Wesleyan vs. Holy Innocents Episcopal School (Atlanta, Sandy Springs: spring break, credit, house)
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Does anyone have any information about either of these schools, good and/or bad? Which one has better academics or are they about the same? What are the families like?
Crucial question: how religious are you? Do you consider yourself to be an evangelical Christian? If not, Wesleyan may not be the right place. If so, you might prefer it. I would say that both are very good academically and have "good" families, but that is one major distinguishing feature. Holy Innocents' is also church-affiliated, but I don't think religion is quite as front and center as it is at Wesleyan.
We could go either way on the religion end. Just trying to figure out if one of these schools has a more rigorous academic program vs. the other. Thanks for responding.
Well, I know Wesleyan very well -- from Sandy Springs to Norcross, for 15 years. :-) Honestly, I am not the evangelical sort, but I felt completely comfortable there, and my kids did very well both there and in college (both went to top 20 nationally ranked schools, one on full academic scholarship and another on a generous partial academic scholarship.) Yes, it is Christian, but I did not find Friday chapel, prayers before sporting events and a yearly Bible class to be oppressively evangelical, and I was happy with the strong value-centered ethos that is reflected in all activities. It was small enough for the kids to be able to take part in a wide variety of activities, and it has been interesting to watch it grow from an expensive trailer park to the lovely campus and programs that it has today. Yes, it has a strong athletic program, but the arts programs is catching up quickly. Academically, I don't know how to compare it to Holy Innocents. One of my children found the limitation on the number of AP classes they could take to be annoying, yet that one did manage to enter college with 46 hours of AP college credit, so in retrospect, I don't think it hurt them. :-) They now also have the AP Capstone program, which is new since mine graduated. A semester-long Bible class is required for each grade in high school, which opens up the opportunity to take a different semester class, such as web design, etc. the other semester. I did find the college counseling to be extremely good, and both of my kids have developed personal relationships with some teachers since graduation. I was also impressed with how proactive the teachers were in the elementary program when it came to dealing with students of widely varying abilities -- for one small group of kids who were particularly proficient in math in first grade, they created a separate little math class that threw as much at them as they could handle. I always felt as if my children's best interests were front and center. Sure, there were a few small bumps in the road, but overall, it was an extremely positive educational experience for our family. Another comment: my kids felt perfectly safe at all times on campus. The parents would often roll their eyes and say, "Wait until you get to college, you won't be leaving your backpack/jacket/pocketbook/laptop/etc. on the bench on the quad there!" I've heard it called "the Wesleyan bubble," but there is a warm sense of comfort and security there. One child didn't participate in the yearly international mission trips that are popular spring break pastimes. My other child found their passion working with special needs children on mission trips in the Ukraine and Romania that stayed with them through college and into their career choice.
I found the vast majority of the families to be very pleasant and friendly. I didn't take part in parent prayer groups, etc., but stayed busy with other volunteer projects at the school. There is some serious money floating around that school, but for the most part, it wasn't flaunted. We certainly weren't in the top half of the income curve there. :-) I am still in touch with several of the families, even after our kids have scattered around the world on different work and education goals. I have to admit, I was intrigued with the different paths the kids followed -- one group of friends are in med school, law school, working for an international tech company abroad, starting their own business and working in D.C. on Capitol Hill.
We had also applied to Holy Innocents 'back in the day', for kindergarten, and I remember my eldest child's interview vividly. We were a few minutes late due to an accident in Sandy Springs (mistake one, rushed), and we had raced over there after picking up my child from pre-school (mistake two, tired and cranky, even with a sandwich and drink in the car.) The interview did not go well, as my child wasn't in the mood to sit down and do worksheets, and the interviewer basically told me that it wasn't a good fit (didn't even wait for the rejection letter :-), and said, "Well, you have to understand, we are very academically-oriented, so our kindergarten is more like a first grade, and the children are expected to be able to stay in their seat." Now, this was a long time ago, but that comment always stuck with me -- because I felt that, developmentally, kindergartners were NOT first graders, and needed much more active, experiential learning. So she was right -- it wasn't a good fit for us. :-) I never felt that either HI or Wesleyan was skewed "better" academically - the classes and course offerings seem to be similar, with a few differences here and there. HI's facilities and campus are not as comprehensive as Wesleyan's -- for example, Wesleyan has it's own natatorium, whereas HI doesn't, and I don't think HI has a tennis facility. HI's campus is split by Mount Vernon Hwy, with some playing fields and gyms across the street from the main building, and while it is said to be 49 acres, a portion of that is taken up by Holy Innocents Episcopal Church.
GreatSchools.org has both schools rated as 4-star, with Wesleyan being a tiny bit more diverse than HI.
Really, though -- after two kids with very different academic styles, I have to say that I think most kids will bloom where they are planted. Either school would provide an excellent education. If one is more convenient than the other, I'd probably be tempted to aim at that one, just to lessen the 15-year commute. :-)
I can't thank you enough for responding in such detail. We live in Sandy Springs and we are really taken with Wesleyan, but we are wary of the commute. Did you feel like your children spent most of their free time in Norcross for playdates/birthdays/and eventually "hanging out" as a teenager? HIES is practically in our backyard but I am feeling drawn to Wesleyan. I do not feel like Wesleyan is over the top religious as others have posted, and quite frankly I'd rather a strong Christian value system be taught than nothing at all. Plus I like knowing that all of the faculty are Christian. I have heard that HIES' academics are on the softer side and I would rather make a commute knowing that there is purpose behind that. If Wesleyan was inside the perimeter, I think it would be a no brainer. It's just justifying this commute in my head. I know my child would thrive at either school, just trying to figure out the best possible fit.
(I wonder if Dblack's children started at Wesleyan when it was in Sandy Springs?)
Most kids that I know who go to Wesleyan live in the Northeast part of the metro, Norcross, Dunwoody, Duluth, Johns Creek, etc. It may be worth it for you to ask a friend (if you have any) who go there to take a quick look at the directory to see what kind of geographic diversity there is. It isn't just about where your child will spend most of the time, but if you are the outlier in terms of geography, it may be hard for your child to get playdates etc at your house.
(We have friends from a fairly close in northern suburb who have complained bitterly that the Buckhead families won't drive their child to their house for playdates.) We sent a child 30 minutes away to a private school where most of the kids came from points north and we were south. It wasn't easy.
I have never heard that about Holy Innocents academics and would have thought that Wesleyan and HI were academic peers. I will say, as indicated by dblack's reflections, that the AP thing at Wesleyan bothers some kids. In fact, my oldest who graduated from public school, had several classmates who had left Wesleyan because of that.
Please also realize that the "culture" at Wesleyan has evolved in the past five years or so (possibly after dblack was there). There will be a new Head of School next year, so it's possible that things could evolve again.
I can speak from some experience re: going to school in a different area from where you live (we live in the Dunwoody Panhandle and my kids are at one of the "Buckhead" privates). It is a challenge re: playdates, sleepovers, etc... We really are not in a situation where after-school, weekday playdates are possible due to the commute, but my kids have activities almost every day, so we probably wouldn't be doing that regardless of commute. One thing that they do miss out on is the "Buckhead camaraderie" (e.g. seeing kids from school at the ball park-we go to SSYS instead of NYO, for example). But the kids have friends from school and neighborhood/community friends, so I really don't see that as a big problem. Then again, though, my kids are still in elementary school so they like their friends, but friends are not their "be all, end all" priority right now.
I can't thank you enough for responding in such detail. We live in Sandy Springs and we are really taken with Wesleyan, but we are wary of the commute. Did you feel like your children spent most of their free time in Norcross for playdates/birthdays/and eventually "hanging out" as a teenager? HIES is practically in our backyard but I am feeling drawn to Wesleyan. I do not feel like Wesleyan is over the top religious as others have posted, and quite frankly I'd rather a strong Christian value system be taught than nothing at all. Plus I like knowing that all of the faculty are Christian. I have heard that HIES' academics are on the softer side and I would rather make a commute knowing that there is purpose behind that. If Wesleyan was inside the perimeter, I think it would be a no brainer. It's just justifying this commute in my head. I know my child would thrive at either school, just trying to figure out the best possible fit.
Well, I didn't notice a lack of friends. Keep in mind, too, that many of the kids are in outside activities that somewhat limit their "playdate" time -- one of my kids played club soccer year-round, did Scouts and fenced; the other one was in dance and Scouts. Most of the other kids were like that, too, until middle school, when team sports became popular at school. My kids had friends from school, they had friends from their activities, they had friends from their neighborhood on summer swim leagues and they had friends from church -- and I think it was good for them to have friends from different circles.
Yes, we started while in Sandy Springs, and made the move with them to Norcross. From Dunwoody/Sandy Springs, we found the commute fine going over against traffic, but a little tiresome going back. I'd usually meet a couple of other moms for coffee and we'd wait out the traffic for a bit, or I'd schedule volunteer work early in the day. However, there are lots and lots of carpools, not to mention the buses, so you wouldn't be going back and forth every day unless you wanted to. As they got older, my kids had friends all over. They learned to drive and got their license right at 16, so at that point, they drove themselves to school. My son's best friend lived in one of the gated communities up and down Medlock Bridge, and he ended up with his own gate pass for several years :-) He had an interesting circle of friends, and the parents shared my own family's values -- no drinking, etc. -- so I never worried about them hanging out, because I knew they had a eye on them. A couple of them were actually stricter than me (much to my kid's surprise, they didn't think anyone was stricter than me!) Not too many came in our direction, because we were usually over there, anyway.
Re: the AP thing. To be honest, I considered transferring my eldest in sixth grade, because I was wary about the limitation on AP classes. In retrospect, it wasn't a big deal, and we chose to stay at Wesleyan even with offers from Westminster and Pace (partly because the different commutes for both kids would have been killers.) It turned out to be the right decision for us. It didn't hurt them academically, and they ended up with all "5"s on all their AP exams, which maxed out their advanced placement in their colleges. My eldest was able to do a triple-major in college because of the early access to upper level classes. (I guess it would have been possible to graduate 18 months earlier, but they were having too much fun. :-) Plus, Wesleyan will allow students with the inclination to take an AP exam after a course of assisted self-study, so if they are truly intent on gathering as many AP exams as possible, they can certainly go above and beyond.
I agree with the other commenters, the two big factors setting Wesleyan apart are its location and geographic pull from the Northeastern suburbs and its Christian, more conservative culture.
HIES pulls more from Buckhead and Sandy Springs. Its school culture is known to be more social and clubby, similar to Lovett in that regard.
Have you visited Mount Vernon Presbyterian School? It's school culture places Christian faith more at the forefront than does HIES, and it is closer to you.
In the end, I also agree that the school's proximity to your home is crucial.
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