Orlando developer to buy former GM plant in Doraville (Atlanta: move, residential)

[bu2]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Good responses from the developer. Seems odd that the DeKalb Superintendent won't even let it go up for a vote by the school board or try to openly negotiate something. Maybe he is hoping for a kickback.

Viewpoint: GM plant project is an economic development issue for the city, county and region

Or maybe he is doing his job.

And I haven't heard any support for it from the school board. They are doing their jobs, not speculating in real estate.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Good responses from the developer. Seems odd that the DeKalb Superintendent won't even let it go up for a vote by the school board or try to openly negotiate something. Maybe he is hoping for a kickback.

Viewpoint: GM plant project is an economic development issue for the city, county and region

The developer is the one trying to get a kickback.

[lastminutemom]

Originally Posted by bu2

See post #43 from Wasel.

Any tax on increase in value over the life of the TAD goes to the developer to defray his development costs. That property will increase in value without the school tax abatement so it does take money away from schools to support a speculative real estate development.

With the tax abatement, the development will probably happen quicker and more development may occur. But the school district will see zero benefit for 25 to 30 years.

This is a really unique, valuable property. Opportunities like this for developers are very rare. It will get developed. It just won't be quite as profitable if our schools don't pay for the roads and sewers.

Originally Posted by bu2

Or maybe he is doing his job.

And I haven't heard any support for it from the school board. They are doing their jobs, not speculating in real estate.

And it likely will have an impact on schools, if any housing is included in the project. Even if all the project does is improve the surrounding area which, in turns, attracts young families to the area, who have kids that eventually go to public school.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by bu2

Since something (maybe not as much and maybe not as quickly) would be built there anyways, they DO get less taxes.

You are playing with hypotheticals. For sure in the long run a TAD will bring in more money since the TAD will expire then schools get all the additional revenue. And not even today in the case of the Beltline TAD. APS is getting paid more money from the Beltline TAD than they would have if the TAD was never created.

Do you really think the Beltline TAD and Atlantic Station TAD have been a bad thing and should have never been created?

[bu2]

Originally Posted by jsvh

You are playing with hypotheticals. For sure in the long run a TAD will bring in more money since the TAD will expire then schools get all the additional revenue. And not even today in the case of the Beltline TAD. APS is getting paid more money from the Beltline TAD than they would have if the TAD was never created.

Do you really think the Beltline TAD and Atlantic Station TAD have been a bad thing and should have never been created?

You are the one playing hypotheticals. There is a very good chance the area would look exactly the same 30 years from now with or without a TAD.

I think APS had no business getting involved in the Beltline TAD. And they didn't give everything away but negotiated a fixed increase, although Reed tried to steal that money but finally had to give in.

Atlantic Station was a little different being a brownfield. But, no I don't think APS should have been involved there either.

I'm not objecting to county and city governments doing TADs, only schools. Counties and cities are in the economic development business. I do think they are too quick to give away tax $-See Mayor Reed and the Falcons, Tim Lee and the Braves.

[jsvh]

Analysis: GM redevelopment would help reverse DeKalb’s rapidly declining tax base

Schools will be getting more money under the TAD than they are today:

In its analysis, Bleakly said the Doraville TAD has an assessed value of $40 million. DeKalb Schools get $358,000 per year in property taxes from the former plant and will continue to get these taxes every year under the TAD. At build-out, the redevelopment will represent an investment of nearly $2 billion and would increase the tax value (assessed) of the site by $750 million —an 18 times increase in value, according to Bleakly Advisory.

DeKalb County Schools will get $135 million in additional tax revenues from the development while the TAD is in effect, Bleakly Advisory said. When completed, DeKalb County Schools will receive $17 million annually property taxes from the development—47 times more than it receives currently from the site.
“This is a wonderful deal for the DeKalb County Schools and will help reverse the long range trend of a declining county tax base,” Bleakly Advisory said in a statement.

Originally Posted by bu2

You are the one playing hypotheticals. There is a very good chance the area would look exactly the same 30 years from now with or without a TAD.

You think if the TAD is approved the development won't happen? This project getting built if the TAD passes is not really a hypothetical. The TAD will probably be conditioned on it being built.

Your projections of development happening regardless are the only hypothetical here. That is far from a given. You think 30363 would be a "top ten boom town in the country" if the Atlantic station TAD never existed? It is probably more likely it will end up just like the GM Lakewood plant that has been a blank slab for 26 years now? Maybe it will be better if this Doraville TAD doesn't pass. The developer could relocate this project there and let the Doraville plant sit empty for a few decades. There is already a lot of movie studio development going on around Lakewood.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Analysis: GM redevelopment would help reverse DeKalb’s rapidly declining tax base

Schools will be getting more money under the TAD than they are today:







You think if the TAD is approved the development won't happen? This project getting built if the TAD passes is not really a hypothetical. The TAD will probably be conditioned on it being built.

Your projections of development happening regardless are the only hypothetical here. That is far from a given. You think 30363 would be a "top ten boom town in the country" if the Atlantic station TAD never existed? It is probably more likely it will end up just like the GM Lakewood plant that has been a blank slab for 26 years now? Maybe it will be better if this Doraville TAD doesn't pass. The developer could relocate this project there and let the Doraville plant sit empty for a few decades. There is already a lot of movie studio development going on around Lakewood.

This is right next to a MARTA station, I-285, I-85 and adjacent to Gwinnett County. There is no better big development site in the whole metro.

It will get developed with or without a TAD. The TAD just makes it go quicker and makes it more profitable.

It isn't clear how the district gets more taxes during the TAD from the article. Sounds like the developer's consultant is hypothetically increasing other property values in the area. Snake oil salesmen.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by bu2

This is right next to a MARTA station, I-285, I-85 and adjacent to Gwinnett County. There is no better big development site in the whole metro.

It will get developed with or without a TAD. The TAD just makes it go quicker and makes it more profitable.

It isn't clear how the district gets more taxes during the TAD from the article. Sounds like the developer's consultant is hypothetically increasing other property values in the area. Snake oil salesmen.

But it's not connected to MARTA or anything else on the other side of the tracks. That is the problem. It requires an additional infrastructure investment off the property.

Considering the Beltline TAD brought APS more money than it would have otherwise it is not hard to imagine the options that could do the same here. Even if it is not an agreement, do you not think a higher use of this site will not increase the tax base of surrounding non-TAD parcels?

I could think of many large development sites with more potential in the metro. Including the Gulch, large tracts near the airport (look at what is already going on at Porsche site), and large industrial site right along the Chattahoochee.

But that's OK. If they are luck the site will make a great set of Used Car Dealerships and keep DeKalb along their same path of circling the drain. Meanwhile there are still plenty of great sites in the city for major developments that these developers can relocate to.

[cqholt]

Originally Posted by jsvh

But it's not connected to MARTA or anything else on the other side of the tracks. That is the problem. It requires an additional infrastructure investment off the property.

Considering the Beltline TAD brought APS more money than it would have otherwise it is not hard to imagine the options that could do the same here. Even if it is not an agreement, do you not think a higher use of this site will not increase the tax base of surrounding non-TAD parcels?

I could think of many large development sites with more potential in the metro. Including the Gulch, large tracts near the airport (look at what is already going on at Porsche site), and large industrial site right along the Chattahoochee.

But that's OK. If they are luck the site will make a great set of Used Car Dealerships and keep DeKalb along their same path of circling the drain. Meanwhile there are still plenty of great sites in the city for major developments that these developers can relocate to.

It is connected via Motors Industrial Way and a set of stairs next to the tracks.
https://www.google.com/maps/@33.9043...2616,18z?hl=en
https://www.google.com/maps/@33.9046...2!8i6656?hl=en

[bu2]

Originally Posted by jsvh

But it's not connected to MARTA or anything else on the other side of the tracks. That is the problem. It requires an additional infrastructure investment off the property.

Considering the Beltline TAD brought APS more money than it would have otherwise it is not hard to imagine the options that could do the same here. Even if it is not an agreement, do you not think a higher use of this site will not increase the tax base of surrounding non-TAD parcels?

I could think of many large development sites with more potential in the metro. Including the Gulch, large tracts near the airport (look at what is already going on at Porsche site), and large industrial site right along the Chattahoochee.

But that's OK. If they are luck the site will make a great set of Used Car Dealerships and keep DeKalb along their same path of circling the drain. Meanwhile there are still plenty of great sites in the city for major developments that these developers can relocate to.

None of those are anywhere near as good as this site.

Doraville or the county could build any of those things if they wanted or make a deal with the developer to partly fund them in addition to the tax abatements.

They simply don't need the money from the schools.

And I read today's AJC article. That extra tax money is hypothetical. It assumes the surrounding area goes up in value. They misleadingly state it as a fact and imply that they would pay it.

The developer is from Atlanta. His buddies are trying to give him money. The school board is standing up.