junk" treats like Temptations.
I HIGHLY suggest you read this article. Even if you think you know it all - it's a good read. It will answer some questions. And it does have handy the Dry Matter Basis calculation (DMB) for comparing wet and dry kibble which is KEY if you want to compare foods! It looks very complicated but trust me, it's not hard! I'm a math idiot and I can do it! So you'll learn how to figure carbs when they are NOT on a label too, which is essential and many people don't know how to do.
This is one of the few people out there that I actually trust their info. To many "self proclaimed" experts - but her info is solid IMHO.
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There are some serious raw adherents here and elsewhere, this is true. But you can only do what you can do. I'm not doing raw from scratch. That's just not something I'm willing to take on. Does that mean I'm doing a huge disservice to my cat? Oh, I'm sure some may think so, but I think there are far worse things some do (perhaps some of the same people even).
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