Were things in the past really that bad for women? (alcohol, federal)
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Not happening today. Complete myth. Wage gap has been debunked a thousand times.
In fact women in STEM positions are more likely to be hired then men today. More women in college. More women on medical school.
No wage gap. Same education, same years of experience, same salary range. Been proved over and over again. Jobs have salary ranges per position and HR manages it. HR is generally run by women. Women can negotiate within that range just like men.
People need to learn not to believe everything they read and do their own research away from talking points.
I'll just call it "B&B" from here on out...bluff and bluster with nothing to back it up...once more from NTV to you.
Women have always worked if they wished. Few wished it, however.
Birth control has been available for over two thousand years.
Women had bank accounts, real estate, and securities. They have owned businesses of their own for centuries.
Women have voted for over a hundred years in all elections and from colonial days in some elections.
This is the goofiest of the bunch.
My great grandmother was born in 1899 and was NOT allowed to work. She did not have access to ANY kind of birth control. She was FORCED to have sex whenever my great grandfather demanded it. She had 6 children that she struggled to feed. She and the kids would go hungry while he stuffed his face. He beat her regularly. What was she to do? Where was she to go? Who would take care of her children? There were NOT social services to help back then.
She was not allowed to open a bank account. The banks would NOT open one for her. She was NOT allowed to own real estate. It was actually against the law!
And what were these businesses you speak of?
Women have only been able to vote since 1920....they fought for YEARS to get that right! Many women DIED for that right! Please open a history book not written by the National Enquirer.
Not happening today. Complete myth. Wage gap has been debunked a thousand times.
In fact women in STEM positions are more likely to be hired then men today. More women in college. More women on medical school.
No wage gap. Same education, same years of experience, same salary range. Been proved over and over again. Jobs have salary ranges per position and HR manages it. HR is generally run by women. Women can negotiate within that range just like men.
People need to learn not to believe everything they read and do their own research away from talking points.
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtovenice
Study history. REAL history. Not the watered down crap that is peddled in schools today.
The Suffrage movement was sending out questionnaires by mail to get interest from women. Barely any responded. Because women at that time were NOT interested in voting. They didn't want to serve in the military which was directly tied to voting. They didn't want that responsibility. That's a fact. They had the same values as their husbands, one vote/one family. Go research it.
Age has nothing to do with being informed. Do some research. Get informed. It took a tremendous effort to get women interested in voting. It was not a rise up out of the streets organic movement that is portrayed in the state-sponsored *history* books. It was years of deliberate work.
You haven't studied "real history". Real historians study credible sources - and know those sources - and cite them liberally. You read "stuff"...remember only what supports your current mindset and then regurgitate it loosely and can't even remember where you heard/read it or likely got it from a third hand source. Do you ever read primary sources? Nahhhhh...do you know what a primary source is?
Like many single women, my credit applications were rejected even though I had an excellent employment record.
Among the places that turned me down were Sears and JCPenney. Neiman-Marcus did give me a card and I became a loyal customer. When the Equal Credit Opportunity Act was finally passed, both Sears and JCP sent me letters urging me to apply. I didn't.
The only place I could get a car loan was through my company's credit union.
I wanted to buy a house but it was futile to apply before about 1975-76. Even then, several people tried to discourage me. I bought my 1st home in December 1977.
Quote:
Forty years ago, any woman applying for a credit card could be asked a barrage of questions: Was she married? Did she plan to have children? Many banks required single, divorced or widowed women to bring a man along with them to cosign for a credit card, and some discounted the wages of women by as much as 50 percent when calculating their credit card limits.
What I have seen through decades as a teacher, though, leads me to believe strongly that children were better off when a woman's only "real" job was being a good wife and mother. Not to mention we got rocket science caliber teachers in our schools for "little woman mad money" pay. Not fair for individual woman, but better for society.
Women are part of society, 50%. Was slavery good for society? It was good for slaveholders.
I get your point, but with every action is an opposite and equal reaction. Women today certainly have a lot more "rights" than they did, and that is great. But some women, in my opinion, took that too far and wanted to be "equal" to men in every respect.
That's Not the discussion at hand though.
While that looks good on the surface, it also brought on some side effects that were not so good for women. I see men all the time come through the door with their lady coming in next. I could never let a lady follow me through a door, I would hold it for her and let her go in first. I work in the corporate world and very often have doors held and men wait for me to exit the elevator first.
I don't "expect" it but do appreciate it and say thank you. Conversely, I will often open the door for coworkers -male or female who are walking with or near me or have their hands full. It's basic civility.
Language is another issue. In the back room at work the other day, one of our guys was using the F word like he was saying hello. I called him on it and reminded him that there were a couple of ladies in the room. He said " Oh, they've heard worse !" See "civility" above.
And from my personal perspective, the biggest issue of women now able to have those jobs they always wanted is that we have created a whole generation of kids who never had the luxury of having mom home when they got in from school. Kids now have to fend for themselves, whereas we, from older generations, could always look forward to mom being there to give us a hug and ask how our day went.
Many children still have a SAH parent, many also have food on the table, health insurance and a mom who could leave and take them out of a violent household if needed.
With every good thing , something bad can happen too.
Please don't turn the thread like this. The topic is what it was like for women in the 40's, 50's 60's. It's not intended to be a men vs women and who has it worse thread.
I disagree that I am am "turning the thread like this." And women did "have it worse" in the said decades vis a vis what status men had legally and in society and behavior. There is no other way to say how "women had it bad" (although obviously not like Stone Age societies like Afghanistan) than putting it in context of the contrast between men and women.
As a male I was appalled to learn in my MBA Business Law class in 1980, that in some states women could not sign a legal document if their husband was in the same room. They were judged as being too weak to make a decision in the presence of their husbands.
Women were barred from many professions until WWII when there were not enough men left in the US to fill critical jobs. After the War women were once again forced out of these jobs!
Even today some women are content to be a silent servant which diminishes all the gains women have made toward equality (note; I said toward equality as it hasn't happened yet) and this complacency or timidity completely baffles me.
I do agree with Oldhag1 that having a dedicated parent heavily involved in the raising of children offers advantages to all of society. But it doesn't have to be a female parent, and it doesn't have to be a non-working parent. Just an involved, loving, and caring parent.
I was born in 1946. My life was sheltered, my mom taught school, and my dad had a “good job.” I married and had a family. It was not awful for me, but I do remember being frustrated because I did not have my own money.
Work life is where I encountered sexism but even that slowly changed. What I resent most in retrospect, I think, is the assumption that women should teach school or be nurses. We did not have role models for other careers, and it was assumed that our work woukd supplement our husband’s earnings, if we had to work. Of course, for single moms, this meant lower income.
In grad school, I noticed that male students got by with doing less work, and were deemed special. Meanwhile female students worked harder and did not tend to skate by.
Dress codes for women in the workplace were often onerous.
Giving birth meant going to a hospital where babies seemed to be mass produced. Even with rooming in, babies were often whisked away from the room. There was no support for breastfeeding, no instruction, and babies were given formula even though mom wanted to nurse. Younger children were prohibited from visiting mom as well. (I had children from 1973-1978. There were changes during that time.)
Doctors were usually male. My experiences have been so bad that I try hard to see only female docs now. Male docs did not look at me, often treated me badly, did not take my concerns seriously, were often brusque. They were lousy at explaining.
I dealt with some aggressive men in my youth. But, I was sheltered as a kid, and I did not have the terrible experiences some other women did. And I have not been treated badly in my life, for the most part. But I recognize poor treatment when I see it. I recognized poor treatment when I experienced it.
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