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Doesn't make a hell of a lot of sense, tree. How does one comment on a post they aren't even aware of its contents?
In this case the subject suggests *I* (tree), might possibly get in trouble for engaging (doesn't take much, ya know ), so I asked if a comparison was being made. Too much back & forth automatically looks like arguing to certain people, no matter the substance of the convo.
That goes back to the question I asked earlier: should Christian just ignore Mark 16:15?
I believe the uber-righteous interpret everything in the Bible as speaking directly to them. I busted out one of them with that scripture asking them if they were in that room. It's incredibly presumptuous of anyone to lay claim to the brand True Christain. That's God's call.
I was brought up in one of these sects. Anyone who didn't act like a know-it-a-hole was labeled a "watered-down Christain". They used the scripture of neither being cold nor hot and spitting out to justify such extremist attitudes.
That only represents about 30% of Christianity from what I can tell. What they called watered down were people walking it instead of talking it. Many Christians also believe Christ is the way God comes to them but comes to people in other forms.
Your discussions will go sideways fast if you don't get further background on who you're talking to than the heading of Christain.
Damned simply means facing negative consequences. Our ancestors believed that all negative consequences were from the wrath of God. We know better. Any negative spiritual consequences will be the result of what we BECOME as Spirits, not a punishment from a displeased God. God sent Jesus so we would know He was NEVER displeased with us but that we still needed to avoid any negative spiritual consequences by believing Jesus and following His instructions to love God and each other every day and repent when we fail.
Baptism is a commitment to follow Jesus's instruction, that's all. It is not some magic ritual that imparts some supernatural nonsense. The Good News is that because Jesus became one of us, humanity is saved from permanent separation from God! His birth as a human is the "Good tidings of Great Joy to all people." The angels appeared at His birth, NOT His crucifixion! That God came in the flesh is the actual Gospel that we are to spread. But our fearful and indoctrinated ancestors simply did not believe that God IS AGAPE LOVE as Jesus represented Him, so they interpreted what happened to Jesus according to their wrathful and vengeful God who needed to be appeased by blood sacrifices. The rest is history!
It's fine that you believe all this sincerely, Mystic. That's what these threads are for: a forum to express your own individual beliefs of how the Bible should be believed. None of what you say however changes the fact that every person has their own belief on consequences for refusing Jesus. The RCC taught tens of billions of people for 2000 years that refusing Jesus was a sentence of eternal torture in the fires of hell and that's what they lived their lives believing and died believing. Does God take responsibility for allowing such damnable beliefs to flourish? He could have stepped in any number of ways to stop this heresy but as I've said a number of times he simply didn't care enough about us to intervene, and so the belief perpetuated.
As I told Mink, it's not important what the correct interpretation of the words in the Bible are. There are no correct interpretations. You believe "damnation" is correction. Person x believes "damnation" is destruction". Person Y believes "damnation" is eternal torture in fire. Person Z believes "damnation" is temporary torture in fire. Person A believes damnation" is eternal torture in frigid -300F ice. And on and on. Which of you is correct? Who's to know? As Paul Simon says in his classic song, "Slip Slidin' Away"
"And God only knows, and God makes his plan. The information is unavailable to the mortal man."
In one respect that is the beauty of holy books like the Bible: there is no correct interpretation. The correct interpretation is whatever makes the most sense to you. So Ray Comfort is busy trying to foist his beliefs of what eternal damnation is on people who for the most part couldn't care less or believe something different from him. But a lot of people fall under his sway and then they turn into little apostles for Ray Comfort, going around and spreading his poison after falling victim to it.
Freedom, yes. Moral right, no. How would you like it if you were on the beach enjoying the day with your sweetheart or friends and some Christian idiot came up to you uninvited and started asking you if you knew if you were saved from going to hell and do you know Jesus as your personal savior? Ray knows he is an obnoxious jerk but he doesn't care. He's a man on a mission to get people to come to Jesus whether they want to or not. How Ray got this way mentally and psychologically could probably fill a psychiatrist's file cabinet but he is what he is and he's not going to change.
But the important thing to recognize is that Ray is operating exactly the way a virus does: he infects someone morally the way a virus infects someone physically and that infected person then goes on to infect other people with Christianity's pernicious message that you need Jesus to be saved from hell the way a virus infects other cells which then infect other people with the disease the virus causes. There's no difference in mechanism between the two.
I'm in agreement with you. I was responding to Thoreau424.
In this case the subject suggests *I* (tree), might possibly get in trouble for engaging (doesn't take much, ya know ), so I asked if a comparison was being made. Too much back & forth automatically looks like arguing to certain people, no matter the substance of the convo.
Come on, that's a cop-out. People in here say horrible things to me, calling me all sorts of names and get away with it. I don't see what Thoreau says because I have him on ignore but I can imagine what he thinks of me. You're free to express your opinions of what I have to say as long as you don't use profanity. The mods won't allow that, true. But first you have to read the damn post.
If it drives people like you nuts - willingly - then they're doing a service, pushing all your buttons. Hey, if I lived around you, I'd join in just to see you go bonkers out in public, with you screaming and foaming at the mouth. You're your own worst enemy.
It actually doesn't. I'm not sure how you took that from my post. While I would find somebody like that to be completely obnoxious, I definitely wouldn't be going bonkers about it.
Your post strongly implies that you're actually the type who'd be screaming and foaming at the mouth. Your response to me is inaccurate and honestly a bit ridiculous.
It actually doesn't. I'm not sure how you took that from my post. While I would find somebody like that to be completely obnoxious, I definitely wouldn't be going bonkers about it.
Your post strongly implies that you're actually the type who'd be screaming and foaming at the mouth. Your response to me is inaccurate and honestly a bit ridiculous.
Well, I'm glad you recognize that about Thoreau. Formerly, I have never addressed him except in response to the insane insults he travels all the way from the Christianity forum to throw at me in here, acting like a crazyman foaming at the mouth like you said--taking everything I say so personally like I'm going out of my way to insult him. I got weary of him. He was like gum stuck to the bottom of my shoe so I just put him on ignore and things are a lot quieter.
We're not in ancient time however. Most Jews today are atheist anyway.
More importantly, Jews don’t proselytize to anyone except their own. Jews didn’t try to spread their religion by force beyond their very early days, perhaps realizing that quality >>> quantity. Of course, the inherent downside is that Jews soon became eclipsed by Christianity. As far as Judaism is concerned, that’s no problem in and of itself. The far bigger issue is the chauvinistic hegemony that came with Christian power to the detriment of competing faiths—especially Judaism.
If Ray Comfort harassed me and my friends, I’d probably just troll him. I wouldn’t yell or scream or anything. I’m far too smart and subtle for that.
I’m fortunate enough to have never encountered anyone that overbearing, though. To the extent I’ve had conversations with Christian proselytizers, it’s been because I chose to engage them (whether out of boredom or curiosity), and because the interaction is on my terms, I strive to be respectful and have never had anyone try to take advantage of my kindness. Over the years, I’ve had some interesting chats with Seventh Day Adventists, Eastern Orthodox, Roman Catholics, Evangelical Protestants, Mormons, and Jehovah’s Witnesses, just to name a few.
More importantly, Jews don’t proselytize to anyone except their own. Jews didn’t try to spread their religion by force beyond their very early days, perhaps realizing that quality >>> quantity. Of course, the inherent downside is that Jews soon became eclipsed by Christianity. As far as Judaism is concerned, that’s no problem in and of itself. The far bigger issue is the chauvinistic hegemony that came with Christian power to the detriment of competing faiths—especially Judaism.
If Ray Comfort harassed me and my friends, I’d probably just troll him. I wouldn’t yell or scream or anything. I’m far too smart and subtle for that.
I’m fortunate enough to have never encountered anyone that overbearing, though. To the extent I’ve had conversations with Christian proselytizers, it’s been because I chose to engage them (whether out of boredom or curiosity), and because the interaction is on my terms, I strive to be respectful and have never had anyone try to take advantage of my kindness. Over the years, I’ve had some interesting chats with Seventh Day Adventists, Eastern Orthodox, Roman Catholics, Evangelical Protestants, Mormons, and Jehovah’s Witnesses, just to name a few.
Christians' overbearing-ness come in different degrees. Jesus tells everyone to go out and do what Ray Comfort does and preach the gospel to every living creature. Lots of Christians don't preach to a rock--they're too inhibited. Others make Ray Comfort look like a shy little schoolgirl. There are as many flavors of Christianity out there as there are Christians. That's what makes Christianity so interesting, and laughable, and entertaining. And dangerous.
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), so I asked if a comparison was being made. Too much back & forth automatically looks like arguing to certain people, no matter the substance of the convo.
