Coronavirus (designs, flood, panel)

[tikkasf]

Originally Posted by evening sun

https://krcrtv.com/news/local/six-no...-let-us-reopen

I would like to reopen, we have very low rates.

I think it makes sense for these counties to start reopening. I assume you are located in one of these counties. My area though, may need to take a more cautious approach in the reopen process and that seems to be what is going to happen here. Construction jobs will be allowed to start back up this coming Monday, as will outdoor business like nurseries & landscaping will reopen.

[JGC97]

Originally Posted by CA4Now

Started a few pages back by someone who posted about deer. Maybe h/she could start a "I'm bored so let's talk about what I eat for dinner" thread.

We already have one here:
https://www.city-data.com/forum/food...0-edition.html

[evening sun]

Originally Posted by tikkasf

I think it makes sense for these counties to start reopening. I assume you are located in one of these counties. My area though, may need to take a more cautious approach in the reopen process and that seems to be what is going to happen here. Construction jobs will be allowed to start back up this coming Monday, as will outdoor business like nurseries & landscaping will reopen.

Yes, I live in Butte county, the infection rate is low & has not gone up in a while. I think 16 cases in my county, total. I do worry about people coming up from Sacramento or San Francisco, if we open up before they do.
There is no easy answer, that's for sure.

[landlock]

Originally Posted by evening sun

Yes, I live in Butte county, the infection rate is low & has not gone up in a while. I think 16 cases in my county, total. I do worry about people coming up from Sacramento or San Francisco, if we open up before they do.
There is no easy answer, that's for sure.

There's no easy answer, this is true. And people from SF, Sacramento will come up, and are actually coming up right now, had been coming up earlier, and it will continue. Sacramento and SF will open up with the virus still in the population and infection rate heading up to 60-70% everywhere, they say, but via flatter curve. One can't physically shut off Sacramento, as was suggested in another thread: isn't going to happen.

COVID isn't going anywhere any time soon, until at least working vaccine is developed. And just like the flu virus, it can keep coming back in new, mutated form every season. Flu vaccine only "kind of" works for each particular strain, but doesn't work much for new strains that show up with every new year and they have to create new flu vaccines all the time. I can see shutdowns continuing for one more incubation period (14 days), but not much more. So I think it'll be about everyone taking precautions, wearing a mask, distancing as much as possible, sanitizing/washing hands and items, and it'll be one's responsibility to avoid infection this way.

[landlock]

I had watched that infamous video of 2 California doctors, which youtube had banned (but it's back up).
A lot of pseudo-scientific blubber.
I'm a little surprised that there's no articulate well-publicized debunking response from actual immunologist such as Fauci, to this date. These are two urgent care doctors from Bakersfield (and their location tells these guys could't be smart enough to live outside heavily polluted area)

I can tell where I see the major flaw in the their "logic".
First, they claim that isolation/social distancing/not being in public places are bad because even over a short time, one's immune system degrades, due to not being exposed to pathogens that keep training it (and I think they meant exposure to covid as well). I'd like to hear immunologist's response to this.

Then they claim that some virus gets brought into the homes, where it lives for 3 days - on plastic bags, wraps, packaging, bottles, etc. This seems to be true.

And their next, false, claim is that masks aren't necessary because they get the virus on the outside surface of the mask, and then it can get transferred to the mouth/nose/eyes through hands, after touching the mask, removing it.

This is where their argument falls apart completely.
First off, as they claim they "studied immunology on their own" - they surely must be aware of what is "infectious dose". Infectious dose is how much virus gets into the body from outside, and it can determine if a person can fight it off immediately and not get infected, or, if gets infected, it can determine severity of the illness. As more virus received = more virus to reproduce and create bigger viral load.

So, imagine someone touching the outside of the mask. A mask is made of fibers, even N95 products, and virus tends to sink into these porous fibers and sort of dissipates in them; there's not a lot of virus that sits on the top surface. Once someone gets a little bit of this virus on their fingers from that, a very small dose, and touches their mouth, etc, they're going to get a tiny infectious dose of the virus. Now compare this with someone coughing nearby (or much worse, sneezeing) - this produces enormous quantities of the virus, sitting in aerosol droplets - and this huge infectious dose can be inhaled or goes into the eyes. This means getting very large infectious dose - which is much, much worse than some tiny, negligent dose one could accidentally get by touching the outside of the mask and then the mouth.

And then, even their own argument of "training immune system" works against what they said - if getting tiny doses of the virus is good for preparing immune system to defend against the disease - then even touching the mask and getting that tiny dose must be a good thing, according to their own reasoning. Versus being blasted with huge dose from someone's unprotected mouth into your unprotected mouth/nose.
Their argument is complete BS.

And let me tell you...if a doctor lives in Bakersfield area, which is very detrimental to health, especially respiratory health...they better not issue any opinions on respiratory illness matters. These are the same kind of typical urgent care quacks that tell people with asthma, etc that it's safe to live in the Valley or LA.

[tikkasf]

Originally Posted by evening sun

Yes, I live in Butte county, the infection rate is low & has not gone up in a while. I think 16 cases in my county, total. I do worry about people coming up from Sacramento or San Francisco, if we open up before they do.
There is no easy answer, that's for sure.

That is a understandable concern. I can't speak for anyone else....but, I would not be coming from my area (Bay Area) to your county even if I wanted to for some recreational reason and if I had a job that had me coming to your county (such as making a delivery) I would be considerate and take precautions.

[evening sun]

Originally Posted by tikkasf

That is a understandable concern. I can't speak for anyone else....but, I would not be coming from my area (Bay Area) to your county even if I wanted to for some recreational reason and if I had a job that had me coming to your county (such as making a delivery) I would be considerate and take precautions.

Thank you, I wish everyone was as considerate & kind as you. I have a friend from SF who wants to come visit, ( we used to live there) & I am holding off as long as possible.

[landlock]

One good that I can see coming out of this COVID thing is ending "open workspaces" that were replacing cubicles in the last decade. Good riddance. And much more work from home from now on.

[looker009]

Originally Posted by landlock

One good that I can see coming out of this COVID thing is ending "open workspaces" that were replacing cubicles in the last decade. Good riddance. And much more work from home from now on.

I am not seeing working from home happening as much as you think. Business want to people to be in the offices so they can be supervised. Also open workspace is much better compare to cubicles.

[landlock]

Originally Posted by looker009

I am not seeing working from home happening as much as you think. Business want to people to be in the offices so they can be supervised. Also open workspace is much better compare to cubicles.

They can "want" but people won't be back to those hellholes. Office isn't a chicken farm.
And it's 21st century: time to work from home.
Employers can shove it. Will be sued for reckless endangerment otherwise, for causing infection, also, and workers comps claims.
Open workspaces, where everyone can cough and spit on each other, not to mention noise and lack of privacy and personal space, distraction, are gone forever.
I worked from home for many years, by the way, and wouldn't do it any other way.

The moment I saw this new idiotic crap (open workspaces) coming, invented by greedy corp and millenial HR idiots, I told the employer to either shove it up and drop or let me work from home, and they did, ever since. Everyone else should and can do the same. But I'm an engineer and not a factory worker.
Even physical job workers will be having shields from now on.