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US being majority Christians, is Christianity the reason for this massive loss of innocent lives? Or is it US spermacy and disregard for human lives? What is happening in Israel, is Judaism the cause or is it the current Govt. that is waging war? Is Hamas the cause of the attack on Israelis or is it Islam?
War criminals as individuals can be charged and prosecuted. What do we do with Christianity, Islam, and Judaism? If we were to ban these 3 religions, label them terrorist religions, would wars end and would innocent lives be saved?
With all the fighting between Jews and Muslims lately, I've come to hate both even more than I already did. I also came to appreciate Christianity more than I did(except evangelicals who are literally insane). I say this as someone who would generally be considered an atheist, and who thinks Christianity is an absurdity both theologically and practically. It is fundamentally an anti-Darwinian religion which is only good at subverting non-Abrahamic authority, breeding, and producing (willing) slaves.
Judaism created the first ethno-state/nation-state and was essentially the model for the most hateful nationalists of the 19th and 20th-centuries. Judaism is a supremacist religion which sees the entire world as its enemy, jealous and antagonistic toward all. Which wishes to either make slaves of all goyim or genocide them entirely.
Islam wants to conquer the world, to enslave all mankind. It is the most ruthless religion on the entire planet which even adopts polygamy as a means to maximize birthrates and to reward conquerors and other psychopaths. It is the most closely related to Darwinian principles of the three Abrahamic religions and it amazes me that it didn't completely conquer/subjugate Christianity. It was only by Christians ceasing to be Christians(centralizing authority, embracing materialism/colonialism/usury/exploitation/war/conquest) that saved them from destruction.
Yet, I consider Christianity by far the most superior ethically and morally. It just can't exist except as a corruption of itself, and only in countries where the rulers are never genuinely guided by Christian precepts(regardless of their pretenses).
With that said, as the utilitarian Darwinian that I am, I can't help but respect Islam, and to a lesser extent Judaism. While at the same time, looking upon Christianity with disgust. Those two psychopathic religions are simply superior to Christianity because they are human. Christianity is an abomination which will inevitably and rightfully end in oblivion.
I know you other atheists don't care to argue about the specifics of the three Abrahamic religions because you consider them all equally wrong and stupid. Which is fine, but remember, atheism is and will always be an evolutionary dead-end.
You appear to be all over the place.
I cannot comprehend why you malign Judaism so much. Their religion evolved from a polytheistic Canaanite religion. Their religion was created by them for them. They kept it within their tribe. To this day they do not proselytize which is something I admire. The Noachide laws are pretty much common sense in a CIVILIZED society. Judaism has evolved: from polytheism to monotheism, from polygamy to monogamy, etc. (BTW, the ratio of male to female births is about 1:1. So, there are few males left without a mate). The same cannot be said of Islam and Mormonism, for example. Judaism is a religion about DOING good things and not doing bad things. Judaism is about laws. It requires self discipline and study. At any rate, they DO NOT impose themselves onto non-Jews.
Christianity is the invention of a disagreeable, ill-tempered charlatan called Paul of Tarsus who wrote most of the New Testament. He tied into the Torah to appear legitimate. Christianity works off of fear. Constantine institutionalized Christianity. That’s why the religion spread so quickly.
Islam is plagiarized from the Torah and the NT. Islam is a retrograde religion. It works off of death. You either submit (that’s the real meaning of the word Islam) or you die. That’s not Darwinian. That’s barbaric. Muslims hate other Muslims. That’s why they lost Spain: infighting.
At the end of the day, all religions aim to control society. Once you have control you can exert POWER and all its trappings. Atheism is just the result of a lack of evidence of a supreme being. That’s all.
I cannot comprehend why you malign Judaism so much. Their religion evolved from a polytheistic Canaanite religion. Their religion was created by them for them.
Let me just say, I'm not religious, so I'm not exactly interested in religion itself. To me, religion is just politics. Its fundamental purpose is to "program" the masses with a worldview conducive to the interests of the "elites". Neither the existence of religion, nor its prevalence has anything to do with what is true. To put it simply, religion is either useful, or it isn't. Religion is either beneficial, or it isn't. Religion is either powerful, or it isn't. Powerful religions survive. Weak religions die.
My criticism of Judaism is fundamentally political. Basically, what are the political implications of Judaic belief? What are the political implications of Christian belief? What are the political implications of Islamic belief? Etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDnurse
1) Judaism is a religion about DOING good things and not doing bad things.
2) Judaism is about laws.
3) They DO NOT impose themselves onto non-Jews.
1) All religions teach people to do "good things" and not "bad things". The difference between each religion is the definition of good.
2) Yes, and laws require a state. Judaism isn't just a religion, it is the framework for a state.
3) Jews wouldn't even exist if they didn't invade Canaanite lands and genocide the people there. Abraham was a Babylonian. He was not a Canaanite.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDnurse
Christianity is the invention of a disagreeable, ill-tempered charlatan called Paul of Tarsus who wrote most of the New Testament. He tied into the Torah to appear legitimate. Christianity works off of fear. Constantine institutionalized Christianity. That’s why the religion spread so quickly.
Nice false history you got there.
1) Paul didn't invent Christianity, but he was instrumental in organizing the church and creating/standardizing church doctrine. Most of Paul's additions were "Epistles"(IE letters to the various churches within the Roman Empire).
2) Christianity was "spreading" long before Constantine converted. Moreover, Constantine only technically stopped the persecution of Christians. Theodosius made Christianity the state religion of Rome. But by then, Christians were already the majority of Rome's population.
Regardless, the question is, how does Judaism differ from Islam and Christianity?
For example, Judaism does not believe in heaven. How does a belief in heaven affect behavior? How does a concept like "The Chosen People" which identifies "Us" and "Them"(Goyim) affect behavior? Does the fact that Judaism creates different ethical standards for US and THEM affect behavior?
The truth is, both Judaism and Islam are supremacist religions. Christianity is not. Karl Marx gives a critique of both Judaism and Christianity in this essay. You should read it.
With all the fighting between Jews and Muslims lately, I've come to hate both even more than I already did. I also came to appreciate Christianity more than I did(except evangelicals who are literally insane). I say this as someone who would generally be considered an atheist, and who thinks Christianity is an absurdity both theologically and practically. It is fundamentally an anti-Darwinian religion which is only good at subverting non-Abrahamic authority, breeding, and producing (willing) slaves.
Judaism created the first ethno-state/nation-state and was essentially the model for the most hateful nationalists of the 19th and 20th-centuries. Judaism is a supremacist religion which sees the entire world as its enemy, jealous and antagonistic toward all. Which wishes to either make slaves of all goyim or genocide them entirely.
Islam wants to conquer the world, to enslave all mankind. It is the most ruthless religion on the entire planet which even adopts polygamy as a means to maximize birthrates and to reward conquerors and other psychopaths. It is the most closely related to Darwinian principles of the three Abrahamic religions and it amazes me that it didn't completely conquer/subjugate Christianity. It was only by Christians ceasing to be Christians(centralizing authority, embracing materialism/colonialism/usury/exploitation/war/conquest) that saved them from destruction.
Yet, I consider Christianity by far the most superior ethically and morally. It just can't exist except as a corruption of itself, and only in countries where the rulers are never genuinely guided by Christian precepts(regardless of their pretenses).
With that said, as the utilitarian Darwinian that I am, I can't help but respect Islam, and to a lesser extent Judaism. While at the same time, looking upon Christianity with disgust. Those two psychopathic religions are simply superior to Christianity because they are human. Christianity is an abomination which will inevitably and rightfully end in oblivion.
I know you other atheists don't care to argue about the specifics of the three Abrahamic religions because you consider them all equally wrong and stupid. Which is fine, but remember, atheism is and will always be an evolutionary dead-end.
Hmmmm
Whether they are the ones who believe (in the Arabian Prophet), or whether they are Jews, Christians or Sabians – all who believe in God and the Last Day, and do righteous deeds – their reward is surely secure with their Lord; they need have no fear, nor shall they grieve. Quran 2:62
I cannot comprehend why you malign Judaism so much. Their religion evolved from a polytheistic Canaanite religion. Their religion was created by them for them. They kept it within their tribe. To this day they do not proselytize which is something I admire. The Noachide laws are pretty much common sense in a CIVILIZED society. Judaism has evolved: from polytheism to monotheism, from polygamy to monogamy, etc. (BTW, the ratio of male to female births is about 1:1. So, there are few males left without a mate). The same cannot be said of Islam and Mormonism, for example. Judaism is a religion about DOING good things and not doing bad things. Judaism is about laws. It requires self discipline and study. At any rate, they DO NOT impose themselves onto non-Jews.
There are millions of God fearing and peaceful Jews.
And then their are vicious Zionists who believe that they will have a light tap on the wrist by God in the hereafter for all the cruelty, injustice and evil to the core things they have done to others in this life.
And this so called “punishment” will be actually about a 1 year worth of REHAB process where God will re-educate their souls, and then send them to paradise.
There will be another smaller group of who will be “permanently disconnected” from God (not sure exactly what it means) as their punishment - BUT - there is no hellfire for them regardless of whatever evil things they have done.
IMO, this group of zionists has caused a lot of injustice, damage and unrest in the world and it has given a bad name to Judaism faith. It’s no different than extreme evangelical Christians or Talibans or Hindu RSS people or the Buddhist army of Myanmar after what they did to Rohingya Muslim communities.
(This is to give an example that every religious group has its crazy extremists and I am not going towards any political debate)
So, the Zionist have earned hate and remorse and disapproval from all over the world but unfortunately that has given a bad name to the entire religion of Judaism - which is wrong and I condemn it.
Quote:
Christianity is the invention of a disagreeable, ill-tempered charlatan called Paul of Tarsus who wrote most of the New Testament. He tied into the Torah to appear legitimate. Christianity works off of fear. Constantine institutionalized Christianity. That’s why the religion spread so quickly.
There is definitely some truth to that.
There are 100 and millions of Christians today who are peaceful and loving people but the “theology of Christianity” was pushed off the rails by Paul and Constantine - and hence, IMO, it seems to be failing the test of time because that’s what happens to lies and fabricated stuff.
Quote:
Islam is plagiarized from the Torah and the NT. Islam is a retrograde religion. It works off of death. You either submit (that’s the real meaning of the word Islam) or you die. That’s not Darwinian. That’s barbaric. Muslims hate other Muslims. That’s why they lost Spain: infighting.
You seem to have shot off the hip here. But a use of basic common sense pretty much trumps your point.
If it’s “submit or die”, then how come millions of Christians are living peacefully for CENTURIES in the predominantly “Muslim” countries?
I personally went to a CHRISTIAN school in a MUSLIM country. There was a church in our school - during the religious class, the Christian kids would go to the church to take their class and we Muslim kids attended the Islamic class. There was no barrier on any kid to attend any class they wanted. I attended many classes with my Christian friends in those childhood years. We played in the church and Christian kids would eat with us in a mosque.
40 years fast forward, I took my kids to my childhood school - the church is still there and the mosque is still there and school is active as it was before.
Modem day politics that runs on hate. and religious based emotional attachment has played some role - but - your point that Muslims want to conquer the world - and Islam is based on “submit or die” is absolutely totally wrong and a lie that you must have picked up from media brain washing.
Even today 100 and thousands of Christians live peacefully in Iraq, Egypt, Lebanon. Indonesia, Malaysia and many other countries.
Let me just say, I'm not religious, so I'm not exactly interested in religion itself. To me, religion is just politics. Its fundamental purpose is to "program" the masses with a worldview conducive to the interests of the "elites". Neither the existence of religion, nor its prevalence has anything to do with what is true. To put it simply, religion is either useful, or it isn't. Religion is either beneficial, or it isn't. Religion is either powerful, or it isn't. Powerful religions survive. Weak religions die.
My criticism of Judaism is fundamentally political. Basically, what are the political implications of Judaic belief? What are the political implications of Christian belief? What are the political implications of Islamic belief? Etc.
1) All religions teach people to do "good things" and not "bad things". The difference between each religion is the definition of good.
2) Yes, and laws require a state. Judaism isn't just a religion, it is the framework for a state.
3) Jews wouldn't even exist if they didn't invade Canaanite lands and genocide the people there. Abraham was a Babylonian. He was not a Canaanite.
Nice false history you got there.
1) Paul didn't invent Christianity, but he was instrumental in organizing the church and creating/standardizing church doctrine. Most of Paul's additions were "Epistles"(IE letters to the various churches within the Roman Empire).
2) Christianity was "spreading" long before Constantine converted. Moreover, Constantine only technically stopped the persecution of Christians. Theodosius made Christianity the state religion of Rome. But by then, Christians were already the majority of Rome's population.
Regardless, the question is, how does Judaism differ from Islam and Christianity?
For example, Judaism does not believe in heaven. How does a belief in heaven affect behavior? How does a concept like "The Chosen People" which identifies "Us" and "Them"(Goyim) affect behavior? Does the fact that Judaism creates different ethical standards for US and THEM affect behavior?
The truth is, both Judaism and Islam are supremacist religions. Christianity is not. Karl Marx gives a critique of both Judaism and Christianity in this essay. You should read it.
Your concept of "The Chosen People" is off the mark if you believe that Jews place themselves above Gentiles. Being "chosen" means that the Jews have a covenant with G-d to remind the world of a moral code, thus helping to elevate humanity and perfect the world (my words, not scripture). It is a responsibility, not a benefit, and has led to persecution and death over the centuries from those who do not understand Judaism and never wished to.
I cannot comprehend why you malign Judaism so much. Their religion evolved from a polytheistic Canaanite religion. Their religion was created by them for them. They kept it within their tribe. To this day they do not proselytize which is something I admire. The Noachide laws are pretty much common sense in a CIVILIZED society. Judaism has evolved: from polytheism to monotheism, from polygamy to monogamy, etc. (BTW, the ratio of male to female births is about 1:1. So, there are few males left without a mate). The same cannot be said of Islam and Mormonism, for example. Judaism is a religion about DOING good things and not doing bad things. Judaism is about laws. It requires self discipline and study. At any rate, they DO NOT impose themselves onto non-Jews.
Not sure what you're getting at regarding Mormonism. Would you mind explaining?
And Jewish people have posted here. Please feel free to enlighten anyone. That is why the thread has been left open, as indicated.
It gets exhausting! Since this thread has drifted into the topic of "antisemitism", I will comment. I have posted a number of times about my parents' experiences in concentration camps and the huge loss of family. It's upsetting to post about. And someone says antisemitism doesn't exist?! It still exists. I have heard a lot of ignorant comments in my lifetime, been refused an apartment rental as a student. Someone tells me their family is in Palestine or Lebanon and says that "my people" did this or that, while they are cutting my hair or our kids are playing in the neighborhood, or at a neighborhood picnic.
Ugly comments overheard at work in a helping field about Jew this or that. Assumptions that I must be wealthy because I speak nicely and because I'm Jewish so my parents must have been rich! They were refugees who worked very hard to attain middle class from nothing. I grew up in a blue collar community with all kinds of people. There are many, many people like me! So sick of the ignorance. And yes, I do know about the seeds of the ignorance as I read a lot and talk to people.
How much enlightenment do people need? You know it doesn't really seem to make any difference. People believe what they wish to, what they seem to need to believe. And some don't seem to know themselves very well, while their true nature is quite apparent to others, revealed through their words.
Your concept of "The Chosen People" is off the mark if you believe that Jews place themselves above Gentiles. Being "chosen" means that the Jews have a covenant with G-d to remind the world of a moral code, thus helping to elevate humanity and perfect the world (my words, not scripture). It is a responsibility, not a benefit, and has led to persecution and death over the centuries from those who do not understand Judaism and never wished to.
Do you know anything about Judaism at all? Do you have any idea why Jews are hated by literally everyone(except evangelicals)? Do you think it's because Jews are moral leaders who treat non-Jews well? Rofl.
You know, the Jews that spit on Christians and lived off usury for 2,000 years.
Just wondering, how much of the Talmud have you read?
It gets exhausting! Since this thread has drifted into the topic of "antisemitism", I will comment. I have posted a number of times about my parents' experiences in concentration camps and the huge loss of family. It's upsetting to post about. And someone says antisemitism doesn't exist?! It still exists. I have heard a lot of ignorant comments in my lifetime, been refused an apartment rental as a student. Someone tells me their family is in Palestine or Lebanon and says that "my people" did this or that, while they are cutting my hair or our kids are playing in the neighborhood, or at a neighborhood picnic.
Ugly comments overheard at work in a helping field about Jew this or that. Assumptions that I must be wealthy because I speak nicely and because I'm Jewish so my parents must have been rich! They were refugees who worked very hard to attain middle class from nothing. I grew up in a blue collar community with all kinds of people. There are many, many people like me! So sick of the ignorance. And yes, I do know about the seeds of the ignorance as I read a lot and talk to people.
How much enlightenment do people need? You know it doesn't really seem to make any difference. People believe what they wish to, what they seem to need to believe. And some don't seem to know themselves very well, while their true nature is quite apparent to others, revealed through their words.
I hear you. Sometimes you can tell people things over and over and when you are finished, they still look at you and repeat the same wrongful belief they were carrying in the first place.
While I was not raised to be anti-semitic, because I was brought up in a Christian home I had a lot of wrong information about the Jewish religion.
About 20 years ago, I found myself in a discussion with two Jewish women, one Conservative, one Orthodox, on a message board similar to this on AOL. I learned a lot from them, and I am grateful that they bothered to provide me with information and knowledge.
Seven years ago I took a job in Boro Park, Brooklyn, in a company owned by Satmar Chasidic Jews. Again, the women I worked with were friendly and taught me about their rules for dress and holiday foods, etc.
Now I work for a Muslim-owned firm.
For 20 years, I worked at the World Trade Center with people of every nationality and religion you can think of, and we all ran for our lives together that day. And came back to rebuild together, too. So, that's my theme song. We CAN get along. I've seen it in action.
Those of us who are WTC survivors are probably less inclined to hate Muslims, since we saw our Muslim coworkers experience what we did and then get a knock on the door from the FBI on the days following because they were engineers who worked at the World Trade Center
I am not naive. There are those who will always strive to live the Us vs. THEM life. Some of those people are related to me. But I will just keep plugging along, because one at a time, people can learn.
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